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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old May 3 2013, 04:18 AM   #151
Warped9
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

Masao wrote: View Post
For me, the universe of TOS is and was the future. When I think of the future, I imagine it to look like TOS. I know that some people can't get past the superficial aspects of hairstyles, studio-bound locations, grainy special effects and what not. I think they should try to get past this stuff, because if they can they'll find other rewards. But if they can't, then perhaps TOS is not for them. But I think that because many of us first saw TOS when we were unable to see anything but the wonder, the romance, the adventure, and the endless possibilities, it buried itself deep, deep inside us and will never leave. I saw 2001: A Space Odyssey around the same age (at a real Cinerama screen, no less), and it had a similar effect on me. So, that clean early/mid-1960s International Style aesthetic is my idea of what the future looks like. (That's also one of the reasons I like Mad Men.)

I also saw Lost in Space about this same time, but, for some reason, that never looked futuristic to me. Maybe because, even at that young age, I thought LiS was just stupid.

The "Future" is a moving target. What you think is futuristic today might well look ridiculous in a very short time. Who knows what it will look like. Will it look like TOS? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe Steampunk will be the defining style of the late 21st century, and we'll all be wearing corsets and goggles. But it's fun to think about it. Hope to see you all in the future!
Well said. And I also like Mad Men.
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Old May 3 2013, 05:30 AM   #152
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

I second that Warped9.

There really needs to be a "Like" or "Thanks for the post" feature added to the BBS. I don't want to keep quoting posts and saying "me too" or "+1".
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Old May 3 2013, 06:26 AM   #153
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

Masao wrote: View Post
I saw 2001: A Space Odyssey around the same age (at a real Cinerama screen, no less), and it had a similar effect on me. So, that clean early/mid-1960s International Style aesthetic is my idea of what the future looks like. (That's also one of the reasons I like Mad Men.)

I also saw Lost in Space about this same time, but, for some reason, that never looked futuristic to me. Maybe because, even at that young age, I thought LiS was just stupid.

The "Future" is a moving target. What you think is futuristic today might well look ridiculous in a very short time. Who knows what it will look like.
Ron Cobb is quoted somewhere, maybe BOOK OF ALIEN, maybe STARLOG, saying essentially that designwise, you can extrapolate till you're blue in the face and do all the smart projections of what is to come ... and still come out way off target or visually unconvincing (sorry, looking at you, TMP interiors.) Proof of that is how ALIEN can convince, then AND now, even with those goddamn toggle switches everywhere.

I think the LiS kneejerk reject has to do with it looking retrograde, like it was doing FORBIDDEN PLANET without realizing that had already been done, and done better. Somehow the same consoles that showed up on all the Allen shows only seemed to really look futuristic to me in THE TIME TUNNEL, but maybe that was because it was the only Allen show my 6 year-old mind could get behind (though I watched VOYAGE regularly, I think it was like GREEN ACRES, it was watched just because it was on and I was supposed to participate in the family experience.)

The 2001/Mad Men connection is an interesting one that I happen to share, but although my wife is almost a decade younger than me, she also shares a fascination with both, though she has never gotten to see 2001 in anything other than 35mm.

I have always thought seeing 2001 in L.A. at age 7-1/2 -- after reading about it in mags sporting gorgeous layouts -- during its opening weeks kind of ruined me for ordinary movies ... outside of PATTON, I don't think I was monumentally impressed with another movie till the mid 70s, and by that time I was being impressed by films on the basis of just their content rather than style and content (though I still think 2001 is cock o' the walk for just about all things.)
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Old May 4 2013, 01:19 PM   #154
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post
The TMP refit nacelles were based not on a car, but a once-futuristic locomotive:

Great. Now I see the Enterprise is steam-powered.
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Old May 4 2013, 01:34 PM   #155
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

xvicente wrote: View Post
ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post
The TMP refit nacelles were based not on a car, but a once-futuristic locomotive:

Great. Now I see the Enterprise is steam-powered.
Well, in Next Gen and The Undiscovered Country, it did have a pot-belly stove for a warp core.
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Old May 4 2013, 10:23 PM   #156
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

King Daniel wrote: View Post
xvicente wrote: View Post
ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post
The TMP refit nacelles were based not on a car, but a once-futuristic locomotive:

Great. Now I see the Enterprise is steam-powered.
Well, in Next Gen and The Undiscovered Country, it did have a pot-belly stove for a warp core.
I hasten to point out that this connection is conjecture, not fact, no matter how similar they appear. I showed the picture to Andy Probert and he said he'd never seen that before, so it wasn't around the TMP art department. Since Richard Taylor designed the nacelles, someone would have to show it to him and see if he says "yes". And since Matt Jefferies designed the Phase II nacelles on which the TMP ones were roughly derived, the origin of the design promises to be muddy.
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Old May 5 2013, 02:42 AM   #157
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

trevanian wrote: View Post
Somehow the same consoles that showed up on all the Allen shows only seemed to really look futuristic to me in THE TIME TUNNEL, but maybe that was because it was the only Allen show my 6 year-old mind could get behind
I'm guessing it appeared futuristic in TTT because we were told the series was set in the then-present day (whether it was first run for you or not).

The rest of Allen's series were set a decade or more in the future (Voyage in the late 70's, the LiS start date was 1997, and LOTG set in 1983) so, the consoles did not seem advanced enough for a deep space vehicle assumed to be the zenith of human tech (Jupiter 2), or an innovative sub-orbital passenger ship (Spindrift).
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Old May 5 2013, 04:26 AM   #158
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

Maurice wrote: View Post
I hasten to point out that this connection is conjecture, not fact, no matter how similar they appear. I showed the picture to Andy Probert and he said he'd never seen that before, so it wasn't around the TMP art department. Since Richard Taylor designed the nacelles, someone would have to show it to him and see if he says "yes". And since Matt Jefferies designed the Phase II nacelles on which the TMP ones were roughly derived, the origin of the design promises to be muddy.
I now agree with that assessment. It comes down to what Matt Jeffries was thinking of when he designed Phase II. The nacelle's locomotive look could conceivably be a coincidence. Or MJ might have remembered the M-1 locomotive as the height of looking futuristic and powerful when it was new and he was about 26 years old.
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Old May 6 2013, 09:47 AM   #159
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

Does the TOS look futuristic to me? I grew up in the late 1970s and 1980s, so it never did look futuristic. In fact, it looked downright fake, in comparison to other sci fi I was interested in at the time such as Star Wars, Aliens, and especially Star Treks 1-3. Watching the TOS series in re-runs, then seeing the then new Star trek movies with the same cast members some 15 years later, the FX gap had a huge drop off between movie and TV show.

But you know what? I still loved watching the TOS re-runs anyway, because the show was so well written, and so well acted. And now, the FX and sets are part of the charm of TOS, and in fact, despite the visual upgrades the remastered versions offer, I STILL prefer the original, unenhanced version of the TOS.

BillJ wrote: View Post
Yes and no.

The Enterprise exterior still seems futuristic to me as do the bridge and transporter room. Some of the props have aged better than others, the communicator and phaser are still awesome, while the tricorder and PADD haven't aged so well.
I would say that the overall design of the Enterprise exterior, and the other ships like Klingons and Romulans still look futuristic to me. In fact, their silhouettes are what I picture as what space ships SHOULD look like.

But I have to be honest and say that on the Enterprise,the TOS series version's nacelles have what clearly look like 1960s rocket styling, and the deflector dish looks a little out of place, when comparing it with other Star Fleet ships that came later.

Now, if you ask me if the refit Enterprise from TMP forward still looks futuristic, I say resoundingly "YES!" It is amazing to me how only 10 years difference and having an actual budget transforms basically the same ship and makes it realistic looking, and futuristic.While I love the classic TOS Enterprise, I still feel the "true look" of the NCC1701, and one that holds up the most, is the TMP version. In fact, it is clear that the reboot Enterprise was most heavily influenced by that version, and at least the saucer section, to me, looks nearly the same.

Saito S wrote: View Post
maneth wrote: View Post
Nope, especially not the computers. Those look like what they are, a 60s blinking lights vision of the future. Of course, the one thing that really dates TOS in my eyes is the miniskirt (and no, that doesn't look any better in the Abramsverse either).
Agreed all around (including the miniskirt comment). I can appreciate some of TOS' better written episodes purely for their stories, but just about every element of the visuals and overall production design of the show is so dated as to be distracting.
BillJ wrote: View Post

It's those smooth surfaces that serve to make it seem more futuristic than its offspring.
Eh, other way 'round, I'd say. Interestingly, though the less smooth, more detailed surfaces of the Ent-D, Defiant, etc. make those ships look better/more advanced from the outside, the more smooth, less blocky surfaces of control panels and such are what make them look more advanced from the inside.
spockboy wrote: View Post
If you liked the photoshopped pics, THIS will blow your mind.

https://vimeo.com/12023417

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ZOML! That is awesome work!
This!

I have to agree. The added detail and lighting to the TOS designs in TMP forward really are what make the refit Enterprise NCC-1701 really go from looking like a model in the TOS, to a real ship in the movies, that in my mind, should be how actual future ships should look like.

As for that video, that DID blow my mind. It transforms the TOS bridge in a way that is consistent with the TMP-TUC movies, yet maintains the integrity of the color scheme of TOS. I can't imagine what it would cost to go through every TOS episode and update it to look like that, though, but if it ever were done, I would definitely be buying me some blu rays! Great work!
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Old May 6 2013, 10:47 AM   #160
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

TOS debuted when I was 15. One of the most fascinating things about it for me was the Enterprise miniature shots, because I didn't know how they were done. They weren't on wires, like Buck Rogers, Republic serials, Lost in Space, or Forbidden Planet. They weren't animated cartoons. So I started reading about special effects cinematography, miniatures, optical printing, and bluescreen/chromakey. Of course now I can get similar effects with my computer software. But well done bluescreen, as Star Trek often was, still fascinates me more than CGI.
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Old May 7 2013, 03:45 AM   #161
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

My Name Is Legion wrote: View Post
It's like asking if 1950s Superman comics still look like superhero comics. TOS really captured the look and feel of a comic book better than any series either before or since. It's timeless in that respect.
Agreed!
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Old May 7 2013, 03:49 AM   #162
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

Blade Runner still looks futuristic to me, barring the signs for the various no-longer-in-business companies. Almost no other science-fiction television series or feature film, old or new, looks convincingly futuristic to me.
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Old May 22 2013, 12:23 AM   #163
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

For everyone who loved the design of 2001: A Space Odyssey I strongly recommend a book called 2001: Lost Science which is full of original drawings and behind the scenes photos from the collection of Frederick Ordway, who was a special consultant from the Alabama Space and Rocket Center for Stanley Kubrick. I love 2001 and this is probably my favorite book on the film.
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Old May 22 2013, 12:57 AM   #164
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

comsol wrote: View Post
For everyone who loved the design of 2001: A Space Odyssey I strongly recommend a book called 2001: Lost Science which is full of original drawings and behind the scenes photos from the collection of Frederick Ordway, who was a special consultant from the Alabama Space and Rocket Center for Stanley Kubrick. I love 2001 and this is probably my favorite book on the film.
Thanks for the reference. I would aslo advise buying the long out of print 2001: Filming the Future by Piers Bizony. That book is filled with wonderful photos of miniatures, sets, etc. Still one of the best visions of sci-fi vehicle design ever filmed.
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Old May 22 2013, 02:37 AM   #165
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Re: Does TOS Still Look Futuristic to You?

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
comsol wrote: View Post
For everyone who loved the design of 2001: A Space Odyssey I strongly recommend a book called 2001: Lost Science which is full of original drawings and behind the scenes photos from the collection of Frederick Ordway, who was a special consultant from the Alabama Space and Rocket Center for Stanley Kubrick. I love 2001 and this is probably my favorite book on the film.
Thanks for the reference. I would aslo advise buying the long out of print 2001: Filming the Future by Piers Bizony. That book is filled with wonderful photos of miniatures, sets, etc. Still one of the best visions of sci-fi vehicle design ever filmed.
You're welcome. I do have the Bizony book (both editions), and as good as it is, the other book blows it away.
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