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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old May 20 2013, 10:47 PM   #16
TheCutestofBorg
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Re: No Gas in the tank... SPOILERS

Franklin wrote: View Post
TommyW wrote: View Post
You have to question the sanity of anyone that thinks the safest place to keep anyone is in a torpedo The plot of the whole film is pretty ridiculous. It's credit to Abrams that he managed to make it watchable. Hopefully they'll get some proper writers in for the next one though
Meh. It can be explained away. We don't know what his pristine plan was before Kirk got involved. He had to believe those missiles were meant for the Vengeance. He was proabably plotting to take the ship for himself.

Smuggling his friends aboard in topedoes with their warheads intact but unarmed like they were Trojan horses would be the the last thing anyone would think (it is a bit insane, after all), but if he gets on board and revives them, there's no doubt they'd take the ship over, and Khan would be on a rampage with the Federation's newest warship and 72 powerful missiles at his disposal.
As much as I liked this movie, it would help explain to the average viewer exactly whats going on. Something to the effect of Kahn saying to Kirk how he disrupted his original plan and then heavily imply that he was planning on capturing the Vengence when it arrived on Kronos to kill him.
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Old May 21 2013, 03:46 AM   #17
CommishSleer
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Re: No Gas in the tank... SPOILERS

Franklin wrote: View Post
Yeah, the missiles were the oddest part of the story (which is bad considering they were also crucial).

At first, I thought maybe Marcus was giving Kirk the missiles having put Khan's people in them as a way of getting rid of them after Khan went rogue. But that's too convoluted to make any sense at all. Especially taking care to put them in still frozen and alive.

It turns out, anyway that Khan put them there, himself. So maybe it was a way of getting them onto the Vengeance, where those missiles were probably intended to go in the first place. Seventy-two Trojan horses. Once they were there, Khan would find a way to board the sparesly crewed ship before the missiles were fired and revive his friends (if Scotty could run around the ship undetected, Khan certainly could get aboard and find a way to revive his people). Khan and his people would then take control of the Vengeance. That meddling Kirk getting the missiles was not what Khan believed would happen. There are problems with this premise, too, but it makes some sense.

The final problem is there are exactly 72 missiles. What a convenient number. Wouldn't that raise eyebrows among Marcus's people? Did they coincidentally order 72? What if the initial order was for only 64 missiles? What if there were 84? What if only 50 had been loaded onto the Enterprise?
I like this explanation.
Although Marcus did not seem to be surprised that Khan's people were in the torpedoes. Maybe he's just a great manipulator.

datalogan wrote: View Post
Plus, they had to redesign the Enterprise [somehow, somewhen] to give her 72 launch tubes. She didn't have those in the last movie. How convenient that Enterprise has exactly 72 launch tubes.
Does the Enterprise have 72 launch tubes. they could use the same launchers again as they did in the series.
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Old May 21 2013, 06:47 AM   #18
Kelso
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Re: No Gas in the tank... SPOILERS

As I understood it, Khan originally hid his people in the torpedoes with the intention of sneaking them away from Marcus, but then something went tits up between him and Marcus and he thought Marcus had killed them. After Marcus got wise to Khan's plan he stuck all of the torpedoes on the Enterprise with orders to fire them at the Klingons- cleaning up his own mess and starting a war with the Klingons at the same time.

Those things must've had a helluva range originally, as Marcus expected them to still hit Kronos with the human popsicles inside. But as Khan indicated that he at least had a hand in designing the torpedoes, he may have allowed for the the necessary space from the get-go. It doesn't seem like a particularly safe way of smuggling people covertly, but the torpedoes have their own engines, guidance systems and stealth capabilities... so why not? Especially with Marcus looking over his shoulder. A transport ship designed for 72 large crates would likely have drawn suspicion.

I'd imagine that all 72 torpedoes would have suffered surprising guidance system errors and vanished without detonating if Khan had been able to bring his plan to fruition.

Last edited by Kelso; May 21 2013 at 06:57 AM.
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Old May 21 2013, 12:18 PM   #19
CommishSleer
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Re: No Gas in the tank... SPOILERS

If Khan was left alone enough to hide 72 people into torpedoes then why didn't he just wake them up? Surely that would have been a lot simpler.
The explanation that he wanted to sneak them aboard the Vengeance is intriguing. Perhaps he and Marcus agreed to sneak them aboard for some reason before the falling out. Maybe Marcus had some co-conspirators in Starfleet who weren't keen on waking up Khan's crew and Marcus wanted to string Khan along pretending he had snuck them aboard, telling his co-conspirators he had had them killed. Then Khan heard this and did the Section 31 bombing.
I think you'll all agree this explanation is as obvious as the nose in front of your face and required no fanciful fanon from me
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