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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old May 18 2013, 12:41 PM   #16
Allyn Gibson
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Re: Generations was...

Johnny wrote: View Post
...one of the best scored Star Trek films in it's history, musically it has produced some of the most memorable motifs.
I'd put the score in the top three in the original series of films. (Cliff Eidelman's Star Trek VI I put at the top; his score was so good his career never recovered. Then either Goldsmith's Star Trek: The Motion Picture score or Horner's Star Trek II score.) What makes Dennis McCarthy's score for Generations stand out is that after six years of being told to write "sonic wallpaper" by Rick Berman, he finally got to write a score, and it's like every idea he had locked away finally bubbled to the surface. It's certainly an effective score, and his main theme feels like Star Trek while going in its own direction.
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Old May 18 2013, 01:36 PM   #17
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Re: Generations was...

Allyn Gibson wrote: View Post
I'd put the score in the top three in the original series of films. (Cliff Eidelman's Star Trek VI I put at the top; his score was so good his career never recovered. Then either Goldsmith's Star Trek: The Motion Picture score or Horner's Star Trek II score.) What makes Dennis McCarthy's score for Generations stand out is that after six years of being told to write "sonic wallpaper" by Rick Berman, he finally got to write a score, and it's like every idea he had locked away finally bubbled to the surface. It's certainly an effective score, and his main theme feels like Star Trek while going in its own direction.
While the Generations score had some brilliant moments, the choir for example is exceptional, personally I found it didn't really ascend to the levels of Goldsmith or Horner. The fact that some material was reused in DS9 didn't help matters either.

In regards to the film, Moore and Braga both admitted that 'All Good Things' was the superior effort even though the finale had far shorter development period. The only real issue I have is with the destruction of the Enterprise being done so poorly. From a production stance I can see why they had too however, the Galaxy class and its sets were designed for 4:3 television and didn't translate well at all to the 2.35:1 aspect ratio whereas the Enterprise E looked excellent and its sets had much more width.
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Old May 18 2013, 03:37 PM   #18
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Re: Generations was...

Johnny wrote: View Post
...one of the best scored Star Trek films in it's history, musically it has produced some of the most memorable motifs.

IMO it was written with a feeling of history to it, looking back over the many years of TNG and their friendships. Something that I think was lost when the ent-e came around.

Also, since there's a box to fill, I think it was one of the best shot as well, everything from the depth of colour on the bridge to the flood yellow of ten forward.

For me it was the film that made space feel big again, that there was a lot going on, and that space-action doesn't have to be the thing that pushes along the story. Picards personal loss had so much depth to it.

Would love to hear thoughts on it?

Agreed. I loved it. My favorite STAR TREK film to date, with the most epic feel to it (sorry nuTREK... ). It feels larger than life.
It is beautifully filmed, sad and melancholic. I also love the soundtrack (get the expanded OST released last Septemper, it has some of the best cues in there, which were previously unreleased).

My favorite TREK film. And it doesn't age as the TOS films (with the exception of TUC) do. It still looks awesome after almost 20 years.
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Old May 18 2013, 09:00 PM   #19
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Re: Generations was...

...bland.
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Old May 19 2013, 03:18 PM   #20
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Re: Generations was...

As a film score, it was good. I certainly enjoy it.

It is far from the best, IMO.
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Old May 19 2013, 08:24 PM   #21
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Re: Generations was...

Generations was a bloated tv episode, looked like a bloated tv espisode and sounded like a bloated tv episode. It's a wonder there was any Star Trek after it.
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Old May 20 2013, 12:30 AM   #22
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Re: Generations was...

Lance wrote: View Post
Carcazoid wrote: View Post
Star Trek is like pizza. When it's good, it's really good. When it's bad, it's still pretty good.
Generations is like one of those pizzas which the delivery guy has delivered ten minutes late. And when you open the box you find it's gone cold and all the cheese and the toppings have got stuck to the lid.
And even though it's got all the ingredients you asked for, it just doesn't work.

"Generations" had a lot of potential, but it suffered from having a completely unfocused mess of a script built around a laundry list ("...Kirk, ship blows up, Best Villain Since Khan[TM], Klingon sisters, Data's emotion chip, Enterprise B, Guinan...").

At the time I hated the music. I thought it sounded too much like the TV series drone and I couldn't help but compare it to the excellent bombastic percussions of the STVI score. But I came to appreciate the score years later.
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Old May 20 2013, 01:27 AM   #23
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Re: Generations was...

xvicente wrote: View Post
Generations was a bloated tv episode, looked like a bloated tv espisode and sounded like a bloated tv episode. It's a wonder there was any Star Trek after it.
Because it felt like a bloated TV episode, it was (IMO) the only one of the TNG films that really felt like you were watching something authentically TNG. Therefore Generations will always be my favourite of the TNG film by default, despite it being such a massively flawed and under-whelming mess.
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Old May 20 2013, 02:40 AM   #24
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Re: Generations was...

Alignment X wrote: View Post
Therefore Generations will always be my favourite of the TNG film by default, despite it being such a massively flawed and under-whelming mess.
???
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Old May 20 2013, 02:43 AM   #25
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Re: Generations was...

Alignment X wrote: View Post
xvicente wrote: View Post
Generations was a bloated tv episode, looked like a bloated tv espisode and sounded like a bloated tv episode. It's a wonder there was any Star Trek after it.
Because it felt like a bloated TV episode, it was (IMO) the only one of the TNG films that really felt like you were watching something authentically TNG. Therefore Generations will always be my favourite of the TNG film by default, despite it being such a massively flawed and under-whelming mess.
I agree completely with that.
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Old May 20 2013, 03:56 AM   #26
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Re: Generations was...

Johnny wrote: View Post

1. Because in BOBW, you knew, like every other episode that everyone was going to be just fine. Which kinda takes the tension out of it.
That's not true at all. As a matter of fact, at the time of BoBW, there was serious debate whether Patrick Stewart was going to return, since he had always felt that the producers were going to fire him. At the time, NO ONE knew if Picard was going to die or not.

2. It's about life. The sisters have been running around plotting revenge in a BoP while bargaining with a mad man wanting to blow up a planet. It changes the basic of everyone in the Federation liking teddy bears and fondue.
I still have no idea what you're talking about here. How are the Duras sister's actions in this movie any different from their actions in the show? And how does this change how other people live their lives in the 24th century?

3. My point is, Sauron wasn't after the Enterprise, it just got in the way, which makes space feel like the Ent isn't the only ship out there, making space bigger, expanding the universe, etc, showing that people off the ship actually exist. Imagine a TV series like NCIS where the lead characters were targeted for assassination each week. Implausible and boring through repetition.
First of all, it's "Soran." Sauron is the bad guy from Lord of the Rings.

Second, Soran had nothing to do with the destruction of the Enterprise. A lucky shot from an old Klingon Bird of Prey did that.

Third, whatever point you're trying to make here still eludes me.

4...It's true that only a few of the cast got exhibition, but you can't have all the crew going through a difficult time as it will be ridiculous.
And yet that's what happened in Star Trek '09, and that worked out beautifully.
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Old May 20 2013, 06:00 AM   #27
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Re: Generations was...

Johnny wrote: View Post
...one of the best scored Star Trek films in it's history, musically it has produced some of the most memorable motifs.
To be honest, it rather amazes me to read that because I thought Generations had one of the most forgettable movie scores I've ever heard. I have trouble remembering any of the melody even while I'm watching the film. It really strikes me as a continuation of the musical wallpaper that we heard for years on the TV show. I say that despite the fact that I enjoy that film quite a bit.

But hey, different melodies obviously work for different people. If that score grabs you, that's cool.
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Old May 20 2013, 06:08 AM   #28
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Re: Generations was...

I always liked the music they played when they were riding the horses.
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Old May 20 2013, 12:00 PM   #29
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Re: Generations was...

Just watched the movie last night.
The best thing about the movie was the music, I really love it.
And ofcourse the ENT-D was a beauty.
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Old May 21 2013, 03:13 AM   #30
Johnny
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Re: Generations was...

Dukhat wrote: View Post
Johnny wrote: View Post

1. Because in BOBW, you knew, like every other episode that everyone was going to be just fine. Which kinda takes the tension out of it.
That's not true at all. As a matter of fact, at the time of BoBW, there was serious debate whether Patrick Stewart was going to return, since he had always felt that the producers were going to fire him. At the time, NO ONE knew if Picard was going to die or not.

2. It's about life. The sisters have been running around plotting revenge in a BoP while bargaining with a mad man wanting to blow up a planet. It changes the basic of everyone in the Federation liking teddy bears and fondue.
I still have no idea what you're talking about here. How are the Duras sister's actions in this movie any different from their actions in the show? And how does this change how other people live their lives in the 24th century?

3. My point is, Sauron wasn't after the Enterprise, it just got in the way, which makes space feel like the Ent isn't the only ship out there, making space bigger, expanding the universe, etc, showing that people off the ship actually exist. Imagine a TV series like NCIS where the lead characters were targeted for assassination each week. Implausible and boring through repetition.
First of all, it's "Soran." Sauron is the bad guy from Lord of the Rings.

Second, Soran had nothing to do with the destruction of the Enterprise. A lucky shot from an old Klingon Bird of Prey did that.

Third, whatever point you're trying to make here still eludes me.

4...It's true that only a few of the cast got exhibition, but you can't have all the crew going through a difficult time as it will be ridiculous.
And yet that's what happened in Star Trek '09, and that worked out beautifully.
Haha, right, let's try again!

1. You say 'no one', but you mean, 'the people you spoke to, what you read and the stuff you watched'. I don't really call that definitive unless you worked in casting.

IMO, there's a fairly standard track record within Star Trek where you don't, or very VERY rarely kill of a lead character (Yar), and if it does happen then what they call 'dramatic' is at the end of a series (Tucker), when it doesn't really matter. That's pretty steady over so many episodes. And BoBW just proved the point that you can stick as many tubes in to as many holes as you like, but the show must go on... next week... with little or no long term downwards effects to the rating.

Or maybe it's because I'm a re-run baby (ie: was crapping into nappie sacks when this was made) and watched it when tv production had advanced a little more in. Yet... voyager...

2. I don't mean that the universe actually changes, I mean the viewers perception of the universe changes. Their characters were behaving in a way which showed that not everywhere in the Star Trek universe and especially places so 'close to home' are that couchy-safe-environment that TNG peddled for so long. (and for the record, I like TNG, better than I like the other series, I just like Generations more.)

3. I never said that SawRon Weasley ever destroyed or had anything to do with the destruction of the enterprise - expect for that bit where he tortured LaForge, put an implant in his visor so the sisters could destroy the ship bit - but still, I never said it. Just said the Enterprise got in the way. Hence the point I'm trying to make about the universe not revolving around this one ship, other stuff happens which doesn't involve them, making it feel like there's more going on and generally making space... feel... big. Which is why I like the film...

4. Well were just going to have to disagree on that 2009 Star Wars film. But since this is about Generations, lets stay away from that.

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