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View Poll Results: Grade the movie...
A+ 28 11.16%
A 53 21.12%
A- 46 18.33%
B+ 25 9.96%
B 27 10.76%
B- 11 4.38%
C+ 13 5.18%
C 12 4.78%
C- 9 3.59%
D+ 8 3.19%
D 10 3.98%
D- 5 1.99%
F 4 1.59%
Voters: 251. You may not vote on this poll

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Old June 14 2013, 07:18 PM   #91
Lapis Exilis
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

The limitations of RT's rating system have been much commented upon so it's frequently not the best gauge. But the criticisms I've read so far sound pretty standard for a Zack Snyder film and were why I was worried about him directing Superman - it felt like a mismatch of director and material. Snyder tends towards the morosely bombastic (or is that the bombastically morose?)

That said, the reviews do really sound like people are a tad confused by their expectations and how the movie subverts them. It makes me wonder if this isn't why Superman is such a difficult property to manage on screen. Everyone can say that it's hard to do a Superman movie because he's too good and pure of character with no shades of grey to make him interesting but that always struck me as pure bunk. There's plenty of elemental conflict in the concept of Superman. But I think Superman, these days anyway, may work better in niche interpretations and where people get into trouble is trying to do a version that has broad appeal. I mean, he's a core heroic American character and his heyday was when there was a monoculture he could play to. That is long gone, and while you'd think a postmodern America would embrace a postmodern Superman, there's enough nostalgia at our core for the myth of the grand American ideal that we still want Superman to scratch that itch. Unfortunately, we've all pretty much got different itches for him to scratch and still expect him to be able to be universal - so he kinda can't win.

Which is by way of saying, I do think movie critics may be (haven't seen the movie, so how would I really know?) expecting too much.

Personally I love to see someone go soemwhere unexpected with an iconic character like Superman, so I'm mostly even more intrigued by what's emerging from early viewers. It may not be great, but at least it's taking a risk.
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Old June 14 2013, 07:20 PM   #92
Phily B
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

I think the reviews are pretty spot on from what I've read, style over substance and impressive fight scenes which make the movie watchable. The rest was complete pap.
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Old June 14 2013, 07:24 PM   #93
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

I enjoyed it. The hand held camera style in the first few minutes looks like they had problems with the dolly but it eventually fades from notice.

The cast is perfect. The story works. I had no problems with the film.
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Old June 14 2013, 07:26 PM   #94
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Phily B wrote: View Post
I think the reviews are pretty spot on from what I've read, style over substance and impressive fight scenes which make the movie watchable. The rest was complete pap.
Ah.

A superhero movie.
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Old June 14 2013, 07:30 PM   #95
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

davejames wrote: View Post
Hmm, from what I'm hearing, the 2D is probably the best version to see with this. Apparently the shaky hand-held style doesn't translate as well to 3D as it does with other movies.

Although I'd be curious to hear what others thought who saw it in 3D.
Saw it in 3D, didn't notice any problems.
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Old June 14 2013, 07:38 PM   #96
Phily B
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Admiral Buzzkill wrote: View Post
Phily B wrote: View Post
I think the reviews are pretty spot on from what I've read, style over substance and impressive fight scenes which make the movie watchable. The rest was complete pap.
Ah.

A superhero movie.
Pretty much, it doesn't really have that factor which elevates though like Iron Man or Batman. It's just action schlock, Batman Begins wasn't a great movie because Batman beat up Liam Neeson and some thugs, it was a tiny part of the movie. It was a great new origin story we hadn't seen on film, beautifully crafted and shot, while being a deep focus on the character and motivation of Bruce Wayne.

This movie just seems to rely entirely on the action scenes, apart from that, the only scene I really connected with emotionally was the scenes with his Mom when he returns home. Pa Kent was kinda a dick and a dumbass. Just very disappointed overall, and I went in with no expectations.
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Old June 14 2013, 07:44 PM   #97
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

This strikes me as a thoughtful, well-written and unequivocally negative review of the film:

Grim, Violent Man of Steel Sells Superman’s Soul for Spectacle

And the overwhelming impression I get from Man of Steel, the latest cinematic reboot of Superman’s origin story that opens in theaters tomorrow, is that someone, somewhere along the line, thought that the core concept of Superman needed to be souped up: made edgier, darker, grittier, more violent, more explosive. Every change in Man of Steel serves that end rather than the story, or even a plausible reboot of the character and continuity.

I’m not saying that superheroes—however iconic—are inviolate, or that it’s never worth shaking up an established character’s defining traits, but when you’re rebooting a character as thoroughly embedded in cultural myth and collective consciousness as Superman, the ends have to justify the means.

That’s the question Man of Steel demands: What do its changes to the character of Superman give us that was missing before? What value does this add?

Not much, as it turns out.
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Old June 14 2013, 08:59 PM   #98
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

SPOILERS, OF COURSE:

I actually enjoyed the intent behind Cavill's Superman - his struggle to find his place in the world gives his nearly-invincible physical nature a vulnerable emotional one. And the brushstrokes of character that touched on that were some of the film's best parts. It was likewise good to see the awesome results of two (or three) god-like entities battling it out. But overall the emphasis skews way too much toward the action for the rest characters to gain a whole lot of traction or for the film to really connect on an emotional level (an exception: the scenes with Clark's father).

Even all that is excusable because, for the most part, the film is simply gorgeous to look at and its 'splosions are lot of fun. With one exception. The mass slaughter inside Metropolis (and presumably in the South Indian Ocean) goes wholly unacknowledged by ... well, by anyone, really. People are upset at how Superman defeats Zod ... but I think Superman's lack of awareness about the collateral damage of the conflict is what really undercuts his character and the film because the whole film was about him choosing to save people. Even a throwaway line or an attempt to get Zod and the Henchwoman to engage him in, say, the fields of Kansas, rather than in a town square would have made a big difference. Sure, he kills Zod to save a family - but what of all the other victims?

I still liked the film, enjoyed Cavill's performance, and will plan on seeing it again. I think I'll hold off on a final grade until I do.
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Old June 14 2013, 09:03 PM   #99
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion



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Old June 14 2013, 09:03 PM   #100
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

I thought that was what they went for with the traveling the world, but it was done so poorly, it was just him dicking around and then he accidentally overhears soldiers talking about that spaceship. I really never felt anything for him or relatable, especially emotionally. Like I said, the closet it got was the scenes where he comes back home after finding his origin.
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Old June 14 2013, 09:04 PM   #101
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Mach5 wrote: View Post
And not at all remarkably, that score is having no effect on the film's success whatever.

Sources tell BoxOffice that Man of Steel is on pace for at least $45 million on Friday. The final Friday figure will likely end up closer to $50 million, which means that Man of Steel's first weekend in North America could bring in $120 million or more.

WB clearly decided to hinder expectations by saying that the film would end up in the $90 million range this weekend. The recent announcement that a sequel is already moving forward shows that they knew they had a massive film on their hands. The global potential of Man of Steel is massive. Keep in mind that the much-maligned Superman Returns made nearly $400 million globally back in 2006. A true crowd-pleaser like Man of Steel could end up doubling that sum.

Man of Steel may become of the biggest examples of a critic-proof film in quite some time. The superhero flick currently has a mediocre 58% approval rating on RottenTomatoes.com. Audiences around the country are clearly shrugging off the critical consensus.
Ba-Da-Boom!
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Old June 14 2013, 09:15 PM   #102
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Admiral Buzzkill wrote: View Post

And not at all remarkably, that score is having no effect on the film's success whatever.


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Old June 14 2013, 09:16 PM   #103
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

I take it Mach5 doesn't like the film and is happy about the low rating?
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Old June 14 2013, 09:24 PM   #104
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
I take it Mach5 doesn't like the film and is happy about the low rating?
no
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Old June 14 2013, 09:32 PM   #105
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Phily B wrote: View Post

Pretty much, it doesn't really have that factor which elevates though like Iron Man or Batman. It's just action schlock, Batman Begins wasn't a great movie because Batman beat up Liam Neeson and some thugs, it was a tiny part of the movie. It was a great new origin story we hadn't seen on film, beautifully crafted and shot, while being a deep focus on the character and motivation of Bruce Wayne.

This movie just seems to rely entirely on the action scenes, apart from that, the only scene I really connected with emotionally was the scenes with his Mom when he returns home. Pa Kent was kinda a dick and a dumbass. Just very disappointed overall, and I went in with no expectations.
It still sounds like something I will enjoy. I am all for mindless action and escapism in movies.

I am going to say something that may shock people. I think the whole "Character development and Character motivation" in films is overrated.

As a mental health therapist many times people act in ways without knowing or showing their motivation. A lot of times people do not change a lot (a lot of therapy is dealing with acceptance of the self as they are). I digress. So I do not look at movies always looking for Character development or motivation. If a movie has it, fine, but it is not essential to my enjoyment of a movie.
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