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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old May 15 2013, 10:17 PM   #61
Christopher
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

Caligula wrote: View Post
Also, the Enterprise was capable of traveling much faster than Warp 10, well before it was established that this was the unattainable speed that would you to "occupy every point in space at the same time."
That wasn't settled on until TNG, and not until after the early first season (since Geordi said in "Where No One Has Gone Before" that they were passing warp 10). Roddenberry arbitrarily decided that warp 10 should be an absolute cosmic speed limit, and then the tech people decided to equate it with infinite speed -- which, if you think about it, is the exact opposite of a speed limit. Which has confused a generation or more of fans, since using a finite number to represent infinity is sending mixed messages.

(The reason you'd occupy every point at the same time at infinite speed is because any number divided by infinity is zero -- or rather, the limit of n/x as x approaches infinity is zero -- so the infinite-speed travel time between any two points regardless of distance would be zero. Basically it's just an unnecessarily complicated way of saying "infinite speed," another way that the explanations of warp 10 just confused the issue.)
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Old May 15 2013, 11:14 PM   #62
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

It's just easier to assume the warp scale was redefined by the time of TNG.
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Old May 15 2013, 11:45 PM   #63
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

^Well, yes, it's a given that the warp scale was redefined in the TNG era, given the numerous references to speeds above warp 10 in TOS and TAS. I'm just saying it was redefined in a pretty silly way, which mainly came down to Roddenberry's ill-conceived insistence on a "speed limit" that wasn't really a limit at all.
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Old May 15 2013, 11:52 PM   #64
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

... and then there's warp 13, from All Good Things.... Another recalibration? A breakthrough?
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Old May 16 2013, 12:10 AM   #65
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

A warp ten mutated wizerd-lizard did it. That would make more sense than anything in Alternative Factor. The episode is amusing with a few beers, though.
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Old May 16 2013, 03:50 AM   #66
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

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While I'm in the minority in my liking for this one, I'm also in the minority for my absolute dislike for City on the Edge of Forever and The Inner Light, two episodes most fans seem to love, although what the hell for is anybody's guess. I personally think they were two of the worst things Star Trek ever did.
COTEOF and Inner Light are about character, while TAF is about a concept. That's probably why you're in the minority opinion with respect to all these episodes.
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Old May 16 2013, 04:26 PM   #67
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

Pavonis wrote: View Post
RandyS wrote: View Post
While I'm in the minority in my liking for this one, I'm also in the minority for my absolute dislike for City on the Edge of Forever and The Inner Light, two episodes most fans seem to love, although what the hell for is anybody's guess. I personally think they were two of the worst things Star Trek ever did.
COTEOF and Inner Light are about character, while TAF is about a concept. That's probably why you're in the minority opinion with respect to all these episodes.
Yeah, could be. But I also enjoy character-based episodes, just not in either of those cases.
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Old May 17 2013, 01:54 AM   #68
marsomthing
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

So I've been a member here for less than a month, this topic is exactly why I joined. I love seeing how much you all know about the episodes. I can't even remember guest character names let alone rules, laws, and EVERYtHInG in between. It makes me want to be a bigger fan! I never second guess what I see, Ill have to watch TOS all over. It'll be like the first time again!!

My question is would it be a good idea to start a topic like this on every episode just for people to weigh in them? Likes, dislikes and whatnot. I would love to get in on something like that!


As for TAF I had never thought twice about it, I liked the idea of the episode. Never looked into what made sense or logical to the Star Trek world. I just had fun while watching it! I'll go back to that one tonight.
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Old May 17 2013, 12:01 PM   #69
Gov Kodos
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

marsomthing wrote: View Post
So I've been a member here for less than a month, this topic is exactly why I joined. I love seeing how much you all know about the episodes. I can't even remember guest character names let alone rules, laws, and EVERYtHInG in between. It makes me want to be a bigger fan! I never second guess what I see, Ill have to watch TOS all over. It'll be like the first time again!!

My question is would it be a good idea to start a topic like this on every episode just for people to weigh in them? Likes, dislikes and whatnot. I would love to get in on something like that!


As for TAF I had never thought twice about it, I liked the idea of the episode. Never looked into what made sense or logical to the Star Trek world. I just had fun while watching it! I'll go back to that one tonight.
If you really want to rewatch the series and have a commentary on the episodes as you go along, you should start a thread to that purpose. 'New fan watches Trek' or some title to that effect. As to how you approached this episode, that's fine. I can enjoy any TOS episode pretty much. Some more than others, of course, but all of them have something to enjoy either as dramas in their own right, or just as goofy fun.

Enjoy the series just as you're doing, any show is more fun that way. TOS has its faults, every series ever made does, and no series will hold up to a hostile viewing no matter how lauded. I'll look forward to your review thread should you decide to give that a go.
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Old May 17 2013, 01:52 PM   #70
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

marsomthing wrote: View Post
So I've been a member here for less than a month, this topic is exactly why I joined. I love seeing how much you all know about the episodes. I can't even remember guest character names let alone rules, laws, and EVERYtHInG in between. It makes me want to be a bigger fan! I never second guess what I see, Ill have to watch TOS all over. It'll be like the first time again!!

My question is would it be a good idea to start a topic like this on every episode just for people to weigh in them? Likes, dislikes and whatnot. I would love to get in on something like that!


As for TAF I had never thought twice about it, I liked the idea of the episode. Never looked into what made sense or logical to the Star Trek world. I just had fun while watching it! I'll go back to that one tonight.
Welcome aboard

Start a thread about anything you have a question about, or have your own thread just for your reviews as Gov Kodos suggested. Whatever you like - I am sure everyone will be interested to hear your thoughts and answer any questions you have.
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Old May 17 2013, 07:58 PM   #71
marsomthing
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

Thanks for the welcome everybody! I will have to start on my great Trek rewatching. I agree with you Gov Kodos, I can have fun watching any of them. Even my least favorite I still enjoy the characters!

Anybody recommend any DVDs that have good commentary on them? From directors, cast, or writers that may shine a better light on the Trek universe.
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Old May 31 2013, 04:22 AM   #72
Praetor Baldric
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

Christopher wrote: View Post

And then there's the beard. Let's not even talk about the beard.
See, for me the beard is one of the few good things about this episode.
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Old May 31 2013, 06:20 PM   #73
BennieGamali
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

Big Daddy wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post

And then there's the beard. Let's not even talk about the beard.
See, for me the beard is one of the few good things about this episode.
The beard was quite amusing. I think the beard was what made him seem insane to me. I liked the episode well enoug. Not my fave. But it was entertaining.
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Old June 1 2013, 01:44 AM   #74
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

Confusion

Confusion, I was confused when I first saw TAF at the age of 10

Every time I have viewed it since, I am now 52, most recently a few weeks ago, I am still confused

Two Lazarii, both barking mad, both at large on the ship, inane fight scenes, drunken man stumblings from not very high cliffs for no apparent reason, not once but twice.

Then a silly wee ship that supposedly travels through time and alternative versions of space.

An actor who was plainly shit, Brown, a regular cast who were not too enamoured with a shit script.

"And what of Lazarus ?"

And what...............

Not in the same league of casual badness as "A Piece of the Action" for example, but bad enough.
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Old June 1 2013, 02:57 AM   #75
marsomthing
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Re: "The Alternative Factor" - Why is it so universally hated?

I watched it again after reading through the reasons it is horrible... Yes all those reasons are very valid... But I still have fun watching it, I can't help but enjoy it. It's the cheese factor I enjoy sometimes. The idea behind the episode is great... With more work and planning could have been amazing!


Big Daddy wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post

And then there's the beard. Let's not even talk about the beard.
See, for me the beard is one of the few good things about this episode.
Yes the beard pushes the limits of cheese in this! It looks like a mix between raj agul from batman with the hair of I don't even know!!

Someone mention earlier the half completed door of the ship... I thought it was more like a doorway to the other dimension than broken/unfinished prop... Ie kirk walking through it passing into good laz place..?
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