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Old April 27 2013, 08:54 PM   #16
Robert Maxwell
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Jax wrote: View Post
Its a cheap attempt to block 2nd hand games (I don't buy them personally) but publishers make money off them now with online/season passes + normal DLC, so they don't need to block them. It would also cost a HUGE amount of people their jobs worldwide as retail game sellers would take a huge hit. Never mind my internet going down, what happens if XBL goes down?
Yeah, Gamestop makes about half their income from used game sales. It would pretty much ruin them if it became routine to block used games.
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Old April 27 2013, 10:19 PM   #17
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post

Yeah, Gamestop makes about half their income from used game sales.
I'm pretty sure about 90 percent of GameStop's net profit comes from used sales, since the margins are so slim on new games -- from a $60 new game, GameStop keeps maybe $6 of that, with the rest going to the publisher and especially the distributor. This is why GameStop is so huge on pre-orders, as those pre-orders are essentially an interest-free loan that lets the company operate while waiting for used game sales to come in.
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Old April 27 2013, 11:08 PM   #18
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Of course with MS neither really confirming or denying the rumours about the next X-Box being always online. It's generating a decent amount of publcity(at least amongest potential consumers), all of it free.
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Old April 27 2013, 11:17 PM   #19
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Indeed. That's why I find all this speculation tedious. No one here knows if it actually will be "always online."
Speculating about the future of your hobby is sorta something that people do. You said that you don't own any modern consoles and you're not planning on buying any in the near future. You're not a console gamer so clearly this holds little interest to you. Fair enough.

Others here like me are console gamers and we are interested in the future of the console industry. A bombshell like the Xbox 720 requiring an online connection would be a major game changer, so the rumours (which are coming from multiple reliable sources) are worth discussing.
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Old April 28 2013, 12:23 AM   #20
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Infern0 wrote: View Post
I live in rural New Zealand and have a fantastic broadband connection that i've never had any problems with

it's shocking to me that much richer more advanced countries like canada and the US would have worse internet???
They're really, really big countries, together they're almost an entire continent. Regardless of how rich and powerful they are, the challenge of providing broadband internet to everyone across an continent is considerably more complex than providing it to a couple of million people on some relatively small islands.

To make matters worse for the US, their haste to roll broadband out across the country allowed the formation localised monopolies. In some areas, particularly rural areas, there's only one available ISP, and the lack of competition means there's little incentive to improve the network infrastructure for those customers.

But even if the US and all nations across the world had excellent broadband services available, an always-online game console is still an offensive concept. It has nothing to do with piracy and nothing to do with providing a better service to customers. It has everything to do with giving Microsoft greater control over what content we consume and providing them an assured outlet for advertising.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Indeed. That's why I find all this speculation tedious. No one here knows if it actually will be "always online." Even if Microsoft says it is, what does that actually mean? How much flexibility is there? Again, no one here knows. Just seems like there's a whole lot of Sony fanboying going on, instead.
I don't think the backlash against this rumour has been because of fanboyism, many of the loudest critics have been Xbox 360 owners, including myself. I don't want to switch consoles to the PS4 next generation, I'd lose everything associated with my Xbox account, but if MS does decide to implement this crazy feature then I will end up having to switch. Hopefully the rumour isn't true, but Microsoft does have a history of pig-headedly pushing unpopular features onto consumers to further their wider agenda, which is something we've seen most recently with the way they handled Windows 8's new interface. I see this backlash as a shot across their bow to warn them not to pursue this feature.
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Old April 28 2013, 01:09 AM   #21
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

^You do know that in some parts of the UK what Ofcom call Market 1 telephone exchanges, BT is in effect the sole provider of broadband, if you have a Market 1 exchange the other ISPs simply use BT's equipment. I.e. the exchange is too small for their equipment abd/or it's not cost effective for them to put it in. Many of these Market 1 exchanges are still on ADSL(upto 8Mb) tech, Market2 and maybe 3 are on ADSL2+ (upto 20Mb). Yet people on Market 1 still pay the same line rental to BT who have upgraded other exchanges. Though to be far to Ofcom the price BT can charge other ISP's on Market 1 exchanges actually has to go down several percent each year to sort of incentivise the upgrade. Not that the end user sees this reduction in cost. I would say Ofcom didn't go far enough though. BT doesn't want to upgrade my exchange fair enough. If the charge on ADSL2+ exchange was £20pm, on an ADSL they should only be allowed to charge £8pm. And I'm stuck on it until at least sometime in 2014 when the exchange is planned for upgradeing to fibre as part of the BDUK project.

Ok rant over.
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Old April 28 2013, 01:16 AM   #22
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Especially since Sony is on the record stating that the PS4 won't disable used games.
This is untrue.[/QUOTE]

No, it's true

http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/2013/...n-play-on-ps4/

And while its true that Microsoft has confirmed nothing, I trust the sources that the "always online" and "disabled games without internet" rumors are coming from. Not to mention, Microsoft fired an executive level employee for stating his opinion on the matter of always connected electronic devices on social networks. The fact that several sources in the media confirmed that Microsoft postponed their announcement in order to retool messaging about the new console... All of that smoke means fire.
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Old April 28 2013, 02:48 AM   #23
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

MacLeod wrote: View Post
Of course with MS neither really confirming or denying the rumours about the next X-Box being always online. It's generating a decent amount of publcity(at least amongest potential consumers), all of it free.
Sim City generated a lot of free publicity as well.
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Old April 28 2013, 03:34 AM   #24
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

I'd imagine Microsoft would be denying the hell out of these rumors if they weren't true. As it stands, their deafening silence has me thinking that even if they back down now, they'll add this "feature" post-launch.
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Old April 28 2013, 05:30 AM   #25
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Microsoft isn't going to go around confirming or denying rumours based upon internet flame wars (even if a participant was a Microsoft employee). I'm sure most companies have an official policy of not reacting to rumours.
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Old April 28 2013, 08:34 AM   #26
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Kelthaz wrote: View Post
Infern0 wrote: View Post
No but what i'm saying is unless you are living there, what is the issue?
There's plenty of issues.

Sim City and Diablo 3

I'm very confident that my internet connection will hold up, but I am concerned with Microsoft's ability to uphold their end of the bargain by providing servers that are up 24/7.

Older Games

Hey, you know what? I feel like playing some Sonic the Hedgehog 2 for the Genesis. I'll just pop the cart in, turn the power on, and wait while my system connects to the official Sega Server. Wait, what's this? Sega has shut down their servers? My entire library of Genesis games is now and forever dead?

Used Games

As in no more used games. Took a risk buying that $60 title and hated it? Would like to sell it and put the money towards a new game? Well, tough luck. I guess you'll have to take less risks in the future and only buy games that you're 100% sure you'll love. Say goodbye to developers taking chances and trying something new with their games! Say hello to endless sequels!

No advantage to consumers

You might be okay with the first three points I made, but you're not getting anything in return for these losses. There is no advantage, no matter how small or insignificant, to consumers here. It's all just a way for Microsoft to eliminate used games and enforce harsher DRM in an attempt to prevent piracy.
Thanks for typing that up.. it was point for point the exact summary i was going to write and i agree 100%

If they go ahead with an always on 720 i'll not even look any further and grab a PS4 non-always on console for the first time in my life and i'll be voting with my wallet.. the only protest companies really react to.

Kelthaz wrote: View Post
Microsoft isn't going to go around confirming or denying rumours based upon internet flame wars (even if a participant was a Microsoft employee). I'm sure most companies have an official policy of not reacting to rumours.
Sometimes they do because rumors have a bad habit of sticking around if they are not adressed properly and in time. That MS didn't debunk the rumor is very telling and the rumors are getting denser each day that MS went with an always on design. All the reacted to was the tone of the rumor and the jackass style this dude presented himself while being a high ranking MS employee.. he tarnished MS's reputation and they only distanced himself from him but did not deny the rumor itself.
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Old April 28 2013, 11:00 AM   #27
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Yes but if they denied the rumour that the next Xbox is always online, people would stop talking about the next Xbox until it's offical announcement. By not saying anything it's generating discussion, comment etc.. It might be a case because they haven't denied it, for every page printed about the PS4 the next Xbox is getting 2 or 3 pages.
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Old April 28 2013, 03:11 PM   #28
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Sure but as i said negative press sticks around and this (despite the realities) impacts MS negatively and no company wants to be portrayed in a negative light since it almost always impacts the bottom line.

Personally i believe MS is not reacting because a) it's true but they're not ready yet to admit it (waiting for their professional reveal where they can try and spin it into a positive thing) or b) given the overwhelming negative reaction to the rumor are actively thinking about changing the XBox especially after Sony has announced the PS4 won't need an internet connection to play games and it will be playing older games (at least at first.. i fully expect them to roll back that feature in a year or so). The second option is far less likely.. i'm no tech expert but i also don't know if it's technically possible to do so at this late point in the development cycle.

So i guess MS is keeping low, hoping that May 21st and E3 will be a success and gamers will calm down and just bitch to their friends on Facebook and boards like these.
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Old April 28 2013, 04:19 PM   #29
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

MacLeod wrote: View Post
Of course with MS neither really confirming or denying the rumours about the next X-Box being always online. It's generating a decent amount of publcity(at least amongest potential consumers), all of it free.
It's pretty much made my mind up to switch back to playstation though (I've noticed a lot of people saying the same thing), so it seems a bit daft to let the rumours persist if they aren't true.

Why would you let the rumours continue if you weren't seriously considering it?
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Old April 28 2013, 06:02 PM   #30
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Re: Regarding next X-Box and "always online"

Which was said prior to the quote in the link I posted. So Sony executives are contradicting each other, meaning we know nothing.

And while its true that Microsoft has confirmed nothing, I trust the sources that the "always online" and "disabled games without internet" rumors are coming from.
Believe them all you want, I'm just saying that you shouldn't be calling things "facts" when they are, at this point, merely rumors and speculation. There are literally no known facts about the next Xbox outside of its existence.
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