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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old April 18 2013, 01:07 PM   #31
Jeyl
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

JessDD wrote: View Post
Richey was probably saved by exercising the same relative effort a human gives to a drying earthworm when lifting it off the sidewalk and dropping it on the grass on the divider, and forgotten in an eyeblink.

Excellent point.
Except if you were to apply the same logic with what went on with the aliens in this episode, it's picking up a worm off a street and putting it in a can of dirt and leaving it inside of a dark and freezing meat locker. There's help, and than there's that. Even as a kid still in his single digits I knew that a worm's place was in the dirt.
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Old April 18 2013, 09:36 PM   #32
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

Jeyl wrote: View Post
JessDD wrote: View Post
Richey was probably saved by exercising the same relative effort a human gives to a drying earthworm when lifting it off the sidewalk and dropping it on the grass on the divider, and forgotten in an eyeblink.

Excellent point.
Except if you were to apply the same logic with what went on with the aliens in this episode, it's picking up a worm off a street and putting it in a can of dirt and leaving it inside of a dark and freezing meat locker. There's help, and than there's that. Even as a kid still in his single digits I knew that a worm's place was in the dirt.
Maybe they're going fishing.
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Old April 19 2013, 04:36 AM   #33
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

When Data is rolling his 19 straight passes he looks like he's having a lot of fun. Is he really enjoying himself or putting on an act?
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Old April 19 2013, 01:31 PM   #34
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

Captrek wrote: View Post
When Data is rolling his 19 straight passes he looks like he's having a lot of fun. Is he really enjoying himself or putting on an act?
If he's enjoying himself, he knows how to act like a human.
If he's putting on an act, he understands what he's doing enough to act like a human.

However you spin it, Data has successfully become more human, but it will never be brought up again after this episode. Why? Well, like many questions this episode brings up, it's never answered.
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Old April 19 2013, 04:31 PM   #35
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

I just want to know which states are 51 and 52?
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Old April 19 2013, 05:31 PM   #36
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

One of those episodes where I can see and agree with every flaw but the childhood nostalgia is enough to carry me through it and I wind up enjoying it with a goofy grin on my face. Mainly because, despite the inherent stupidity of the situation there's enough good, albeit very silly, lines to keep it fun as well.

A pity that this (with Manhunt as well IIRC) drove Trome away from the series, he had a nice ear for comedy the show would perhapds lack in later years. Though the set up of this and the Big Goodbye suggest he perhaps wasn't that interested in the regular format for Star Trek.

A sign of how pissed he was at some of the people he worked with on the show is there's a minor recurring character in early Sliders who is a complete dick called Hurley who (according to the DVD commentary on the pilot) is named in honour of someone we all name and love that he considered had a similar personality.
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Old April 19 2013, 07:50 PM   #37
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

The Royale is one of the best comedy episodes in the series IMO.

Yeah they messed up the science. But who cares? It's Star Trek. Most of the science is made up and nobody seems to complain that in NuTrek, creating a black hole increased the gravity at a fixed radius from the center of the planet without increasing the mass. (Unless that red bubbly stuff weighed about ten times the mass of Vulcan! Black holes are not magic supergravity damn it! They're just so dense that you can get magnitudes closer to the center of gravity than you can for normal objects!)

I don't think the aliens' decision is that much of a stretch, by comedy episode standards. No more ridiculous, at least, than Samaritan Snare, which is forgiven because it is also a comedy episode.
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Old April 19 2013, 11:01 PM   #38
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

JirinPanthosa wrote: View Post

Yeah they messed up the science. But who cares? It's Star Trek. Most of the science is made up and nobody seems to complain that in NuTrek...
We all know that only The Royale and Star Trek 2009 have bad science in the Star Trek franchise.
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Old April 20 2013, 12:56 AM   #39
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

Heck, Voyager escaped a black hole by using the ship's weapons to punch a hole in the event horizon. Star Trek has long since left behind the days when most of the fans actually cared about science.
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Old April 20 2013, 06:15 PM   #40
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

Jeyl wrote: View Post
JessDD wrote: View Post
Richey was probably saved by exercising the same relative effort a human gives to a drying earthworm when lifting it off the sidewalk and dropping it on the grass on the divider, and forgotten in an eyeblink.
Excellent point.
Except if you were to apply the same logic with what went on with the aliens in this episode, it's picking up a worm off a street and putting it in a can of dirt and leaving it inside of a dark and freezing meat locker. There's help, and than there's that. Even as a kid still in his single digits I knew that a worm's place was in the dirt.

I don't think they realized that's what they were doing. They found Richey with a personal possession which contained a story. Obviously this book had personal importance to him, otherwise he wouldn't be carrying it with him.

So they extrapolated that the story in the book may have been some sort of personal desire for him. They created the environment, and put him in it. For all they knew, they were putting him in a good place.
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Old April 21 2013, 08:54 PM   #41
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

JessDD wrote: View Post
I don't think they realized that's what they were doing.
If these aliens aren't capable of understanding what they were doing, how than are they capable of understanding the concept of 'help'? If these aliens had this kind of power but lacked the knowledge of what 'fiction' means, these aliens should have destroyed the galaxies by now.

There's really nothing creative going on here in this episode. All I see here is Maurice Hurley taking a story and stripping away all the creative parts just to make a "Crew trapped in a casino" story and that's it. Anything involving questions as to why anything is happening is simply written off as "We may never know". Again, those types of plot devices aren't a bad thing, but it gets to the point where there is so much of it going on that you really get the sense that the writers are just being lazy. And you can't really paint these writers as the creative type if they think ending the episode with Picard saying we may never solve Fermat's theorem... even though we did.
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Old April 21 2013, 09:18 PM   #42
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

Jeyl wrote: View Post
JessDD wrote: View Post
I don't think they realized that's what they were doing.
If these aliens aren't capable of understanding what they were doing, how than are they capable of understanding the concept of 'help'?
If we accept Timo's hypothesis that the aliens are far above us in intelligence and technology and very alien, then it's probably useless to speculate on their actions and motives, which are probably beyond our understanding.


And you can't really paint these writers as the creative type if they think ending the episode with Picard saying we may never solve Fermat's theorem... even though we did.
That's unfair. The episode aired six years before the proof.
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Old April 21 2013, 09:39 PM   #43
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

This episode has one of my favorite TNG quotes.

"What planet is this?"
"I beg your pardon?"
"This planet. What do you call it?"
"Earth. What do you call it?"
"We call it Theta VIII."
"How charming."

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Old April 22 2013, 11:30 AM   #44
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

Captrek wrote: View Post
That's unfair. The episode aired six years before the proof.
For a show that loves to bask in how awesome and perfect humanity has become (and even saying we might become god like one day), I find it silly how the writers believed that humanity still wouldn't be able to figure out Fermat's theorem in 300 years. Sure, at the time this episode aired it wasn't solved, but now that there's proof, the use of it excusing poor writing just adds to the laziness of the writing.
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Old April 22 2013, 11:47 AM   #45
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Re: Episode of the Week: 2x12 "The Royale"

Jeyl wrote: View Post
Captrek wrote: View Post
That's unfair. The episode aired six years before the proof.
For a show that loves to bask in how awesome and perfect humanity has become (and even saying we might become god like one day), I find it silly how the writers believed that humanity still wouldn't be able to figure out Fermat's theorem in 300 years. Sure, at the time this episode aired it wasn't solved, but now that there's proof, the use of it excusing poor writing just adds to the laziness of the writing.
I really think you're simply complaining to be complaining in this case.
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