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Science Fiction & Fantasy Farscape, Babylon 5, Star Wars, Firefly, vampires, genre books and film.

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Old April 15 2013, 07:09 PM   #976
Sindatur
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

I think you're confusing the Clone Wars with Episode 2and 3 Live Action Movies, that's where Anakin is whiny, he's not whiny at all in TCW? And his Padawan Asohka, I like quite a bit, not sure what you see as annoying about her.

Yea, that was actally a 4 episode arc, I believe, and I just finished that over the weekend, yea, that was a great arc, and even though that Jedi was a such a jerk, it was a surprise what he was really up to.
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Old April 15 2013, 07:22 PM   #977
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Asohka is just annoying. she's spunky teenage sidekick #45657. Anakin is an ass, even if admittedly his whining isn't in full display. Of the clone wars, I've watched

The movie
The 4 episode arc with the Jedi killing clones
the episode with the Sepritists having a ship with a giant ion cannon
most of an episode where Obi Wan infiltrated a prision in someone else's identity
A part of an episode where Ashoka rescues aliens like herself
Part of an episode with young annoying bald Boba Fett
bits and pieces of other episodes

And the only good thing was the 4 episode arc with none of the main cast. The rest was just not great. It doesn't help that the CGI looks pretty bad (although its amazing compared to shows like Green Lantern TAS), but that wouldn't even be an issue if it was generally written well.
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Old April 15 2013, 09:57 PM   #978
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

If you're into EUs, kirk55555, you should check out the Babylon 5 books. The early ones weren't authorized by JMS, but then he started taking more notice and the last 11 (two standalones, three trilogies) were canon.

Of the standalones, there's:
- The Shadow Within, dealing with Anna/Morden's Z'ha'dum backstory (if I recall correctly, the non-Z'ha'dum stuff in the book isn't canon to JMS, but the backstory is)
- To Dream in the City of Sorrows by JMS' now-ex wife, showing Sinclair's story on Minbar training the Rangers during Season 2/first half of Season 3.

The trilogies are:
- The Passing of the Technomages, which shows the Shadow War from the perspective of the Technomages (including a particular one who appears in the TV spin-off, Crusade).
- The Psi-Corps, with each book covering a different time period: the creation of the Corps, the young life of Bester and Bester as an old man and war criminal.
- Legions of Fire by Babylon 5 show writer and Trek spin-off author Peter David, which shows Centauri Prime from its last ep of S5 to Londo's death, as we see Vir's rise to freedom fighter and leader.

I'd definitely recommend the Sinclair book. The Centauri ones are my favorite, but we all know how you feel about that plot thread. But who knows, maybe the fact that it's an A-to-B linear account of that story that really fleshes out the details and how those years were spent and that we see Vir's journey to someone who could reasonably become Emperor could make you feel warmer about the story.
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Old April 16 2013, 02:14 AM   #979
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

kirk55555 wrote: View Post
Asohka is just annoying. she's spunky teenage sidekick #45657. Anakin is an ass, even if admittedly his whining isn't in full display. Of the clone wars, I've watched

The movie
The 4 episode arc with the Jedi killing clones
the episode with the Sepritists having a ship with a giant ion cannon
most of an episode where Obi Wan infiltrated a prision in someone else's identity
A part of an episode where Ashoka rescues aliens like herself
Part of an episode with young annoying bald Boba Fett
bits and pieces of other episodes

And the only good thing was the 4 episode arc with none of the main cast. The rest was just not great. It doesn't help that the CGI looks pretty bad (although its amazing compared to shows like Green Lantern TAS), but that wouldn't even be an issue if it was generally written well.
Wow, I don't even know how to respond to this. I loved TCW. Ahsoka was one of my favorite character, I thought the show's version of Anakin was a good character, and I thought the Mandalorian storyline was really good. I know the Mandolorian storyline totally contradicts the books, but I haven't read the books, and even if I have I don't really have a problem with these kinds of situations.
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Old April 16 2013, 04:24 AM   #980
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Babylon 5 is epic... but also filled with a lot of details. It is not what I call easy viewing. Long story arcs that, if you're not really interested, seem to drag on. But the biggest disappointment for me was the primitive CGI. Star Trek got a face lift... sure wish they'd do the same for Babylon 5.

Anyway, Farscape is much easier to digest. Very entertaining stories and superb acting. If only they got 2-3 more seasons out of it. So much potential.
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Old April 16 2013, 01:43 PM   #981
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Gary7 wrote: View Post
But the biggest disappointment for me was the primitive CGI.
Funny how a few years pass and suddenly "amazing, cutting-edge" becomes "disappointment, primitive."
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Old April 16 2013, 02:47 PM   #982
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Lindley wrote:
Gary7 wrote:
But the biggest disappointment for me was the primitive CGI.
Funny how a few years pass and suddenly "amazing, cutting-edge" becomes "disappointment, primitive."
What do people expect with mid 90's computers? What kind of computer did people have circa 1994? Did they even have a computer? That's something people almost never keep in mind when complaining about B5's shoddy (for today) cgi.
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Old April 16 2013, 04:58 PM   #983
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Leroy wrote: View Post
What kind of computer did people have circa 1994? Did they even have a computer?
Oh come on.
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Old April 16 2013, 09:13 PM   #984
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Lindley wrote: View Post
Gary7 wrote: View Post
But the biggest disappointment for me was the primitive CGI.
Funny how a few years pass and suddenly "amazing, cutting-edge" becomes "disappointment, primitive."
Yeah, but I'll take early SFX with actual models over early CGI any day. As the mid 1990's unfolded, CGI was improving dramatically. But unfortunately B5 budgetary constraints kept it on the older CGI platform, rather than revising to adopt significant improvements. Yes, it still keeps getting better, but there is a certain degree of unrefined appearance to the earliest efforts that just looks so collegiate in comparison to what followed.
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Old April 16 2013, 11:05 PM   #985
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Gary7 wrote: View Post
Anyway, Farscape is much easier to digest. Very entertaining stories and superb acting. If only they got 2-3 more seasons out of it. So much potential.
In a "Babylon 5 versus Farscape" contest I would have to go with "Farscape" - based on consistancy. B5 lost it, in my opinion, when the writing had the character of Captain Sheridan abandon his forces in the midst of war to confront The Shadows. It may have seemed justified in JMS's head, may have looked great on paper but failed in execution. And the entire fifth seasons was terrible.

On the flip side, Farscape was true to itself, came across as fresher both in style and substance.

Also, the fact that Farscape was cancelled was a major injustice. They consistantly gave the Sci-Fi Channel it's highest ratings (for the time) with brilliant demographic performance BUT the network didn't own the show so they pulled the plug on it.
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Old April 17 2013, 12:33 AM   #986
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Danger Ace wrote: View Post
Gary7 wrote: View Post
Anyway, Farscape is much easier to digest. Very entertaining stories and superb acting. If only they got 2-3 more seasons out of it. So much potential.
In a "Babylon 5 versus Farscape" contest I would have to go with "Farscape" - based on consistancy. B5 lost it, in my opinion, when the writing had the character of Captain Sheridan abandon his forces in the midst of war to confront The Shadows. It may have seemed justified in JMS's head, may have looked great on paper but failed in execution. And the entire fifth seasons was terrible.

On the flip side, Farscape was true to itself, came across as fresher both in style and substance.

Also, the fact that Farscape was cancelled was a major injustice. They consistantly gave the Sci-Fi Channel it's highest ratings (for the time) with brilliant demographic performance BUT the network didn't own the show so they pulled the plug on it.
I've never understood how anyone could say the entire 5th Season of Babylon 5 is Terrible? I know some hated the Telepath Arc in the first half, but, you got a bold end to The Telepath Crisis, you have the excellent Neil Gaiman episode, The very Long Night of Londo Molari, A View to the Gallery, the ratcheting up of the arc at the end of the First half, the entirety of the second half especially Sleeping in Light...

There's been a couple folks who have declared they thought B5 was all about The Shadow War, and everything after that sucked
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Last edited by Sindatur; April 17 2013 at 12:51 PM.
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Old April 17 2013, 01:52 AM   #987
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Danger Ace wrote: View Post
Gary7 wrote: View Post
Anyway, Farscape is much easier to digest. Very entertaining stories and superb acting. If only they got 2-3 more seasons out of it. So much potential.
In a "Babylon 5 versus Farscape" contest I would have to go with "Farscape" - based on consistancy. B5 lost it, in my opinion, when the writing had the character of Captain Sheridan abandon his forces in the midst of war to confront The Shadows. It may have seemed justified in JMS's head, may have looked great on paper but failed in execution. And the entire fifth seasons was terrible.
How is confronting the dudes that you're at war with in an attempt tobring swift resolution to the conflict in any way abandoning your forces?
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Old April 17 2013, 02:23 PM   #988
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Gary7 wrote: View Post
Lindley wrote: View Post
Gary7 wrote: View Post
But the biggest disappointment for me was the primitive CGI.
Funny how a few years pass and suddenly "amazing, cutting-edge" becomes "disappointment, primitive."
Yeah, but I'll take early SFX with actual models over early CGI any day. As the mid 1990's unfolded, CGI was improving dramatically. But unfortunately B5 budgetary constraints kept it on the older CGI platform, rather than revising to adopt significant improvements. Yes, it still keeps getting better, but there is a certain degree of unrefined appearance to the earliest efforts that just looks so collegiate in comparison to what followed.
Some would argue that B5's innovations were part of what allowed small-screen CGI to become practical so fast. Someone had to do the legwork so everyone could benefit.
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Old April 17 2013, 04:53 PM   #989
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

B5 with updated CGI would be a real treat to see. Kickstarter anyone? If Veronica Mars can raise the money should be easy for B5.
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Old April 17 2013, 05:30 PM   #990
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Re: Farscape or Babylon 5?

Icemizer wrote: View Post
B5 with updated CGI would be a real treat to see. Kickstarter anyone? If Veronica Mars can raise the money should be easy for B5.
Problem is, because of WB's lack of file keeping, and other jacking around of the series, The CGI would have to be totally re-rendered, which would cost at least a million an episode, unfortunately, there's no way WB will ever do that
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