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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old June 11 2013, 02:38 PM   #1981
CommishSleer
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

TUC contradicts STV and a lot of TOS where the stories involving Klingons often showed that Kirk was merciful or discovered he was being hypocritical.
In Friday's child the entire command crew was querying Kirk's conviction of Klingon's guilt without evidence. In STV the crew were drinking and carousing with the Klingons.
Then suddenly in TUC they're a bunch of racists.
Despite all this I really liked TUC - my 3rd favourite Star Trek movie.
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Old June 11 2013, 03:07 PM   #1982
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

BillJ wrote: View Post
Blackhorse47 wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
the entire plotline directly contradicts "Yesterday's Enterprise" etc. etc.
As a matter of interest, how? All I can remember of the stuff that happened in the real world is that Enterprise-C tried to help a Klingon outpost, which doesn't sound as if it contradicts anything that happens in TUC.
They didn't snap their fingers and peace was achieved at Khitomer. It was likely a long process with lots of successes and failures and took decades. Khitomer was just the first step.
The Klingons go from losing the ability to make war and being forced to sue for peace in VI, to having a war fleet that's dominating the Federation in YE. There's also talk of plans to evacuate Kronos in VI, but then the planet is somehow just fine in TNG.
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Old June 11 2013, 03:14 PM   #1983
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
Blackhorse47 wrote: View Post

As a matter of interest, how? All I can remember of the stuff that happened in the real world is that Enterprise-C tried to help a Klingon outpost, which doesn't sound as if it contradicts anything that happens in TUC.
They didn't snap their fingers and peace was achieved at Khitomer. It was likely a long process with lots of successes and failures and took decades. Khitomer was just the first step.
The Klingons go from losing the ability to make war and being forced to sue for peace in VI, to having a war fleet that's dominating the Federation in YE. There's also talk of plans to evacuate Kronos in VI, but then the planet is somehow just fine in TNG.
Over a fifty year period? Sure. The Klingons likely weren't going to give up their home without attempting to solve the problem. Why would they give up their military? Starfleet sure didn't give up theirs in the intervening years.

There's nothing regarding the Klingons in The Undiscovered Country that can't be easily explained. Plus, I never understood disliking a piece of entertainment because it conflicts with another piece of entertainment.
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Old June 11 2013, 03:26 PM   #1984
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
The Klingons go from losing the ability to make war and being forced to sue for peace in VI, to having a war fleet that's dominating the Federation in YE. There's also talk of plans to evacuate Kronos in VI, but then the planet is somehow just fine in TNG.
I seem to remember Starfleet rebuilding the fleet in about 18 months after the Borg atacks, so I'm sure the Klingons can do better!
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Old June 11 2013, 03:27 PM   #1985
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

There's nothing like a long period of peace for fixing one's war machine!
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Old June 11 2013, 03:33 PM   #1986
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
Blackhorse47 wrote: View Post

As a matter of interest, how? All I can remember of the stuff that happened in the real world is that Enterprise-C tried to help a Klingon outpost, which doesn't sound as if it contradicts anything that happens in TUC.
They didn't snap their fingers and peace was achieved at Khitomer. It was likely a long process with lots of successes and failures and took decades. Khitomer was just the first step.
The Klingons go from losing the ability to make war and being forced to sue for peace in VI, to having a war fleet that's dominating the Federation in YE. There's also talk of plans to evacuate Kronos in VI, but then the planet is somehow just fine in TNG.
Two possibilites come to mind.

1.>They were able to fix the problem that was affecting Qo'nos.

2.>They relocated to another planet as planned and simply renamed it Qo'nos.
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Old June 11 2013, 03:35 PM   #1987
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

And lets be honest, the peace between the Federation and Klingons always seemed like it was on the verge of falling apart. It seemed like the Klingons were threatening to ditch the treaty every other week towards the end of TNG/DS9.
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Old June 11 2013, 03:51 PM   #1988
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

BillJ wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
They didn't snap their fingers and peace was achieved at Khitomer. It was likely a long process with lots of successes and failures and took decades. Khitomer was just the first step.
The Klingons go from losing the ability to make war and being forced to sue for peace in VI, to having a war fleet that's dominating the Federation in YE. There's also talk of plans to evacuate Kronos in VI, but then the planet is somehow just fine in TNG.
Over a fifty year period?
Hell, that precise timeline is even explicitly referenced within the dialogue of the film itself:

Federation President Red Foreman:
"Suppose the following agenda is as follows: the total evacuation of Kronos has been calculated within the fifty earth year time span. Phase I - the preparation for evacuation..."


You know what's a good excuse for building lots of ships? Evacuating an entire planet. You know what's a good excuse for needing extra firepower? Evacuating an entire planet of vulnerable people. You know who would be out of work and in need of government work programs like building a fleet of new ships? The evacuees of an entire planet. There's nothing inconsistent between TUC and Yesterday's Enterprise. The Klingons always had itchy trigger fingers, even toward their Federation allies, as can be seen in the episode with Riker as an exchange officer on a Klingon ship and in The Way of the Warrior.

Plus, I seem to remember many people thinking that the Great War would be the war to end all wars due to the utter devastation, financial burden, death toll, and treaties/restrictions/reparations wrought or placed upon many of the participants, and yet twenty years later the Great War became WWI because they were back at it again.
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Old June 11 2013, 03:58 PM   #1989
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
The Klingons go from losing the ability to make war and being forced to sue for peace in VI, to having a war fleet that's dominating the Federation in YE. There's also talk of plans to evacuate Kronos in VI, but then the planet is somehow just fine in TNG.
Over a fifty year period?
Hell, that precise timeline is even explicitly referenced within the dialogue of the film itself:

Federation President Red Foreman:
"Suppose the following agenda is as follows: the total evacuation of Kronos has been calculated within the fifty earth year time span. Phase I - the preparation for evacuation..."

Plus, I seem to remember many people thinking that the Great War would be the war to end all wars due to the utter devastation, financial burden, death toll, and treaties/restrictions/reparations wrought or placed upon many of the participants, and yet twenty years later the Great War became WWI because they were back at it again.
It's Red Forman, not Foreman. Dumbass. (Sorry, had to.)
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Old June 11 2013, 04:03 PM   #1990
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

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Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
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Old June 11 2013, 04:05 PM   #1991
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
The Klingons go from losing the ability to make war and being forced to sue for peace in VI, to having a war fleet that's dominating the Federation in YE. There's also talk of plans to evacuate Kronos in VI, but then the planet is somehow just fine in TNG.
I don't suppose the 80 year difference had anything to do with it?
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Old June 11 2013, 04:21 PM   #1992
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

BoxOffice Mojo is reporting that STID grossed $ 199,866,194 domestic. On Monday, I read something like STID crossed the $200M ($200.140 M). Did I read wrong?
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Old June 11 2013, 04:30 PM   #1993
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

ralph wrote: View Post
BoxOffice Mojo is reporting that STID grossed $ 199,866,194 domestic. On sunday, I read something like STID crossed the $200M ($200.140 M). Did I read wrong?
The weekend actual was adjusted slightly down, hence the change.


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Old June 11 2013, 04:47 PM   #1994
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

Admiral Buzzkill wrote: View Post
ST 6 is a pretty sucky movie - a cheap-looking, clumsy flick that tries to sustain itself on a badly constructed mystery plot that doesn't work.
Funny, I think 6 is the best looking out of all of them. Easily the best set designs and most "real" looking ships. The only thing that doesn't look good IMO is the floating CGI Klingon blood.
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Old June 11 2013, 04:53 PM   #1995
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Re: STID "tracking" for $85-90 million opening [U.S. box office]

johnjm22 wrote: View Post
Admiral Buzzkill wrote: View Post
ST 6 is a pretty sucky movie - a cheap-looking, clumsy flick that tries to sustain itself on a badly constructed mystery plot that doesn't work.
Funny, I think 6 is the best looking out of all of them. Easily the best set designs and most "real" looking ships. The only thing that doesn't look good IMO is the floating CGI Klingon blood.
I love The Undiscovered Country.

But...

Many of the sets do look cheap and in the end battle the lighting of the Enterprise and Excelsior looks really off making them look "plasticky". The mystery plot isn't exactly "deep" but the movie is saved by the character moments including Kirk's "Let them die!" and Gorkon's death scenes.
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