RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 141,448
Posts: 5,508,044
Members: 25,131
Currently online: 485
Newest member: xunixan

TrekToday headlines

TV Alert: Pine On Tonight Show
By: T'Bonz on Dec 22

Retro Review: The Emperor’s New Cloak
By: Michelle on Dec 20

Star Trek Opera
By: T'Bonz on Dec 19

New Abrams Project
By: T'Bonz on Dec 18

IDW Publishing March 2015 Comics
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Paramount Star Trek 3 Expectations
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Star Trek #39 Sneak Peek
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Star Trek 3 Potential Director Shortlist
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Official Starships Collection Update
By: T'Bonz on Dec 15

Retro Review: Prodigal Daughter
By: Michelle on Dec 13


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 22 2013, 02:03 PM   #31
Bishop76
Fleet Captain
 
Bishop76's Avatar
 
Location: Wisconsin
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

Using Spock Prime was insulting to the audience and to the characters in the film. To the audience because he provided no new information that we hadn't already been provided. To the characters in the movie because it implies that they are incapable of standing on their own and need to call Grandpa Spock every time they run into a jam they can't get out of. It was terrible fan-wankery at its worst.
__________________
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.
Bishop76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 02:03 PM   #32
Relayer1
Rear Admiral
 
Relayer1's Avatar
 
Location: The Black Country, England
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime?

teacake wrote: View Post
If Nimoy was younger the next movie might have been about him being abducted by nefarious types and NuSpock and Kirk having to Search for Spock.


I wonder what they'd call that movie ?

I actually think Spock Prime will have a bigger part in the next film - showing his work on New Vulcan and completing his character arc.

cooleddie74 wrote: View Post
teacake's new avatar is bound to induce the pon farr and more than a few blood fevers over in the Voyager forum.
The proportions are a bit off. It needs more, er, head...
__________________
Soon oh soon the light, Pass within and soothe this endless night, And wait here for you, Our reason to be here...
Relayer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 04:42 PM   #33
SantaEddie74
Fleet Admiral
 
SantaEddie74's Avatar
 
Location: The North Pole of the Warped Sector of the Demented Quadrant
View SantaEddie74's Twitter Profile
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

Bishop76 wrote: View Post
Using Spock Prime was insulting to the audience and to the characters in the film.
It's one thing to call it a contrived and convenient moment in the film designed solely to give Nimoy a cameo just so he can briefly mention the Prime timeline and his Enterprise's run-ins with Khan, but I think it was fun, a little poignant and it was a nice way to tie the new reality in with the old one and make a passing reference to the drama and tragedy involved with battling Khan in the original history.

"Insulting" is far from the word I'd use. I'm a hardcore old school Trekker and I didn't feel remotely "insulted" by Nimoy's cameo.
__________________
Remember what cooleddie74 says, kids:

"Don't forget to have a Patrick Swayze Christmas!"
SantaEddie74 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 04:53 PM   #34
Relayer1
Rear Admiral
 
Relayer1's Avatar
 
Location: The Black Country, England
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

cooleddie74 wrote: View Post
Bishop76 wrote: View Post
Using Spock Prime was insulting to the audience and to the characters in the film.
It's one thing to call it a contrived and convenient moment in the film designed solely to give Nimoy a cameo just so he can briefly mention the Prime timeline and his Enterprise's run-ins with Khan, but I think it was fun, a little poignant and it was a nice way to tie the new reality in with the old one and make a passing reference to the drama and tragedy involved with battling Khan in the original history.

"Insulting" is far from the word I'd use. I'm a hardcore old school Trekker and I didn't feel remotely "insulted" by Nimoy's cameo.
+1
__________________
Soon oh soon the light, Pass within and soothe this endless night, And wait here for you, Our reason to be here...
Relayer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 04:56 PM   #35
Bishop76
Fleet Captain
 
Bishop76's Avatar
 
Location: Wisconsin
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

I'm a hardcore old school Trekker too and insulting is what it was. What did that add to the movie? What purpose did it serve narratively? Spock prime was great in the first reboot. He handed off the torch and then should have disappeared into the background. Again, this scene implies out characters need to call for help any time they're in a pickle and are incapable of handling it on their own. There is such a thing as Boeing out gracefully - like at the end of Trek 09. This is and feels like pure fanwank.
__________________
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.
Bishop76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 04:57 PM   #36
Bishop76
Fleet Captain
 
Bishop76's Avatar
 
Location: Wisconsin
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

I shouldn't post from my phone... That should be bowing out gracefully
__________________
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.
Bishop76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 04:58 PM   #37
SantaEddie74
Fleet Admiral
 
SantaEddie74's Avatar
 
Location: The North Pole of the Warped Sector of the Demented Quadrant
View SantaEddie74's Twitter Profile
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this point. To each their own.
__________________
Remember what cooleddie74 says, kids:

"Don't forget to have a Patrick Swayze Christmas!"
SantaEddie74 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 05:08 PM   #38
Belz...
Fleet Captain
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Location: In a finely-crafted cosmos... of my own making.
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime?

Admiral Buzzkill wrote: View Post
I'm surprised Admiral Marcus wasn't waterboarding him for information.
That's on the BluRay deleted scenes.

teacake wrote: View Post
Whoa, never thought of that but.. doesn't that tell us that at some point Prime Spock had the hots for Uhura and now that he sees NuSpock with her it seems a logical choice?

There _was_ some flirting in TOS but nothing ever came of it.
__________________
And that's my opinion.
Belz... is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 05:14 PM   #39
SantaEddie74
Fleet Admiral
 
SantaEddie74's Avatar
 
Location: The North Pole of the Warped Sector of the Demented Quadrant
View SantaEddie74's Twitter Profile
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

In fact, Spock seemed to all but dismiss and ignore it. When Uhura shows the body language of a cat in heat in "The Man Trap," Spock just totally deflects it with his predictable Vulcan logic and cool behavior.

Admittedly that was very early in TOS history (only seven or eight episodes in, and that's including the two pilots) and Spock's character was still being fleshed out, but even then we saw that Spock Prime reacted differently to romantic behavior from his shipmates than his Abramsverse self does.
__________________
Remember what cooleddie74 says, kids:

"Don't forget to have a Patrick Swayze Christmas!"
SantaEddie74 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 05:23 PM   #40
Joby
Fleet Captain
 
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

While having Spock Prime in the movie didn't completely offend me, I think that scene should not have been in there. I liked Leonard Nimoy's exit from Trek in Trek '09, the cameo here was kinda silly.

Plus I thought Nimoy was very strict and gung ho against cameos, that a character should never just be there to be there. Nimoy has always had this thing about characters should always advance the plot or otherwise be dropped. In the TOS movies he directed back in the '80s, he always gave the supporting players key roles to play to move the plot along, they were never just background props. Nimoy refused a cameo in the first TNG movie Generations b/c he felt Spock served no purpose in a flimsy cameo role. I guess he's had a revision on that sentiment.
Joby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 06:17 PM   #41
Ghel
Commander
 
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

I'm fine with the cameo and here's why:

1. Calling Spock prime is research. At this point in the film, Spock is interested in Khan's character. Is he a decent but misguided person, or an untrustworthy SOB?!? Spock prime personally knows Khan so he would be considered a primary source. He probably knows more about the person of Khan than a secondary-source such as the Encyclopedia of Starfleet.

2. It's more fun watching a conversation with Nimoy than having someone stare at the ship's database.

3. (SPOILER) It serves a very distinct purpose of tying this film to Wrath of Khan. Everything that happens between this point and the point where Khan flies his ship into San Francisco parallels WoK with Kirk and Spock doing "what you would have done for me."

The above said, I'd hope (and imagine) that Spock prime will not become a crutch for the Enterprise crew in future films.
Ghel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 07:20 PM   #42
Jack Frost
Commodore
 
Jack Frost's Avatar
 
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

^No reason he should, he's now made it clear he won't divulge future events.

He is essentially speaking for TPTB saying; we are going to continue mining the original canon for whatever we want so don't go expecting complete originality anytime soon.

Okay, fine. It is theirs to do with as they please. So long as it remains fun I am on-board.
Jack Frost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 08:59 PM   #43
mos6507
Captain
 
mos6507's Avatar
 
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
did Nero's arrival erase photographs from the 1990s?
No, but it erased memory of canon from the writers.
__________________
Fem Trekz on Facebook
mos6507 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 09:35 PM   #44
Relayer1
Rear Admiral
 
Relayer1's Avatar
 
Location: The Black Country, England
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

Joby wrote: View Post
While having Spock Prime in the movie didn't completely offend me, I think that scene should not have been in there. I liked Leonard Nimoy's exit from Trek in Trek '09, the cameo here was kinda silly.

Plus I thought Nimoy was very strict and gung ho against cameos, that a character should never just be there to be there. Nimoy has always had this thing about characters should always advance the plot or otherwise be dropped. In the TOS movies he directed back in the '80s, he always gave the supporting players key roles to play to move the plot along, they were never just background props. Nimoy refused a cameo in the first TNG movie Generations b/c he felt Spock served no purpose in a flimsy cameo role. I guess he's had a revision on that sentiment.
I don't know - as I said, I think Spock Prime will have a bigger part in the next film - showing his work on New Vulcan and completing his character arc. If so, this was a simple 'Hey, I'm still around' for the character - it established that he was still on New Vulcan and is just a stepping stone to the next film.
__________________
Soon oh soon the light, Pass within and soothe this endless night, And wait here for you, Our reason to be here...
Relayer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 22 2013, 10:01 PM   #45
billcosby
Commodore
 
billcosby's Avatar
 
Location: billcosby
Re: What does everyone know about Spock Prime? [probably spoilers]

teacake wrote: View Post
Whoa, never thought of that but.. doesn't that tell us that at some point Prime Spock had the hots for Uhura and now that he sees NuSpock with her it seems a logical choice?
teacake just invented Spock/Spock/Uhura slash fiction. OR would they have to fight each other to the death first? Either way, it's very creative.

ONESPOCK "It's only logical for all of us to have a freaky-deekie threesome."
TWOSPOCK "I am forced to concur. Uhura, do you also concur?"

Bonus: Which SpockVoice do you hear for the above exchange?

Interesting topic, BTW. I guess JJSpock would have mentioned PrimeSpock in the report to Starfleet after Trek09. Then Starfleet would have decided whether or not to distribute it to the news services. Probably not.

Ultimately (and perhaps this is a separate issue) why should PrimeSpock care about contaminating the timeline as he claims to want to avoid? Why isn't he more focused on correcting the timeline? Instead he is the founder of the New Vulcan colony, is he not?

So what's PrimeSpock's ultimate angle, protecting the Prime timeline or allowing the current timeline to unfold as is?

The truth is this: From what I could gather from Into Darkness, PrimeSpock is as interested to what happens in this timeline as the rest of us, the audience. PrimeSpock is the audience. He just sits back and watches. It seems implied to me that PrimeSpock dishes all the goods on Khan and co. as the scene changes mid conversation.
__________________
My 1st Edition TrekCCG virtual expansion: http://billcosbytrekccg.blogspot.com/

billcosby is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:33 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.