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Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

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Old March 22 2013, 03:53 PM   #16
AllStarEntprise
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Re: Nemesis

You know there would be no war on the planet if the humanoids just played Dom-jot with the Naucissicans. Oh wait sorry these aliens were call the Kradin. Some one get Chakotay to the Dom-jot tables! I'm sure his animal guide will bring him much fortunate as he gambles.
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Old March 22 2013, 06:49 PM   #17
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Re: Nemesis

It seems to me they were going for a negative version of a late reveal with "Nemesis". In some movies a late reveal is awesome like in The Prestige. You spend half the movie trying to figure it out, and then at the end everything comes out.

But in "Nemesis"? You think you've got the whole thing figured out until the very end. Then they take everything that's good, and turn it upside down. It's like finding out that Superman was actually working for Lex Luthor, or that kittens are actually plotting to destroy the world.

I enjoyed the episode, up till they made the Vori the bad guys.

I guess I'll just have to "Close my glimpses" to the bad parts and get on with the rest of Voyager...
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Old March 22 2013, 08:36 PM   #18
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Re: Nemesis

when I saw this I thought it was good, and the twist was pretty clever. But I was pretty young when I saw it, and haven't seen it since, I don't know if I'd find it as clever now.
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Old March 22 2013, 09:35 PM   #19
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Re: Nemesis

I like "Nemesis". A very good Chakotay episode. If I ever buy season 4 on DVD, it will be for that episode.
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Old March 23 2013, 12:44 AM   #20
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Re: Nemesis

Lynx wrote: View Post
I like "Nemesis". A very good Chakotay episode. If I ever buy season 4 on DVD, it will be for that episode.

buy it for "mortal coil" instead
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Old March 23 2013, 12:46 AM   #21
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Re: Nemesis

What we need is an app that tells you were on a dvd to scratch with a safety pin to remove a specific track or episode so you don't have to deal with or accept that it exists.
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Old March 23 2013, 06:14 AM   #22
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Re: Nemesis

Lynx wrote: View Post
I like "Nemesis". A very good Chakotay episode. If I ever buy season 4 on DVD, it will be for that episode.
The more years I spend with VOY the more I want to smack Chakotay hard. Or at the very least shake him.
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Old March 23 2013, 05:51 PM   #23
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Re: Nemesis

sonak wrote: View Post
Lynx wrote: View Post
I like "Nemesis". A very good Chakotay episode. If I ever buy season 4 on DVD, it will be for that episode.

buy it for "mortal coil" instead
Sorry, but I consider "Mortal Coil" one of Voyagers worst episodes.

teacake wrote
The more years I spend with VOY the more I want to smack Chakotay hard. Or at the very least shake him.
Why? Personally I find Chakotay a good character. In fact, he's number 2 on my favorites list.
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Old March 24 2013, 02:24 AM   #24
Queen Arachnia
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Re: Nemesis

I liked Nemesis, decent Chakotay episode. But I think it was good not really because of Chakotay but more of the fact that during the whole time watching, you're thinking the same thing he is...but then at the end you're nearly just as surprised. I think the episode would have been decent no matter who was down there with the fighters. The fact that Chakotay knew his way about a battle area and had that tribal-ness about him made him a better fit for that episode I guess, moreso than other characters. I'm not sure if I really liked the episode because of Chakotay though. It really could have been anyone in that situation and the episode would have had the same meaning. But he did make a decent attempt at helping the people and I felt pretty bad when you find out at the end that he had been duped.
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Old March 24 2013, 02:25 AM   #25
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Re: Nemesis

Lynx wrote: View Post

teacake wrote
The more years I spend with VOY the more I want to smack Chakotay hard. Or at the very least shake him.
Why? Personally I find Chakotay a good character. In fact, he's number 2 on my favorites list.
Because he always seems asleep or at best muted in his response. He lacks passion. He just stands there, the most you get out of him is a slightly higher voice register to indicate he's all torqued up about something.

I just want to shake him and yell, "YOU'RE A FRAKKING TERRORIST!!! PUT SOME HEART INTO IT!"
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Old March 24 2013, 02:27 AM   #26
teacock
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Re: Nemesis

What I love about your avatar Captain Kathryn is the Doctor is clearly looking in the mirror.
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Old March 24 2013, 02:30 AM   #27
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Re: Nemesis

teacake wrote: View Post
What I love about your avatar Captain Kathryn is the Doctor is clearly looking in the mirror.
Haha...just wanted to show some EMH love today.
I think because I watched Tinker, Tenor, Doctor, Spy last night lol.
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Old March 24 2013, 02:42 AM   #28
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Re: Nemesis

teacake wrote: View Post
Lynx wrote: View Post

teacake wrote
The more years I spend with VOY the more I want to smack Chakotay hard. Or at the very least shake him.
Why? Personally I find Chakotay a good character. In fact, he's number 2 on my favorites list.
Because he always seems asleep or at best muted in his response. He lacks passion. He just stands there, the most you get out of him is a slightly higher voice register to indicate he's all torqued up about something.

I just want to shake him and yell, "YOU'RE A FRAKKING TERRORIST!!! PUT SOME HEART INTO IT!"
I don't dislike Chakotay by any means (obviously since I'm a J/C shipper), but he is not believable as having been a Maquis ship captain at all. He seems like the type that would have preferred sitting on the couch eating chips or something than ever captain an outlaw Maquis ship to the Badlands. If anything, I could see B'Elanna commanding that ship lol. Chakotay is just too blah about everything.

He shows a low amount of anger and aggression so far as I could see. It shows up once in a while when he boxes or calls himself a warrior...but to be honest, he's not. I don't dislike him for that. It's just not believable.

In Caretaker, he shows no objection to suddenly listening to and obeying Janeway's orders. He just relinquishes his ship and his power to her and rejoins Starfleet lol. In SOME episodes, he stands up to her. But usually he just acts comatose.

He has his good moments though, like in Nemesis. And I am glad that he respected Janeway and didn't give her much of a hard time...he's just...not believable as an angry Maquis outlaw lol.

But I can't hate on Chakotay. He was a good first officer to Janeway and in my imagination they lived happily ever after...
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Old March 24 2013, 03:28 AM   #29
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Re: Nemesis

According to Picard, a good first Officer is someone who tells you that you are a wrong son of a bitch who then confines you to quarters until you see reason... And that is not Chakotay.

Worf tried that with Data and data threatened to demote him and tap Geordi up to bat.

Riker tried that with Jellico and he got benched.

Max Burke tried that with Ransom who bent over and touched the back of his ankles prepared to be taken.

Miles towed the line fine when Captain Dee was in Charge, it was her 2nd officer who was rumbling about a mutiny... of course... Did it seem like Miles was first officer when Ensign Ro clearly out ranked him? That's cold. No wonder she was spoiling for a fight.

Who was Bev's first officer in Descent?
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Old March 24 2013, 03:36 AM   #30
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Re: Nemesis

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
According to Picard, a good first Officer is someone who tells you that you are a wrong son of a bitch who then confines you to quarters until you see reason... And that is not Chakotay.
Hehe...well, there was the episode when Janeway confined Chakotay to quarters.
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