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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old April 25 2013, 02:15 PM   #31
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

First of all, in this context "stealth" refers to technologies employed to evade detection by enemy sensors. It has nothing to do with crew size or a specific mission.

Second, Vengeance has a very small crew - much smaller than that of Enterprise. Enterprise, BTW, has more than a thousand crew.

On the scale of the Universe and of FTL travel, of course, there's no substantial difference in size between Enterprise, Vengeance or the Galileo 7 - they're all tiny.
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Old April 25 2013, 02:38 PM   #32
The Wormhole
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

Maybe I'm missing something, but there's still one key detail we still don't know: Vengeance's registry number. This is important.
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Old April 25 2013, 02:43 PM   #33
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Maybe I'm missing something, but there's still one key detail we still don't know: Vengeance's registry number. This is important.
There is no registry number. Section 31 has improved efficiency by putting the zero directly in front of the name. USS 0Vengeance.
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Old April 25 2013, 02:50 PM   #34
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

Gep Malakai wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Maybe I'm missing something, but there's still one key detail we still don't know: Vengeance's registry number. This is important.
There is no registry number. Section 31 has improved efficiency by putting the zero directly in front of the name. USS 0Vengeance.
And by using tiny black stealth f0nt.
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Old April 25 2013, 03:01 PM   #35
Hartzilla2007
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
No, this time I actually am serious. I didn't know this ship is intended to be a stealth ship. Doesn't being twice the size of the oversized Enterprise work against that? A stealth ship should as small as possible, to better avoid detection.
Tell that to the TNG era Romulans who are going around being stealthy in a freaking Warbird thats bigger than the Enterprise-D.
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Old April 25 2013, 03:47 PM   #36
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
No, this time I actually am serious. I didn't know this ship is intended to be a stealth ship. Doesn't being twice the size of the oversized Enterprise work against that? A stealth ship should as small as possible, to better avoid detection.
Tell that to the TNG era Romulans who are going around being stealthy in a freaking Warbird thats bigger than the Enterprise-D.
And bigger than the nuEnterprise. But that's ok, I guess.
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Old April 25 2013, 05:31 PM   #37
Mad Jack Wolfe
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

It's not the size that matters, but the motion of the Cumberbatch. Whatever the hell that means.

I think I just Guy Gardenered myself.
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Old April 25 2013, 08:05 PM   #38
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

that is one mother of a ship i'll say. and i thought Enterprise was big. i always thought it was the prelude to the excelsior class.
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Old April 25 2013, 08:46 PM   #39
137th Gebirg
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

Intriguing. There are a lot of assumptions and complaints being (sometimes angrily) thrown about regarding this ship:
  • That it's stealthy: Is it really based on some kind of new stealth technology? What evidence is there for this assertion?
  • That it's "painted" a dark color: Some have said that it would be a waste of time and materials to paint something that large, and that such a paint job would be in violation of some established Starfleet color palette. If the first assertion of "stealth" is correct, then is it not possible that the standard duranium hull is coated with some kind of engineered polymer that would provide it with stealth capabilities? Even more possible, the hull plating might be made from a different kind of experimental material entirely, other than duranium, that happens to be a naturally darker color - no painting necessary. And is this the only reason why people think it's "stealthy" (see assumption #1)? Are ships in this timeline even still using duranium?
  • It's from Section 31: Says who? While I wouldn't mind a Section 31 involvement, as its foundation canonically happened before the timeline split, I have heard of no official statement that Section 31 is, in fact, involved.
  • That it's Starfleet: People are complaining about the name Vengeance not "being very Starfleet", nor is its overall aggressive design. We don't even know if Starfleet (or Section 31) was even involved in the construction of this vessel. Some have suggested that there was some possible Klingon involvement in its design and construction. I believe this to be highly likely due to the obvious known involvement of Klingons in the movie. Others have speculated that this might be something taken from the Mirror Universe. While I'm thinking the latter supposition is less likely, it still wouldn't be terribly problematic if its existence is properly explained.
  • It doesn't have a registry number on the hull: Some submarines in the American navy (and I'm sure others) don't always have registry numbers painted on their sails, intentionally, to prevent them from being identified by prying eyes during a sensitive assignment. Could not Starfleet embrace a similar policy towards their own vessels? It would tie in to the "Section 31" involvement of a covert and "stealthy" nature.
In short, let's just wait and see what happens, shall we?
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Last edited by 137th Gebirg; April 25 2013 at 09:04 PM.
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Old April 25 2013, 09:04 PM   #40
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

I don't think it's supposed to be a sneaky steath ship rather it's a huge freaking battleship designed to bring a lot of firepower to bear.

greenlight wrote: View Post
Apologies in advance if this has been discussed elsewhere but is there any info/speculation on the small, roundish ship that the crew uses on Kronos? Captain's yacht maybe? A newer shuttle? A loaner from starfleet? A klingon ship they acquired/commandeered/stole?
It may be the civilian ship acquired in the Countdown to Darkness comic book.
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Old April 26 2013, 01:51 AM   #41
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

137th Gebirg wrote: View Post
Intriguing. There are a lot of assumptions and complaints being (sometimes angrily) thrown about regarding this ship:

*snip*

In short, let's just wait and see what happens, shall we?
Agreed. How dare anyone who hasn't seen the film bide their time with idle assumptions while they wait for the films release.

*sits back twiddling thumbs*
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Old April 26 2013, 02:30 AM   #42
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
Gep Malakai wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Maybe I'm missing something, but there's still one key detail we still don't know: Vengeance's registry number. This is important.
There is no registry number. Section 31 has improved efficiency by putting the zero directly in front of the name. USS 0Vengeance.
And by using tiny black stealth f0nt.
"Every time I press one of these black controls, labelled in black on a black background, a little black light lights up black to let me know I've done it"

or better yet

"Well, the thing about a black hole - its main distinguishing feature - is it's black. And the thing about space, the colour of space, your basic space colour, is black."

Seriously, if there's an extra zero anywhere, The Wormhole will no doubt have to dust off his old AV.
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Old April 26 2013, 03:00 AM   #43
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

^^It's certainly been dusted off, that's for sure.
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Old April 26 2013, 12:37 PM   #44
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

I think it's reasonable to discuss how useful this ship would be in battle. We have seen in Star Trek how small ships are able to defeat larger ships, i.e. the Defiant against the Lakota and, in the mirror universe, the Defiant against the Regent's flagship. In my analysis, I, also, include real world history.

This ship is built to counter Klingon aggression. The Klingons have Bird-of-Preys that are fast, maneuverable ships. Smaller ships can overwhelm a larger ship. I once saw in a picture a pod of orcas taking down a blue whale. This behemoth is a blue whale waiting to be taken down by Klingon orcas.

Personally, I am repulsed by this trend in Star Trek towards ridiculous large ships and stations. None of the ships in the last three films I feel have the elegance and grace of the original Enterprise, or the warlike majesty of the K't'inga-class warships. I don't want cool; I want and desire a ship that inspires in me an emotion other than
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Old April 26 2013, 12:52 PM   #45
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Re: SPOILER - Other Starship Revealed

throwback wrote: View Post
This ship is built to counter Klingon aggression. The Klingons have Bird-of-Preys that are fast, maneuverable ships. Smaller ships can overwhelm a larger ship.

That's why fleets, Klingon or otherwise, don't have just one type of ship but various ships in size and purpose. To work together, cover each others ass in all sorts of senarios.
You build Vengeance to counter the various huge Narada types that make quick work of your smaller ships, like we saw in ST09. And you build smaller ships to counter the various more maneuverable Bird of Prey types.

Vengeance is just another arrow in the quiver.
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