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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old May 19 2013, 05:09 AM   #1
WarpFactorZ
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Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

Just got back from seeing the movie. Excellent!... except for the ever-growing ship sizes. But alas, move on.

One thing I picked up on, which I haven't heard discussed here yet, was Carol Marcus' comment that Adm. Marcus had been dabbling with transwarp technology -- and hence why he could easily catch the Enterprise. Very nice homage to the Excelsior, and a "what could have been" it it had been designed for nefarious purposes.

Also, as others have pointed out: Scotty crippled it quite easily. The more they over-think the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain.
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Old May 19 2013, 05:16 AM   #2
Jack Frost
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

The Vengeance darkly creeping up from behind was that ships money shot of the whole movie!
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Old May 19 2013, 05:19 AM   #3
Phily B
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

The Keeper wrote: View Post
The Vengeance darkly creeping up from behind was that ships money shot of the whole movie!
I'm surprised it took so long for them to release a poster of that..
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Old May 21 2013, 12:48 PM   #4
Belz...
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

WarpFactorZ wrote: View Post
One thing I picked up on, which I haven't heard discussed here yet, was Carol Marcus' comment that Adm. Marcus had been dabbling with transwarp technology -- and hence why he could easily catch the Enterprise. Very nice homage to the Excelsior, and a "what could have been" it it had been designed for nefarious purposes.
Huh. Didn't think about that before, but maybe this is what Esteban meant in III when he mentioned Kirk was wrong thinking he could get away with warp drive. Khan's line echoes this quite nicely.

Vengeance is the Evil Excelcior.
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Old May 21 2013, 01:20 PM   #5
M.A.C.O.
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

The 2009 bluray special features for the Narada said it was capable of transwarp drive. If the NuEnterprise got sensors scans of the Narada's propulsion system in action. Admiral Marcus/Star Fleet Intelligence/Section 31 could've figured it out. Also they did collect Scotty's transwarp beaming equation from him according to Scotty in the film. Maybe that's how they applied it to the Vengeance.
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Old May 21 2013, 01:24 PM   #6
C.E. Evans
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

IMO, the nuEnterprise has transwarp drive* as well given how quickly she can get from place to place. The Vengeance just might have a faster or more powerful version of it.

*Maybe in the Abramsverse, their warp drive is the equivalent of the Prime Universe's transwarp.
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Old May 21 2013, 01:35 PM   #7
R. Star
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

Or maybe they just throw the word out there because it sounds cool and they're just even more blatant about time and distance only being plot concerns to be overlooked when convenient.
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Old May 21 2013, 01:41 PM   #8
C.E. Evans
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

In a real sense, warp factors have always been pretty much meaningless, essentially technobabble, with no more real thought given to them by the writers than they get subsequently faster from warp one.

The line between Trek's warp drive and Star Wars' hyperdrive continues to blur, but it wasn't very clear to begin with, IMO.
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Old May 21 2013, 01:45 PM   #9
EJD1984
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

I'm thinking that the Transwarp for the Vengeance came from Scotty (inadvertently). Remember he made the comment "Starfleet took away my transwarp-beaming formula". Most likely the Section 31 engineers and scientist used that for the basis for the new propulsion.

Though, shouldn't it have taken the Enterprise several days to get to Kronos?
(For that matter, Vulcan should have been a day or two in the 2009 movie)
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Old May 21 2013, 01:55 PM   #10
M.A.C.O.
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

R. Star wrote: View Post
Or maybe they just throw the word out there because it sounds cool and they're just even more blatant about time and distance only being plot concerns to be overlooked when convenient.
^ this and remember the NuEnterprise was capable of getting from Vulcan to Earth in what i assume was under an hour in the 2009 movie. Despite the Narada being capable of transwarp, the NuEnterprise was able to leave Vulcan space after the planet's destruction, detour partially to the Lorientian system and then make it to Earth catching up to the Narada moving at warp FOUR! Like wtf. Warp factors move at the speed of plot.
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Old May 21 2013, 02:54 PM   #11
C.E. Evans
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

EJD1984 wrote: View Post
Though, shouldn't it have taken the Enterprise several days to get to Kronos?
(For that matter, Vulcan should have been a day or two in the 2009 movie)
If we go with the idea that the initial scans of the Narada by the late Starship Kelvin led to major technological changes in the new timeline, then the warp drive of the nuEnterprise may be more than a century ahead of what it was originally.

But it could also be said if it only took NX-01 four days to get to the Klingon homeworld, a significantly faster NCC-1701 should get there in a fraction of the time and to Vulcan in even less time.
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Old May 21 2013, 04:29 PM   #12
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

And don't forget, the original Enterprise left the galaxy and the Enterprise-A went to the center!

So really, warp factors are meaningless.

On topic, I think the Vengeance is just really fast. Kirk thought that the Enterprise was the fastest and was surprised that she caught up with her.
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Old May 21 2013, 04:34 PM   #13
Belz...
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
The 2009 bluray special features for the Narada said it was capable of transwarp drive.
I don't know. The Enterprise manages to catch up to it before they can blow up Earth, so either it's not super fast (it is originally a mining vessel) or Nero was taking his sweet time getting there, for some reason.
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Old May 21 2013, 06:02 PM   #14
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

Kruezerman wrote: View Post
And don't forget, the original Enterprise left the galaxy and the Enterprise-A went to the center!
I've always imagined that the original Enterprise left the galaxy by traveling perpendicular to the galactic plane - up or down, not out to the rim.

As for going to the center: the less you think about The Final Frontier, the better.
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Old May 21 2013, 06:12 PM   #15
anothertrekfan
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Re: Transwarp drive: Vengeance = Excelsior

Third Nacelle wrote: View Post
Kruezerman wrote: View Post
And don't forget, the original Enterprise left the galaxy and the Enterprise-A went to the center!
I've always imagined that the original Enterprise left the galaxy by traveling perpendicular to the galactic plane - up or down, not out to the rim.

As for going to the center: the less you think about The Final Frontier, the better.


So true.
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