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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Battlestar Galactica & Caprica

Battlestar Galactica & Caprica This forum was created by man. It rebelled. It evolved. And it has a plan.

 
 
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Old April 3 2013, 08:09 PM   #121
Silvercrest
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

Silvercrest wrote: View Post
DalekJim wrote:

Cain wanted to protect humans.

And she did a great job of it.
Actually I can't even be sarcastic about that. She did not want to protect humans. Her only priority was destroying Cylons, and if she had to destroy humans to do so, she was fine with that.

She had no intention of protecting anything.
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Old April 3 2013, 08:13 PM   #122
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

Locutus wins the thread. Nothing more to see here, folks, game over.
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Old April 3 2013, 08:20 PM   #123
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

but wheres the fun in not needlessly dragging it out until everyone loses all perspective?
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Old April 3 2013, 08:27 PM   #124
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

junxon wrote: View Post
but wheres the fun in not needlessly dragging it out until everyone loses all perspective?
Done.
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Old April 3 2013, 08:44 PM   #125
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

This whole thread has been an entertaining exercise in shooting barrel-bound fish.
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Old April 3 2013, 08:47 PM   #126
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

how dare you advocate fishocide!
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Old April 3 2013, 09:11 PM   #127
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

DalekJim wrote: View Post
That isn't genocide. Genocide is the systematic destruction of a race.
Cylons nuking all the colonies and trying to kill every single surviving human is not a genocide? Because that's who Cain was aiding with her actions. Give her some more time and she would have succeeded.

Cain wanted to protect humans.
She has a weird way of showing it.
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Old April 3 2013, 09:23 PM   #128
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

DalekJim wrote: View Post
Locutus of Bored wrote:
You know who else aided and abetted a genocide? Admiral Cain, by murdering civilians, crippling their ships and abandoning them to die,
That isn't genocide. Genocide is the systematic destruction of a race.
Yes, which is what the Cylons were doing to humans. Did you miss the part where I said she "aided and abetted" a genocide, not committed a genocide herself?

Getting a third of her crew killed in an obvious trap after already losing 700 people in the initial Cylon attack on the shipyards, permitting the murder of civilians by her crew directly, breaking up families who would have much needed children to continue the species, and leaving the civilian fleet crippled and vulnerable to Cylon attack were all things that benefited the Cylon's goal of the destruction of humanity.

She lacked the intent to commit genocide against her own species, but she sure as hell helped the process along.

Cain wanted to protect humans.
I miss BSG since it went off the air. Can I borrow the version you watched? I love alternate scenes, and it seems whatever you watched was entirely made up of them, because what you describe is the exact opposite of what she did in the version I saw.
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Old April 3 2013, 09:51 PM   #129
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

It's also worth pointing out that Starbuck is hardly a good judge of character, so relying on her word that the fleet was 'less safe' with Cain gone doesn't hold much water.

Cain was intended to be what Adama would have become without Roslin. It's all there in the miniseries and the coup in Season 1: he was set to leave the civilians to die at Ragnar so he could go out in a blaze of glory, fighting a hopeless battle. Given his tendencies towards authoritarianism, he could have very easily gone down the path of raiding civilian vessels for military needs.

As others have mentioned, BSG was about what it meant to be 'worthy' of survival. How much can and should we give up of ourselves in the face of horror and disaster? Cain failed her test soundly from the show's POV. It takes a fairly slanted reading to get anywhere close to admiration for her or her actions. Her treatment of her former lover in and of itself is more than enough evidence that Cain was motivated not by military need but petty revenge for being duped by a skinjob.
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Old April 3 2013, 10:28 PM   #130
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

junxon wrote: View Post
how dare you advocate fishocide!
Don't worry, we'll get Cain to protect the fish.
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Old April 3 2013, 10:42 PM   #131
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

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Old April 3 2013, 11:16 PM   #132
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

The Stig wrote: View Post
It's also worth pointing out that Starbuck is hardly a good judge of character, so relying on her word that the fleet was 'less safe' with Cain gone doesn't hold much water.
I could be wrong, but didn't Starbuck also have a personal stake in trusting Cain, namely that Cain was planning to take the fleet back to Caprica to rescue Anders and the resistance fighters?

It's not like Starbuck was looking at Cain objectively.
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Old April 4 2013, 12:01 AM   #133
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

Sorry to point this out, but the OP joined on April 1st. We might just have all fallen for a troll.
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Old April 4 2013, 12:45 AM   #134
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

diankra wrote: View Post
Sorry to point this out, but the OP joined on April 1st. We might just have all fallen for a troll.
Not a troll. She really is my favorite character on the show and I feel she gets too much crap from fans especially when put it in the context of real leaders (Lincoln, FDR, Park) who have done things much worse in war yet are lionized today. Let us not try to impugn the motives of those we disagree with. I will respond to the previous posts.
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Old April 4 2013, 12:51 AM   #135
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Re: Defending Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica(mentions Dick Che

how about putting her in the context of real leaders that havent done bad things (nelson mandela?) or been turned into lions?
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