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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Deep Space Nine

Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

View Poll Results: How do you feel about TNG?
I love TNG, both it and DS9 are excellent 67 44.97%
I like TNG, but I prefer DS9 58 38.93%
TNG was okay, I have no strong feelings 13 8.72%
I disliked TNG, DS9 was the superior show 4 2.68%
I loath TNG, it ruined everything 2 1.34%
I'm not a Niner but I want to vote for the comic option 5 3.36%
Voters: 149. You may not vote on this poll

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Old May 17 2013, 04:23 PM   #106
RXTT
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

I grew up watching ToS in re-runs, and loved it. I watched TNG from the first episode, and loved it. I was thrilled that Trek was back on TV, since I had been loving all the movies until that day.

I am a NINER 4 LIFE though. Once I watched DS9 I realized that this was the best TV I was going to ever get to see.

I still love TNG, and Picard, and everyone on it. I never felt any malice towards "weasel" crusher. When I met my wife we got into TNG, watching it in reruns, because she had never seen TRek, and I thought she may find Picard a bad-ass (which he is and she did). She liked TNG a lot, especially data and Picard. She hated Barclay, HATED HIM, and refuses to watch any Barclay-based episodes.

I told her my fave was DS9, and tried to explain why, but it is easier to show. The problem was that DS9 is not in syndication, and was unavailable for us to watch.

Once I found out it was on Netflix streaming we got down to business. It quickly became my wife's fave. It was always my fave.

The best parts of TNG were when we got to see the real people behind the official titles. TNG did not have enough of these moments, but I think it is why people loved when Picard finally joined the crew to play poker.

TNG is about what happens when you gather the best of the best and send them to explore new worlds. Everyone on the enterprise WANTS to be there, asks to be there, works hard to earn the right to be there. It is a ship full of overachievers.

DS9 was about what happens to people when they are forced to deal with horrific situations they had no hand in creating, in a remote, lawless part of their world. DS9 is a place full of outcasts, misfits, fringe-dwellers, and malcontents. These are people that have been ordered or forced to do jobs they would rather not be doing. This was obvious from the first episode. Even the almighty SISKO did not want to be the Emissary. This is a whole lot close to the realities that we all have to deal with in our lives. It also showed that "evil" is a category found in all people, and that the "good" among us are the ones that CHOOSE to do right.

DS9 is the single greatest TV show for me. It explored the true nature of what it is to be human.
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Old May 18 2013, 02:30 AM   #107
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

DS9 and TNG are very different shows. But I like them because they are unique. TNG has some great episodes that are layered and deal with an issue in each one. DS9 is one theme and peels the layers of that theme. I think it's great that we had the writing talent to do both series with the same staffs.
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Old May 18 2013, 02:53 AM   #108
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

I love both of them, but I do slightly prefer DS9 and believe it to be the best Trek.

That being said, DS9 had the benefit of taking place in a universe that was built on two previous series. You can't forget that without TNG, there would be no DS9. As a series, it was able to hit the ground running without (too much of) an awkward phase, because TNG laid a path for it.

(TNG also laid a path for Voyager, but instead of exploring off the path, Voyager chose to wear it into a rut.)
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Old May 18 2013, 02:54 AM   #109
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

Third Nacelle wrote: View Post
I love both of them, but I do slightly prefer DS9 and believe it to be the best Trek.

That being said, DS9 had the benefit of taking place in a universe that was built on two previous series. You can't forget that without TNG, there would be no DS9. As a series, it was able to hit the ground running without (too much of) an awkward phase, because TNG laid a path for it.

(TNG also laid a path for Voyager, but instead of exploring off the path, Voyager chose to wear it into a rut.)
I think that's important to recognize. You have to know the 24th century to appreciate what's at-stake in the Dominion War and how we are waging it. It's almost heartbreaking to see some of the moral dilemmas of the show.

I don't have a favorite. I don't watch VOY and ENT, but I would take the first three series, any episode, any time. They are so good.
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Old May 18 2013, 04:51 AM   #110
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

Well I voted for I love both, but I do prefer DS9 to TNG.

TNG definitely has the better actors, but DS9 got graced with better writers so they had better characters in the end.
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Old May 18 2013, 11:24 AM   #111
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

I grew up with TNG but I prefer DS9
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Old May 18 2013, 06:34 PM   #112
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

R. Star wrote: View Post
Well I voted for I love both, but I do prefer DS9 to TNG.

TNG definitely has the better actors, but DS9 got graced with better writers so they had better characters in the end.
Was it better writers or more free writers? The more I watch the Blu Rays for TNG, the more I think how egomaniacal Gene Roddenberry was and I wonder if Gene was completely hands off, how much better TNG would have been.
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Old May 18 2013, 07:03 PM   #113
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

TheGodBen wrote: View Post
I'm not sure if you've noticed, but Niners have a reputation for acting somewhat superior, and it has recently been put to me that Niners frequently badmouth TNG.
No offense...but ::bleep:: this. I am old enough to remember DS9 being DISMISSED by TOS and especially TNG fans during its run. In letters to Trek magazines. In interviews from newspaper articles. On forums during the earliest days of the internet. Even by many who wrote fawningly over TNG in the media while being brutal towards TNG (especially one particular reviewer for USA Today who later moved over to TV Guide....maybe that was Matt Roush). Deep Space Nine took a beating from Trek fandom. Even VOY was greeted initially with open arms from the rest of Trek fans because it followed the Trek formula and wasn't repeating Deep Space Nine's "mistakes". DS9 fans had to live with the fact that Paramount seemed perfectly willing to ignore it compared to its shipbound Trek shows. I cannot come close to conveying how bad it was for DS9 and how much crap it had to take from Trek fans in general, especially during its first four to five years. DS9 fans had to develop some tough skin. So when I read remarks without any context that Niners have some sort of superior attitude it makes me want to throw up.

With that said as a Niner myself I love TNG. TNG got things going again and I have fond memories of it even if it doesn't hold up all that well in some regards. It comes in third just behind DS9 and B5 and ahead of TOS, SGU and Space Above and Beyond.
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Old May 18 2013, 07:09 PM   #114
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

R. Star wrote: View Post
TNG definitely has the better actors, but DS9 got graced with better writers so they had better characters in the end.
IMO TNG doesn't even have that. From top to bottm DS9's ensemble of performers is stronger. Even if I conceded that Stewart was the top performer overall, I still think DS9 could have seven of the top ten performers if we were compliling and rating actors from both shows at once. And that only includes the regular staff. If we tossed in recurring actors for DS9 (such as those who played Garak, Dukat, Martok, etc) and how big of a part they played in the DS9 tapestry, it becomes even more of a slaughter.
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Old May 18 2013, 07:54 PM   #115
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

NKemp3 wrote: View Post
TheGodBen wrote: View Post
I'm not sure if you've noticed, but Niners have a reputation for acting somewhat superior, and it has recently been put to me that Niners frequently badmouth TNG.
No offense...but ::bleep:: this. I am old enough to remember DS9 being DISMISSED by TOS and especially TNG fans during its run. In letters to Trek magazines. In interviews from newspaper articles. On forums during the earliest days of the internet. Even by many who wrote fawningly over TNG in the media while being brutal towards TNG (especially one particular reviewer for USA Today who later moved over to TV Guide....maybe that was Matt Roush). Deep Space Nine took a beating from Trek fandom. Even VOY was greeted initially with open arms from the rest of Trek fans because it followed the Trek formula and wasn't repeating Deep Space Nine's "mistakes". DS9 fans had to live with the fact that Paramount seemed perfectly willing to ignore it compared to its shipbound Trek shows. I cannot come close to conveying how bad it was for DS9 and how much crap it had to take from Trek fans in general, especially during its first four to five years. DS9 fans had to develop some tough skin. So when I read remarks without any context that Niners have some sort of superior attitude it makes me want to throw up.

With that said as a Niner myself I love TNG. TNG got things going again and I have fond memories of it even if it doesn't hold up all that well in some regards. It comes in third just behind DS9 and B5 and ahead of TOS, SGU and Space Above and Beyond.
I remember those days. I was one of those fans...for the first season. And I remember everyone telling us that it wasn't Star Trek. That it lacked any moral center. That it was no TNG. That they didn't like the dark tone. That it didn't have good sets. I caught episodes every once in awhile from 2-3 seasons. By the time the 4th rolled around, it was must-see, tape-every-episode television.
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Old May 18 2013, 08:47 PM   #116
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

I remember a letter from a reader published in the UK Star Trek magazine in which they basically condemned the magazine for devoting an issue to the end of DS9. The individual ended the letter with the threat of not buying the magazine again and predicting the magazine would go out of business if they did the same again. I thought it was insane. They didn't specify if they were a TOS, TNG fan or a VOY fan, although I would wager they they were a Voyager "fan"; since DS9 and VOY were competitors at the time.

Star Trek really does not need "fans" like that.
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Old May 19 2013, 02:35 AM   #117
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

tomalak301 wrote: View Post
R. Star wrote: View Post
Well I voted for I love both, but I do prefer DS9 to TNG.

TNG definitely has the better actors, but DS9 got graced with better writers so they had better characters in the end.
Was it better writers or more free writers? The more I watch the Blu Rays for TNG, the more I think how egomaniacal Gene Roddenberry was and I wonder if Gene was completely hands off, how much better TNG would have been.
Well Gene pretty much handed the reigns over to Berman by season 2. Season 3 and up is when TNG started getting better. But as great as their episodes were, there weren't many continual story arcs.
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Old May 19 2013, 03:36 AM   #118
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

Up until the Dominion War started I liked TNG better than DS9. After that, I was sold on DS9. The change had probably actually started happening with the introduction of the Jem'Hadar but it was the full blown war that locked DS9 in for me for good and it's now my favorite Trek series.

TNG is still my second favorite series. And despite the fact that I didn't like Roddenberry's perfect humans stuff and DS9's take on characters was more up my alley, the TNG crew remain my favorite crew. I do think that DS9 did a much better job handling an ensemble cast though.
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Old May 19 2013, 05:56 AM   #119
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

I didn't grow up watching Star Trek so to say, I started watching Voyager at the end of its run and in re-runs late at night, and didn't delve deep into the Trek universe until the last film came out so I'm sort of a new fan, but with two, maybe three exceptions I've seen every episode of TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT, and without a doubt, DS9 is the best.

That being said, and I think this has already been touched on but DS9 would not have been what it is without its predecessors. What makes DS9 so special is the way the show is set up to explore the Trek universe, and the writers weren't afraid to explore the dark aspects. They took the building blocks of the Federation we got to know and turned it on its head. Without the other series you don't fully understand the world that is being explored. I also feel that out of all the series, it's the one most relevant to the issues we faced/face in the 20th/21st centuries, and for the most part they approached them well.

Each of the series has their faults and we all know there are at least a dozen of terrible episodes (Masks anyone?) but as a whole the Star Trek television series are done better than the average show that airs on television right now. So I voted that "TNG is ok and I have no strong feelings", although I am re-watching the series on Netflix right now and am quite enjoying myself.

The nail in the coffin for me is that Gul Dukat has to be the best villain to have ever graced television screens.
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Old May 19 2013, 12:22 PM   #120
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Re: How do Niners feel about TNG?

I grew up on TOS and TAS, and learned much of my English via captain Picard. But DS9 remains my favourite Trek series because of its developed characters and storylines. It's more complex and compelling to me.

And then they made Voyager.
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