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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old May 3 2013, 09:31 PM   #46
WarpFactorZ
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

King Daniel wrote: View Post
Your "evidence" amounts to measuring inaccurate and low resolution fan art, and obsolete assumptions based on pre-reboot Trek.
You gave me a link to the "correct" (higher resolution) version, whose attributes are the exact same size.

Franklin wrote:
-- Length: 2500 feet (only 103 feet from 2397, maybe someone rounded up, but it's not 1200 feet, either).
So there's still no internal consistency. Got it. How can I argue with a measurement that's never the same twice?
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Old May 3 2013, 09:54 PM   #47
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

I remember watching the movie in 2009 and it's going along, and I'm focusing on the ship, and thinking about all the things I do and don't like about the redesign, and I guess it looks okay and then the shuttle bay doors open and HOLY CRAP! WHAT THE...??!? Just how big is this thing? And honestly, the very next thing that popped into my head was this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTwz-mlJPL0
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Old May 3 2013, 10:03 PM   #48
WarpFactorZ
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

greenlight wrote: View Post
I remember watching the movie in 2009 and it's going along, and I'm focusing on the ship, and thinking about all the things I do and don't like about the redesign, and I guess it looks okay and then the shuttle bay doors open and HOLY CRAP! WHAT THE...??!? Just how big is this thing? And honestly, the very next thing that popped into my head was this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTwz-mlJPL0
Bingo!
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Old May 3 2013, 10:18 PM   #49
Franklin
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

WarpFactorZ wrote: View Post
King Daniel wrote: View Post
Your "evidence" amounts to measuring inaccurate and low resolution fan art, and obsolete assumptions based on pre-reboot Trek.
You gave me a link to the "correct" (higher resolution) version, whose attributes are the exact same size.

Franklin wrote:
-- Length: 2500 feet (only 103 feet from 2397, maybe someone rounded up, but it's not 1200 feet, either).
So there's still no internal consistency. Got it. How can I argue with a measurement that's never the same twice?
Once it was established in production, it's been consistent. I posted some of this before, but:
-- The length of the Enterprise (2397.75 feet) is given in the 2009 Blu-ray movie feature piece "Starships".
-- The same final size is given in the book "Star Trek -- The Art of the Film".
-- According to Memory Alpha, Bob Plant of Round 2 Models gives the same length.
-- ILM verifies it (they're the ones who scaled it up in the first place).
-- The most conclusive thing is the Polar Lights Enteprise is 11.5 inches long. It says it's 1/2500 scale on the box. Take 2397 feet times 12 to get inches and divide that by 2500 and you get 11.5 inches. A 1/2500 scale model of a 1200 foot ship would be only 5.75 inches long.

The established size is 2397.75 whether it makes sense or not.
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Old May 3 2013, 10:18 PM   #50
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

WarpFactorZ wrote: View Post
King Daniel wrote: View Post
Your "evidence" amounts to measuring inaccurate and low resolution fan art, and obsolete assumptions based on pre-reboot Trek.
You gave me a link to the "correct" (higher resolution) version, whose attributes are the exact same size.
Which are still based on false assumptions. The bridge window is an absolute. The shuttles and shuttlebay are absolute. What we've seen of the ship's interior is absolute. None of which jibes with the numbers you came up with. None of which indicate a ship the size of the TOS or TMP Enterprises.
Franklin wrote:
-- Length: 2500 feet (only 103 feet from 2397, maybe someone rounded up, but it's not 1200 feet, either).
So there's still no internal consistency. Got it. How can I argue with a measurement that's never the same twice?
How can you argue it's the same size as the old Enterprise when there is so much overwhelming evidence that it's significantly larger? There comes a point when you're ignoring every single VFX shot - and you are there.
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Old May 3 2013, 10:32 PM   #51
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

The Enterprise is a vehicle of the imagination not a real starship. Does it's size in relation to other fantasy starships really matter?
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Old May 3 2013, 10:44 PM   #52
Franklin
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

BillJ wrote: View Post
The Enterprise is a vehicle of the imagination not a real starship. Does it's size in relation to other fantasy starships really matter?
Yes. ( )
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Old May 4 2013, 12:30 AM   #53
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

BillJ wrote: View Post
The Enterprise is a vehicle of the imagination not a real starship.
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Old May 4 2013, 12:31 AM   #54
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
The Enterprise is a vehicle of the imagination not a real starship.
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Old May 4 2013, 06:07 AM   #55
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

BillJ wrote: View Post
The Enterprise is a vehicle of the imagination not a real starship. Does it's size in relation to other fantasy starships really matter?
Probably at least as much as the size of the flying monkeys in OZ, or the size of the firebelcher in GODZILLA. Benchmarks of credibility enhance an enterprise rather than detract from it.
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Old May 4 2013, 10:36 AM   #56
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

BillJ wrote: View Post
The Enterprise is a vehicle of the imagination not a real starship. Does it's size in relation to other fantasy starships really matter?
What annoys me is the arrogance of fanboys who insist they know better than the people who made the movie. The people who can see the enourmous engine room and go, "that's a mistake" because it wouldn't fit in the 1966 or 1979 versions of the Enterprise, despite those who made this one saying for four years now that they made it much bigger.
trevanian wrote: View Post
Probably at least as much as the size of the flying monkeys in OZ, or the size of the firebelcher in GODZILLA. Benchmarks of credibility enhance an enterprise rather than detract from it.
But too many are confusing "benchmark of credibility" with "the way it used to be."

Can anyone give me one good reason why the new Enterprise can't be 700+ meters long? I've heard "It doesn't make sense." but absolutely no reasoning why beyond it being a change from the old. The windows are too big? One look at the ship and you see they're the same size as the one on the bridge. Is that too big? Does one of Roddenberry's rules stipulate a standard window size for Federation starships? The hatches are too big? I posted pictures showing that wasn't the case. Too many decks? Based on what??

In-universe and out of universe, there is NO reason why they can't have resized the Enterprise, or build even bigger starships like the Vengeance. None at all.
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Last edited by King Daniel Into Darkness; May 4 2013 at 02:29 PM.
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Old May 4 2013, 04:42 PM   #57
YellowSubmarine
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

King Daniel wrote: View Post
Can anyone give me one good reason why the new Enterprise can't be 700+ meters long? I've heard "It doesn't make sense."
If it's 700+ meters long, how do you get rid of all the tribbles? It took nearly forever on the original one, I don't envy those who would be doing the job on the new one.
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Old May 4 2013, 04:55 PM   #58
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

^NuTrek will have those TAS-sized giant tribbles, keeping the tribble/Enterprise ratio intact.
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Old May 4 2013, 05:59 PM   #59
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

King Daniel wrote: View Post
^NuTrek will have those TAS-sized giant tribbles, keeping the tribble/Enterprise ratio intact.
Keenser would probably eat most of them anyway.
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Old May 4 2013, 06:16 PM   #60
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Re: Starship Size Argument™ thread

Didnt know there is such a large amount of size queens here ;-) Don't shoot me down, but does it really matter how big it is? Its what you do with that counts...
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