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Old April 7 2013, 03:40 PM   #16
JiNX-01
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

JirinPanthosa wrote: View Post
Having an episode that took place entirely in the mirror universe without any involvement from the idealistic prime-verse was a brilliant idea, but I think the most brilliant thing about it was the way they opened: Take the first contact scene from the movie and make it into a violent attack.

Might be my second favorite ENT episode after Similitude.
I loved the opening! It was magnificient!
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Old April 7 2013, 03:45 PM   #17
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

Sure, many of the MU characters are "just evil". But sometimes it happens that way. There are certain people - both in reality and in fiction - who simply ARE evil, without ambiguity. I don't see anything wrong with depicting such things.

But if you want MU characters who may not be pure evil, look at Forrest. He was a badass, true. But in the end he stayed behind and sacrificed his life so that his crew could escape the ship. That sound evil to you?
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Old April 7 2013, 04:38 PM   #18
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

The opening for In a Mirror darkly was certainly different from what I expected it to be with Zephram Cochrane and The Vulcans meeting for the First time. be.It was certainly a surprise.I really liked the music from this show.
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Old April 7 2013, 09:52 PM   #19
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
Might be my favorite ENT episode of all time, really.

I love how they used as much footage from ST:FC as possible, and only changed at the last minute. Plus they had that neat trick where, as the humans rush the Vulcan ship, mirror-Cochrane has his fist raised in triumph - obscuring his face, and thus hiding the fact that it's no longer James Cromwell playing the part.
Agree.
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Old April 9 2013, 12:45 AM   #20
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

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The FC opening scene was cool, but I thought "In a Mirror, Darkly" was awful. Why should I care about any of these people?
I don't get your point. Why shouldn't you care about any of these people?
More importantly, why do you need to care about these people? It's a one-off episode.

In IAMD Archer is just evil. And Phlox is just evil. And Hoshi is just evil. Their motives for constantly betraying one another are completely random. It doesn't feel natural. At all.
Would you say the same thing about Hamlet? I'm not, of course, comparing it to Hamlet, that would be silly. But the motivations for the betrayals seemed to me no less believable than the motivations for the evil characters in Shakespeare plays. They wanted power and they didn't care how they got it. Sure, I guess they did it with the veneer of B-action film villains. But really why wouldn't they betray each other, besides that morality thing?
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Old April 9 2013, 01:51 AM   #21
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

I cared about MU Soval.
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Old April 9 2013, 02:11 AM   #22
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

teacake wrote: View Post
I cared about MU Soval.
Mirror Soval trying to tempt Phlox with "the females' was about as convincing as the Pope lecturing someone on the merits of a whorehouse.
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Old April 9 2013, 02:15 AM   #23
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

teacake wrote: View Post
I cared about MU Soval.
MU Soval may be the only real sympathetic character in the show. Every other character is Evil with a Capital E.
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Old April 9 2013, 10:15 AM   #24
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

JirinPanthosa wrote: View Post
The Mirrorball Man wrote: View Post
King Daniel wrote: View Post
The FC opening scene was cool, but I thought "In a Mirror, Darkly" was awful. Why should I care about any of these people?
I don't get your point. Why shouldn't you care about any of these people?
More importantly, why do you need to care about these people? It's a one-off episode.
Without emotional attachment and investment, it's just a sequence of images. Dull as paint drying.
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Old April 9 2013, 10:22 AM   #25
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

King Daniel wrote: View Post
Without emotional attachment and investment, it's just a sequence of images. Dull as paint drying.
True. So I'm asking again: why don't you care about those people?
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Old April 9 2013, 01:32 PM   #26
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

I've shown ENT's MU to a few people who absolutely hated it. It took a several rewatchings for me to enjoy it, really after the superb opening it's quite boring. Yeah the end with Empress Hoshi Sato is a great line but it took a while to get there. I mainly enjoy it for looking at the ship. And seeing the green wrap around shirt again!
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Old April 9 2013, 01:49 PM   #27
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

The Mirrorball Man wrote: View Post
King Daniel wrote: View Post
Without emotional attachment and investment, it's just a sequence of images. Dull as paint drying.
True. So I'm asking again: why don't you care about those people?
I just didn't. They were unlikable. I couldn't care less if their petty little plots succeeded or failed.
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Old April 9 2013, 02:31 PM   #28
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

teacake wrote: View Post
Yeah the end with Empress Hoshi Sato is a great line but it took a while to get there. I mainly enjoy it for looking at the ship. And seeing the green wrap around shirt again!
I liked it for those reasons, plus the Mirror Dub inside of me just found it delicious to watch these familiar characters with different (in most cases evil) personalities. I thought it was great fun.

But to be honest, I was expecting the writers to bring one of the MU characters into the "normal" universe at some point -- the opposite of how the MU was introduced in TOS and DS9. DS9 did that in later episodes, but this would have been a unique way to introduce the MU on ENT. Imagine if Admiral Forrest found his way to the normal universe for several episodes, then plotted some evil plan and really screwed things up.

The other thing to remember is ENT was ended prematurely. Who knows where they would have gone with it if they had 3 more seasons.
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Old April 9 2013, 02:46 PM   #29
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

I believe one of the mirror universe stories in the Glass Empires anthology is based on Mike Sussman's original plans to continue ENT's MU. Although since I'm not a big fan of the MU, it's one corner of Trek lit I'm not too familiar with.
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Old April 9 2013, 03:15 PM   #30
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Re: In A Mirror, Darkly: Best cold open ever?

I loved the opening, probably the best since TNG's "Cause and Effect". And then going from the opening to the modified credits was icing in the cake.
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