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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

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Old April 29 2013, 10:20 PM   #16
Emh
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Christopher wrote: View Post
Emh wrote: View Post
...The Doctor said in this very episode that the TARDIS is infinite (and has said this in previous stories, if I recall correctly).
Which contradicts what was established in the original series. In "Full Circle," Romana mentioned the TARDIS's total mass, which was about the same as the fully loaded mass of the Titanic. And in "Castrovalva," the Doctor jettisoned 25% of the TARDIS's interior architecture to burn off enough mass to escape a galactic collapse. So at the time, it was decidedly finite in extent.
True, but I'm also pretty sure it was described as infinite in the classic series, too.
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Old April 29 2013, 10:55 PM   #17
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

I would prefer to think that each Tardis runs off its own Eye of Harmony. That's a lot more powerful sounding that every single aspect of Time Lord civilization running off a single black hole.
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Old April 30 2013, 12:10 AM   #18
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Emh wrote: View Post
True, but I'm also pretty sure it was described as infinite in the classic series, too.
I just searched Chakoteya's Doctor Who transcript site for the word "infinite" (by googling "infinite site:http://www.chakoteya.net/DoctorWho/"), and didn't find any such instances. No luck with "endless" or "limitless" either.

Anyway, people often use "infinite" figuratively to refer to things that are mathematically finite but vast enough to be effectively limitless from the observer's point of view. Actual infinity is a rather untenable concept when it comes to physical reality anyway. It's easy to say the word, but harder to grasp its true meaning or ramifications. So it's always best to be skeptical when you hear anyone using the word.
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Old April 30 2013, 12:16 AM   #19
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Rudy Rucker had a great book called Infinity and the Mind which I really like--as the old OMI artwork spread about how some infinities are larger than others.

I assumed the Tardis was a tessaract and that it's shell is a cosmological defect called a texture.

If for no other reason than I can see Matt exclaiming "Defect?"
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Old April 30 2013, 12:18 AM   #20
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Timelord_Victorious wrote: View Post
Tom wrote: View Post
Perhaps with the destruction of Gallifrey and other Tardis's. The Doctors Tardis is now using the entire pocket universe including the Eye. It could have been there was only one pocket universe but it was divided up between other Tardis's and Gallifrey thus giving each Tardis finite size to use. With Gallifrey and other Tardis's now gone, the Doctor's Tardis expanded to take up the whole pocket universe space, and is now seemingly infinite in size and contains the Eye since Gallifrey can't anymore.
Infinity minus infinity is still infinity.

I think when he said the TARDIS is infinite he wasn't talking about it's physical size. That would make no sense.
More like that the TARDIS can always add another room an infinite number of times but at any point the total number of rooms would still be finite and countable in theory.
Yeah, I took it to be potentially infinite rather than actually infinite.
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Old April 30 2013, 08:54 AM   #21
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

5 converted 25 percent of the TARDIS into thrust to escape the gravi-temporal pull from the explosive formation of the Milkyway.
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Old April 30 2013, 09:07 AM   #22
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Christopher wrote: View Post
Emh wrote: View Post
True, but I'm also pretty sure it was described as infinite in the classic series, too.
I just searched Chakoteya's Doctor Who transcript site for the word "infinite" (by googling "infinite site:http://www.chakoteya.net/DoctorWho/"), and didn't find any such instances. No luck with "endless" or "limitless" either.
Hm, maybe I'm misremembering. I want to say it was during the Tom Baker era because I think it was a reference prior to Castrovalva when The Fifth Doctor ejects a percentage of the TARDIS (and, come to think of it, also sometime before Romana gives the TARDIS an approximate weight).

Christopher wrote: View Post
Anyway, people often use "infinite" figuratively to refer to things that are mathematically finite but vast enough to be effectively limitless from the observer's point of view. Actual infinity is a rather untenable concept when it comes to physical reality anyway. It's easy to say the word, but harder to grasp its true meaning or ramifications. So it's always best to be skeptical when you hear anyone using the word.
Quite right and I recognize that it's quite difficult to properly grasp the full meaning of "infinite." But considering how crazy some of the concepts Doctor Who has over the years, I'm willing to swallow the idea that perhaps the TARDIS interior is infinite.
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Old April 30 2013, 11:00 AM   #23
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Christopher wrote: View Post
Emh wrote: View Post
True, but I'm also pretty sure it was described as infinite in the classic series, too.
I just searched Chakoteya's Doctor Who transcript site for the word "infinite" (by googling "infinite site:http://www.chakoteya.net/DoctorWho/"), and didn't find any such instances. No luck with "endless" or "limitless" either.

Anyway, people often use "infinite" figuratively to refer to things that are mathematically finite but vast enough to be effectively limitless from the observer's point of view. Actual infinity is a rather untenable concept when it comes to physical reality anyway. It's easy to say the word, but harder to grasp its true meaning or ramifications. So it's always best to be skeptical when you hear anyone using the word.
Try The Masque Of Mandragora, they showed the exact scene where the Doctor told Sarah Jane that the TARDIS is infinite in the special before Pyramids Of Mars.
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Old April 30 2013, 11:11 AM   #24
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

You can search all the scripts there at the same time.

http://www.google.co.nz/search?q=sit...A&start=0&sa=N

The word infinite or infinitely had never been used in relation to the TARDIS' dimensions until last week.

Wasn't 4 and Adric measuring the TARDIS' 26 dimensions... Might have been Lagopolis?
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Old April 30 2013, 11:17 AM   #25
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
Wasn't 4 and Adric measuring the TARDIS' 26 dimensions... Might have been Lagopolis?
Lagopolis? Isn't that in Nigeria?
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Old April 30 2013, 12:47 PM   #26
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

The Mirrorball Man wrote: View Post
Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
Wasn't 4 and Adric measuring the TARDIS' 26 dimensions... Might have been Lagopolis?
Lagopolis? Isn't that in Nigeria?
"Dear friend, I am writing to you with a proposal that will be to our mutual benefit. My father was a Timelord who fought in the Time War. Unfortunately as a result our entire family fortune is now Timelocked, however it may be possible for an ephemeral such as yourself to aid in transfering this large sum of money out of the vortex and into a UK bank account..."
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Old April 30 2013, 01:06 PM   #27
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Starkers wrote: View Post
The Mirrorball Man wrote: View Post
Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
Wasn't 4 and Adric measuring the TARDIS' 26 dimensions... Might have been Lagopolis?
Lagopolis? Isn't that in Nigeria?
"Dear friend, I am writing to you with a proposal that will be to our mutual benefit. My father was a Timelord who fought in the Time War. Unfortunately as a result our entire family fortune is now Timelocked, however it may be possible for an ephemeral such as yourself to aid in transfering this large sum of money out of the vortex and into a UK bank account..."
So that's what he meant when he said the Lagopolitans were good with numbers!
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Old April 30 2013, 01:08 PM   #28
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

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Old April 30 2013, 02:30 PM   #29
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Emh wrote: View Post
Hm, maybe I'm misremembering. I want to say it was during the Tom Baker era because I think it was a reference prior to Castrovalva when The Fifth Doctor ejects a percentage of the TARDIS (and, come to think of it, also sometime before Romana gives the TARDIS an approximate weight).
Well, yes, I just mentioned those specific references yesterday in post #9 of this thread! And you already replied to it!
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Old April 30 2013, 10:11 PM   #30
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Re: How Big is the Eye of Harmony? (spoilers Journey to the center TAR

Yeah, like I said. Bad memory.
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