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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Voyager

Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

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Old March 30 2013, 11:22 PM   #136
lurok
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

You must revisit the ENT forum soon . The hate is strong. It's the new geek in school. VOY is the sadsack you can't be bothered to pick on anymore except when you're bored or just want to remind everyone how badass you are (not).
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Old March 30 2013, 11:38 PM   #137
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

I've come to a point in my life where bashing anything entertainment seems trivial. Critique it and point out its flaws on an (somewhat) academic level, sure, but to write something along the lines of "Voyager sux ballz!" just for the sake of it seems like a total waste of pixels.
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Old March 30 2013, 11:52 PM   #138
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Unless you're writing that as a positive.
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Old March 31 2013, 03:23 AM   #139
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
You do understand that Sisko has always been a prophet watching all his human adventures from the comfort of the Celestial temple where he was just fucking with earlier versions of himself to preserve continuity?
That does happen to be my interpretation, but I always hesitate to mention it, as it's a really, really crappy idea. The idea that Bajor had to suffer the Cardassion occupation so that Benjamin Sisko could become a Prophet/god, but no one comments on how deeply fucked this is, well, ti's just appalling that people consider it deep.
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Old March 31 2013, 03:49 AM   #140
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

History channel. I'm watching the history channel. Not a joke, and it's a documentary about Judas' involvement in the capture of Christ. It seems that before Peter simplified and abridged the 30 something odd books on Jesus circulating around the 1st century AD, and pared it down to something similar to the bible we know now, THE HISTORY CHANNEL, but there used to be a "Book of Judas" however it was decided the blokes in the funny hats that the concepts in the book of Judas were too complicated for the common pleb to grasp that Jesus could see the future (Garden of Gethsemane, he knew the nails was coming. One in each wrist and then a third through the ankles. It's a fact.) but he still needed a trigger man to force the Romans into martyring him so that he could apotheosize and the rubes would fall in line from his perceived, and not entirely staged, sacrifice pageant.

(First ever episode of Punk'd?)

THE HISTORY CHANNEL.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_Judas

Hey look!

It's real!

Back to Star Trek.

Sisko isn't "letting" anything happen (Okay? Maybe a little.), or forcing anything to happen(possibly a smudge.), or stacking the deck and preserving continuity at great sacrifice to the lives and well being of... Everything is happening simultaneously tot he Prophets. The Occupation and the renaissance of Bajor is the same moment from their perception, the Bajoran's are suffering and free all at the same time entangled and they can't tell the difference.... Free will Sisko did every thing he wanted to which created the reality he had already existed in.

But did you notice how apt with linear time the Paugh Wraith was that possessed Kieko O'Brien? That gal must have been the poster child for normal as far as wormhole aliens go.
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Old March 31 2013, 07:17 AM   #141
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Anwar wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
Anwar wrote: View Post

The audience reaction had been far more severe and critical than any other Trek show, and far less forgiving of the same things that happen in other Trek shows too. The fans just had it out for VOY far more than anything else, so yeah it is partially the fans negative reaction.
But people HATE Enterprise. And the hate is fresher.
Sadly, no. They don't hate the show as much, it's VOY that gets the most bashing these days.
Anwar.. you really do take liberties of posting on behalf of the "audience" quite often. Sure you have your views and opinions, and do feel free to voice them. But please give us the same courtesy too. I can formulate my own opinion without your posting what it is/should be.
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Old March 31 2013, 09:54 AM   #142
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Season 2. Season 2 is where it went wrong.

Season 1 actually had a handful of episodes that dealt with the uniqueness of Voyager's situation. Sure, it was a mistake to make things as neat and clean as they already were at the end of the pilot, and having the second episode ever be a mostly routine spacial anomaly plot with a more relevant b story didn't help. But there were also signs of life in episodes like "Prime Factors" and "State of Flux", even if the latter is hurt by the useless and boring villains Seska and the Kazon ultimately became in season 2. The Kazon sucked even in season 1, but there were a couple episodes with the Vidiians, and they had potential to be interesting. Hell even Neelix got something of a standout episode in season 1 with "Jetrel", and Neelix is second only to Harry Kim on my list of most hated Voyager characters.

Looking at a list of season 2 episodes is like looking at a list of my most hated episodes ever. "Elogium". "Non Sequitur". "Twisted". "Parturition". "Resolutions". F'ing "THRESHOLD". No season of Trek is immune from having its share of failures, but this is just pushing it. "Death Wish" and "Lifesigns" are about the only two from this year I'd ever sit through again without a gun to my head, and "Death Wish" could have happened on any modern day Trek show. I'll throw in "Cold Fire" too because it actually gave Kes something to do for one of half a dozen or so times before the show cruelly threw her character under a bus.

After that the show seemed to level off. It's harder for me to judge it objectively once it became the Seven of Nine Show, because I can't for the life of me stand Seven of Nine, but I'll definitely grant that any season after 4 has more episodes I'll willingly sit through than season 2 managed.
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Old April 1 2013, 04:30 AM   #143
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

teacake wrote: View Post
Anwar wrote: View Post
USS Firefly wrote: View Post
Well that's easy, it's all the fault of the fans
The audience reaction had been far more severe and critical than any other Trek show, and far less forgiving of the same things that happen in other Trek shows too. The fans just had it out for VOY far more than anything else, so yeah it is partially the fans negative reaction.
But people HATE Enterprise. And the hate is fresher.
A lot of people don't even consider Enterprise as being Trek. That's harsh considering it IS Trek lol.

I haven't watched it yet.
I will get around to it once I finish DS9.
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Old April 1 2013, 04:32 AM   #144
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Oh you're in for a treat!

(I'm a huge ENT fan myself)
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Old April 1 2013, 04:34 AM   #145
R. Star
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Captain Kathryn wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
Anwar wrote: View Post

The audience reaction had been far more severe and critical than any other Trek show, and far less forgiving of the same things that happen in other Trek shows too. The fans just had it out for VOY far more than anything else, so yeah it is partially the fans negative reaction.
But people HATE Enterprise. And the hate is fresher.
A lot of people don't even consider Enterprise as being Trek. That's harsh considering it IS Trek lol.

I haven't watched it yet.
I will get around to it once I finish DS9.
I've softened to it over time. Bad Trek is better than no Trek!
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Old April 1 2013, 04:34 AM   #146
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

teacake wrote: View Post
Oh you're in for a treat!

(I'm a huge ENT fan myself)
I was watching the documentary The Captains and the captain from ENT just looked so dejected. I felt really bad for him. I wanted to give him a hug. He was talking about how other series' had more chemistry and just clicked and that he knows ENT "didn't have it".

I know a lot of people don't like Enterprise, but to make the captain of the show SAY that...people must have been harsh to him. I felt really bad...
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Old April 1 2013, 04:39 AM   #147
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Seasons 3 and 4 are wonderful. Season 3 is one long story arc, more so than DS9. Season 4 is lots of double and triple episodes and some of the finest Trek there is. And I say that as someone who started on TOS.

Also, if you DO fancy hugging Archer because of that doco rest assured he takes his shirt off in ENT plenty.
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Old April 1 2013, 04:41 AM   #148
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

teacake wrote: View Post
Seasons 3 and 4 are wonderful. Season 3 is one long story arc, more so than DS9. Season 4 is lots of double and triple episodes and some of the finest Trek there is. And I say that as someone who started on TOS.

Also, if you DO fancy hugging Archer because of that doco rest assured he takes his shirt off in ENT plenty.
Haha, ok. He was cute in the documentary. Wouldn't mind seeing him shirtless.
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Old April 1 2013, 04:42 AM   #149
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

oh it's FULL of shirtless men
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Old April 1 2013, 04:45 AM   #150
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

From one of the most notorious Enterprise episodes...

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