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Old May 18 2013, 11:33 AM   #841
USS Firefly
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Goodbye, goodbye! I am going to see Star Trek Into Darkness for a third time!!
I have to wait 3 weeks until its in the theatre's here
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Old May 18 2013, 11:34 AM   #842
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
Souls don't exist, which is all your arguing for. Tuvix is just an amalgamation of two officers, brain included. They aren't dead, they are just the thing with one head. The brain is just an organ like any other. Not going to waste time watching the show, yet you keep coming back to post your opinions vainly trying to masquerade as facts.
Fuck souls.

How they don't make transporterclones when transporting people, is by using all the same exact same matter.

Using anything short of all the same matter is making another defective Tuvix creature screaming about equal rights, and even using less matter than they should is akin to sleeping on a half blown up airbed, which is the lighter side of pumping an airbed until it bursts.

Their pattern however was stored in the computer.

The pattern in the computer remembered the shape and positions of the electrical impulses in their brains which constitutes their emotions and other faculties.

The pattern is their memories and identity, and the pattern in the computer restamps that personality onto the cookiedough like matter they rebuild into a person every-time a transporter transports a wad of ugly bags of mostly water.

They could have used those patterns to make "clones" at any point, who would not be the real Tuvok and Neelix but also unique and fresh new beings, which no one cared to do except maybe Kes, who was probably ignorant to the possibility and wouldn't care since she even thinks that the Doctor is a person.

The pattern is a mold.

After you pull a body apart into a 100 trillion pieces it's natural instinct is not re-coalesce into the same human being, it's wants to become exploded pizza.

Only the pattern is forcing the matter to be it's bitch is what turns a bloody mess into a talking thinking feeling person.
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Old May 18 2013, 11:37 AM   #843
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

There was a drag queen, that's all I'm saying.
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Old May 18 2013, 11:41 AM   #844
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
Souls don't exist, which is all your arguing for. Tuvix is just an amalgamation of two officers, brain included. They aren't dead, they are just the thing with one head. The brain is just an organ like any other. Not going to waste time watching the show, yet you keep coming back to post your opinions vainly trying to masquerade as facts.
Fuck souls.

How they don't make transporterclones when transporting people, is by using all the same exact same matter.

Using anything short of all the same matter is making another defective Tuvix creature screaming about equal rights, and even using less matter than they should is akin to sleeping on a half blown up airbed, which is the lighter side of pumping an airbed until it bursts.

Their pattern however was stored in the computer.

The pattern in the computer remembered the shape and positions of the electrical impulses in their brains which constitutes their emotions and other faculties.

The pattern is their memories and identity, and the pattern in the computer restamps that personality onto the cookiedough like matter they rebuild into a person every-time a transporter transports a wad of ugly bags of mostly water.

They could have used those patterns to make "clones" at any point, who would not be the real Tuvok and Neelix but also unique and fresh new beings, which no one cared to do except maybe Kes, who was probably ignorant to the possibility and wouldn't care since she even thinks that the Doctor is a person.

The pattern is a mould.

After you pull a body apart into a 100 trillion pieces it's natural instinct is not re-coalesce into the same human being, it's wants to become exploded pizza.

Only the pattern is forcing the matter to be it's bitch is what turns a bloody mess into a talking thinking feeling person.
They don't need crews at all, really. A ship can fly itself and pop up crew, even colonies, where ever and whenever needed, or should be able to. Genesis was the first time the show ever used the implications of the transporter technology to a purpose one would expect people would. Heck, why does it even beam crew members up injured? Just repair them in transit, but no...
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Old May 18 2013, 12:12 PM   #845
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Without a massive amount of processing to adjust only half of someone, they'd have to wind back everything including the persons memories, and ageing.

This sounds like the beginning of a Second Eugenics War.
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Old May 18 2013, 12:16 PM   #846
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
Without a massive amount of processing to adjust only half of someone, they'd have to wind back everything including the persons memories, and ageing.

This sounds like the beginning of a Second Eugenics War.
The concerns of the Eugenics War might explain why Earth hasn't utilized transporter tech in such a fashion, but why aren't other races experimenting with it?
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Old May 18 2013, 12:17 PM   #847
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

There are definitely labs out there full of terrifying transporter experiments and a black market in people and clones for them to experiment on.
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Old May 18 2013, 12:31 PM   #848
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Small companies sure. Dark corners of a government hidden on the periphery who will not use such weapons until all else has failed, definitely... B... That's what I liked about he DS9 episode where Quark was selling arms to the smaller kingdoms in the Alpha Quadrant. There's a lot going on in the AQ other than just Humans vs Romulans.

But if almost everyone can make a treaty to stop metagenic weapons then maybe everyone got together and had a talk about how to ethically use a transporter... Which must put ideas in peoples heads, since the metreon cascade which is the weapon which finished the Talaxian/Harkonan war was basically a badly wired transporter.

I mean seriously, it's okay to use transporter scramblers to bobytrap Empok nor so that people explode rather than recombine into a person, but it's not okay to decompile a person with a transporter and then just shunt their matter stream straight into the ships Replicator biomatter reserve.
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Old May 18 2013, 12:41 PM   #849
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

It's like how it's okay to bomb the crap out of a building because a wanted terrorist might be inside but it's not okay to assassinate him.
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Old May 18 2013, 01:17 PM   #850
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Have you seen Zero Dark 30 yet?

They chose 90 Seals rather than a bomb.
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Old May 26 2013, 09:43 PM   #851
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

You might divide Tuvix into Tuvok and Neelix only after a Thomas Riker clone. You would end one Tuvix, but preserve the other, so you keep all three possibilities

You do however integrate Kirk
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Old May 27 2013, 02:26 AM   #852
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

So, you and your twin brother both have horrible cancer. The worst cancer. But a fantastic doctor invents a magical cure, which unfortunately has a dread side effect... They suck all the cancer out of one of you, but they have to pump all that cancer back into the other, until one of your is healthy and the other has double cancer.

Tuvix and Tuvok both want the same job. Who get's it?

Tuvix and Neelix both want to fuck Kes. Who get's it?

There can only be one.

Two?

Shit.

B'Elanna is a Transporter Clone and no one cares.

That would have been a nice twist to Barge of the Dead, making a couplet to Faces.

"Sigh"
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Old May 27 2013, 11:58 AM   #853
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

I am very much opposed to the idea that we may decide when someone may live or die on a situational basis. Unconditional right to life is really the only way to go.
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Old May 27 2013, 12:08 PM   #854
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

But.. what about the Borg?
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Old May 27 2013, 12:10 PM   #855
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Re: Janeway's Decision to Kill Tuvix

Borg life comes in layers.

The collective.

The sleeping individual wills of the drones.

Wake the drones the collective dies.

Kill the collective, all the drones die.

Leave them alone, they assimilate the universe.
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