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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

View Poll Results: Grade the movie...
A+ 144 19.23%
A 161 21.50%
A- 101 13.48%
B+ 83 11.08%
B 59 7.88%
B- 27 3.60%
C+ 40 5.34%
C 38 5.07%
C- 25 3.34%
D+ 11 1.47%
D 13 1.74%
D- 10 1.34%
F 37 4.94%
Voters: 749. You may not vote on this poll

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Old May 19 2013, 04:16 AM   #3031
throwback
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

When the first batch of Star Trek films were released, the majority of revenues generated were domestic, so the producers had the opportunity to explore contemporary topics with freedom. However, for this next batch, the revenue-generating source has moved to overseas, and the producers have to be more sensitive about the issues they cover. For instance, from the world of video games, the people had to change the attacking nation of China to North Korea because the corporations feared reprisal from the Chinese government.

I think any discussion about this film has to keep this consideration front and center. This movie isn't made for an American audience; it is made for an international market. That market has different expectations and sensitivities. A focus group by Paramount determined that this market wanted a film that was less Trek and more action-adventure.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:23 AM   #3032
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

throwback wrote: View Post
I think any discussion about this film has to keep this consideration front and center. This movie isn't made for an American audience; it is made for an international market. That market has different expectations and sensitivities. A focus group by Paramount determined that this market wanted a film that was less Trek and more action-adventure.
Source?
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Old May 19 2013, 04:26 AM   #3033
davejames
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
But this film certainly challenges us to think. Therefore is "cerebral".
Yes there was the one noble and right decision made by Kirk, but that's hardly enough to qualify this as a deep or "cerebral" Trek. The vast majority of the movie was devoted simply to nonstop, over the top action and summer movie spectacle.

That's like saying Transformers was cerebral because Optimus Prime would occasionally stop to give a cheesy speech about honor and courage.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:31 AM   #3034
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

I for one am so sick of so much darkness. It would be one thing if the events had happened to an alien culture. But Star Trek's shining examples, Star Fleet and the Federation have had so many bad apples lately. Make them good and try and help someone else over come issues we're facing today.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:33 AM   #3035
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

davejames wrote: View Post
Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
But this film certainly challenges us to think. Therefore is "cerebral".
Yes there was the one noble and right decision made by Kirk, but that's hardly enough to qualify this as a deep or "cerebral" Trek. The vast majority of the movie was devoted simply to nonstop, over the top action and summer movie spectacle.

That's like saying Transformers was cerebral because Optimus Prime would occasionally stop to give a cheesy speech about honor and courage.
I loved this movie and there were plenty of things to talk and think about in it but in no way would I call it cerebral.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:35 AM   #3036
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

I'm just going to trot this out again:

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Old May 19 2013, 04:37 AM   #3037
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Dun dun DUN DUN DUN DUN DUN dun dun dun..
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Old May 19 2013, 04:39 AM   #3038
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

teacake wrote: View Post
Dun dun DUN DUN DUN DUN DUN dun dun dun..
That's exactly what I was thinking when I posted it.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:39 AM   #3039
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Do any of you know if Hendorff and the black security guard survived the battle on Kronos? I was trying to see if they showed up during the battle but I lost them and I didn't see them back on the Enterprise.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:39 AM   #3040
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

DarKush wrote: View Post
Do any of you know if Hendorff and the black security guard survived the battle on Kronos? I was trying to see if they showed up during the battle but I lost them and I didn't see them back on the Enterprise.
I don't think Hendorff survived. Of course, my only source on that is the novelization.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:40 AM   #3041
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Admiral Buzzkill wrote: View Post
HaventGotALife wrote: View Post
I just don't think it was done well.
It was done a hell of a lot better than painting two guys half-white and half-black, that much is certain.

The guys making these movies now sure don't have anything to fear from comparison to most of oldTrek.
Speak for yourself. I prefer allegory in Trek to beat me about the face and neck and then take me in a manly fashion.

Tht be art!
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Old May 19 2013, 04:52 AM   #3042
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

So, Squiggy hearts Patterns of Force, I take it.
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Old May 19 2013, 04:56 AM   #3043
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Don't go dissing Patterns of Force! Spock takes his shirt off!
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Old May 19 2013, 04:58 AM   #3044
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

teacake wrote: View Post
I would never have thought of that.. because I remember what dicks Khan's super men were in Space Seed, TWOK and the Eugenics War books
Heck even the movie points that out by Spock pointing out that Khan and his people tried to kill everyone they thought was inferior.

J. Allen wrote: View Post
DarKush wrote: View Post
Do any of you know if Hendorff and the black security guard survived the battle on Kronos? I was trying to see if they showed up during the battle but I lost them and I didn't see them back on the Enterprise.
I don't think Hendorff survived. Of course, my only source on that is the novelization.
I wouldn't trust the novelization remember the one for Star Trek (2009) had Nero kill Ayel after the destruction of Vulcan whereas Kirk killed him near the end of the film.
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Old May 19 2013, 05:09 AM   #3045
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Lapis Exilis wrote: View Post
Indeed - and as you say even TOS wasn't doing anything truly radical, only radical for prime time network tv.

Well, being "radical" and "being intelligent" aren't really the same thing. Popular entertainment is generally not the place to go, obviously, to really be challenged intellectually (unless you are talking about understanding how it functions from an analytical point of view, which is as challenging as understanding any complex social phenomenon).

I think, a lot of the time, when fans talk about Star Trek being "intelligent," what they are really saying is: it is a fictional universe that tends to capture the imagination of some intelligent people, or, alternately, "it appeals to their intellect." It's nerd fantasy fulfillment, in a lot of ways, and I don't mean that in a pejorative way, or at least not only.

Part of that is the "exploration" aspect, I think. Conceptually, it's a franchise that's built around the discovery of new worlds, civilizations, etc., for example, rather than just beating the bad guy. That's appealing to the intellect, even if, concretely, what you end up "exploring" isn't really all that compelling at the end of the day, or new, or radical. Sometimes it is comically *not* new or interesting, but the *idea* of exploring "the final frontier" is still really compelling *as an idea*.

Often watching old TOS episodes cracks me up because the "alien" planet is about the most non-alien looking place imaginable. But the idea is still fun.

Also, a lot of times "intelligent" in this type of blockbuster really means something like "not egregiously or insultingly stupid," which is certainly a positive. I do my serious thinking during the day at work, but that doesn't mean I want my entertainment to take a crap in my brain, so to speak. At least not always.

Anyway, this movie was fine from that point of view, as far as I'm concerned.

I wouldn't mind a future movie focusing a bit more on the exploration angle, though I recognize that structure probably fits the tv format better.
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