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Old April 20 2013, 08:25 PM   #16
J. Allen
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
Goddamn Japanese kids. Pure evil.
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Old April 20 2013, 08:56 PM   #17
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

J. Allen wrote: View Post
bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
Goddamn Japanese kids. Pure evil.
Crayon Shin-chan is a useless little motherf##@&r
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Old April 20 2013, 09:01 PM   #18
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
This is 100% hate and racism. Despicable.
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Old April 20 2013, 09:04 PM   #19
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

J. Allen wrote: View Post
bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
Goddamn Japanese kids. Pure evil.
It's the sushi that's the real threat. And the Asahi beer. Who knows what that could do to Western democracy?
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Old April 20 2013, 09:07 PM   #20
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

TorontoTrekker wrote: View Post
J. Allen wrote: View Post
bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
Goddamn Japanese kids. Pure evil.
It's the sushi that's the real threat. And the Asahi beer. Who knows what that could do to Western democracy?
Their crappy electronics will keep them from doing any real damage.
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Old April 21 2013, 12:37 AM   #21
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

Regardless of where one stands on the debate over the necessity of the use of the atomic bombs on Japan, it's never something that should be celebrated. Those were dark days, and to revel in it or use it to make some hateful and ignorant diatribe (see bigdaddy's post below) is distasteful in the extreme, even if you fully agreed with their use or just thought they were a necessary evil.

It's not just because it was the atomic bomb, either. I would say the same of anyone commemorating the firebombings of Dresden or Tokyo as well. Though strangely, at least in the case of Dresden, people seem to get that doing that would be wrong even more so than they do with celebrating the atomic bombings. I guess people excuse it to themselves where it comes to Japan because of the vengeance factor over Pearl Harbor and the war and also the fact that, as mentioned, Japan has whitewashed a lot of their uglier actions before and during the war, whereas Germany made great strides in owning up to what they did and growing as a country in the aftermath of WWII. But Japan's choice of how to remember their actions in WWII is no excuse for us to celebrate a horrific act and weapon ourselves, which is in itself sort of whitewashing things.

You can commemorate the aircraft and celebrate or memorialize the air crews of WWII just fine without doing the same for the bombings themselves. I'm hoping that whomever arranged for this display was simply attempting to do the former and neglected to see how the latter would come off, rather than actively trying to celebrate it. My great uncle was killed in the bombing campaign over Germany and my grandpa was a paratrooper training for the invasion of Japan when the bombs were dropped (and went there subsequently), so it's hardly as if I don't understand having mixed feelings about the subject.

bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
Do me a favor. I know it goes against the rapid fire ignorant and offensive comment making persona you've built up for yourself around here, but perhaps in the future you should take a moment and contemplate just what it is that you're saying before hitting the submit button. Try being thoughtful and reasonable for a little while, see how it fits.

Until then...

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Old April 21 2013, 12:52 AM   #22
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

edit: ^Well said.

OdoWanKenobi wrote: View Post
I came in here expecting to see that someone had taken an Onion article seriously.
Ditto.

bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
Millions of lives were saved, yes. But you can't tar every citizen with the crimes committed by the military and conclude they "deserved" it or were pure evil; it's a poor representation of reality. War is a horrendous undertaking and many die on both sides that don't deserve it.
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Old April 21 2013, 01:26 AM   #23
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

sojourner wrote: View Post
^missing the point.
Yeah I did. I jumped the gun after I read US air show canc...

then I didn't read anymore of it. My fault.

To the topic at hand, I'm surprised it was even planned at all.
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Old April 21 2013, 01:39 AM   #24
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

J. Allen wrote: View Post
bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
Goddamn Japanese kids. Pure evil.
On a serious note, the Japanese still revere some we think of as war criminals and do not understand western attitudes to Japans past.

This doesn't, of course, make Japanese youth evil, but it does make them horribly ignorant.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21226068
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Old April 22 2013, 07:24 PM   #25
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

On a related note, what do people think of seeing the bombing of Pearl Harbor being recreated at various air shows? I've seen this particular display at least twice, and personally (being in the aerospace industry and an aircraft nut), I just loved seeing the old warbirds flying around, both American and Japanese.

There's two things I can think of that would make this an acceptable display in most people's eyes versus the Hiroshima bombing: conventional vs nuclear bombs, and military vs civilian targets. Other opinions?
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Old April 22 2013, 09:12 PM   #26
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

bigdaddy wrote: View Post
It's not as stupid of an idea as it sounds, and it is part of our history. I don't think they should do it, but people need to understand that the Japanese were pure evil. It's not like "Americans are bad, Japanese didn't deserve it", they deserved it, we saved millions of lives from not having to invade and killing everything that moves on Japan's main island.
While the Japanese Army in WW2 was more brutal then Western non-political Armies as they really didn't have Western norms and values about warfare using terms like evil to describe an entire population is decidedly unhelpful.

Concepts that an entire population is evil is a thing of ugly wartime propaganda and its best left there.


Last edited by Locutus of Bored; April 22 2013 at 09:40 PM.
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Old April 22 2013, 09:32 PM   #27
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

^ Your point is correct and well intentioned, but it could have been made just as effectively without posting the actual racist propaganda or at least posting it as a link or behind spoiler code. We shouldn't whitewash our history by any means, but I'm not sure the TrekBBS where people often post from work and school is the appropriate venue to post it openly. I put it in spoiler code just in case.

B.J. wrote: View Post
On a related note, what do people think of seeing the bombing of Pearl Harbor being recreated at various air shows? I've seen this particular display at least twice, and personally (being in the aerospace industry and an aircraft nut), I just loved seeing the old warbirds flying around, both American and Japanese.

There's two things I can think of that would make this an acceptable display in most people's eyes versus the Hiroshima bombing: conventional vs nuclear bombs, and military vs civilian targets. Other opinions?
Also, there's the difference between being the inflictor and the inflictee. I don't see anything wrong if a country wants to commemorate a morally dubious attack where they were the victims (like us and Pearl Harbor), but it takes on a more distasteful atmosphere if you're celebrating something where you were the ones behind the morally questionable attack, like with us dropping the atomic bombs. Even if you feel their use was justified under the circumstances, it shouldn't be celebrated.

Japan celebrating the attack on Pearl Harbor as a great victory would upset many people as well. However, if both sides memorialized it as a somber event without celebration, there shouldn't be a problem. And indeed, that's how it was treated by Americans and the many Japanese tourists when I visited Hawaii. I'm not sure how it's treated in Japan, though.
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Last edited by Locutus of Bored; April 22 2013 at 09:43 PM.
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Old April 22 2013, 11:32 PM   #28
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
I would say the same of anyone commemorating the firebombings of Dresden or Tokyo as well.
I trust you would feel the same when it comes to commemorating in a negative and celebratory manner the long running Blitz on London and the destruction of other British cities including Coventry.
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Old April 22 2013, 11:50 PM   #29
Locutus of Bored
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

Dimesdan wrote: View Post
Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
I would say the same of anyone commemorating the firebombings of Dresden or Tokyo as well.
I trust you would feel the same when it comes to commemorating in a negative and celebratory manner the long running Blitz on London and the destruction of other British cities including Coventry.
Absolutely not. Due to my longstanding grudge against the British for the Revolution and the burning of Washington in the War of 1812 (despite most of my family not even living in America yet), I would recommend that people go out and dance a jig to celebrate the Blitz and Coventry, because it makes total sense that I would suddenly take the complete opposite position toward our chief friend and ally despite everything else I've said in the thread.

Any other stupid questions?
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Old April 23 2013, 12:00 AM   #30
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Re: U.S. air show cancels plans to reenact atomic bombing of Japan

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
Dimesdan wrote: View Post
Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
I would say the same of anyone commemorating the firebombings of Dresden or Tokyo as well.
I trust you would feel the same when it comes to commemorating in a negative and celebratory manner the long running Blitz on London and the destruction of other British cities including Coventry.
Absolutely not. Due to my longstanding grudge against the British for the Revolution and the burning of Washington in the War of 1812 (despite most of my family not even living in America yet), I would recommend that people go out and dance a jig to celebrate the Blitz and Coventry, because it makes total sense that I would suddenly take the complete opposite position toward our chief friend and ally despite everything else I've said in the thread.

Any other stupid questions?
I knew you wouldn't just say yes, it's not in your nature to only use one word when you think several dozen will do nicely and to top it off, use a petty passive aggressive smiley.

For the record, it was a question, a simple one and yes, maybe a bit of a misguided one, but one I felt like asking as that little bit I quoted, kinda irked me, and by the way I asked the question, I assumed you may have seen that, but I guess not.
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