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Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

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Old March 22 2013, 01:14 PM   #1
indolover
Fleet Captain
 
How does Changeling society operate?

It seems to me that the Great Link is kind of like some mass communistic state. There are no leaders, and essentially all are equal. At least I sense amongst Changelings there are no senior or junior conspecifics. Even though Odo technically may have been younger than the Female Changeling, she did not deem him a junior or an inferior.

That said, could the Female Changeling in a way have been Odo's mother? It seems weird, but maybe the manner in which Changelings reproduce is that some members of the Link volunteer their DNA for copying or reassortment into a new Changeling. Maybe this is why it was the Female Changeling specifically who greeted Odo in The Search. It's a just a theory lol..
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Old March 22 2013, 03:52 PM   #2
Timo
Admiral
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

It's possible the Changeling society does not have members at all. Quite possibly, it's just a single organism that, when Linked, has only a single mind. A mind that can undergo introspection and internal dialogue, sure, but still just a single mind.

Whenever a glob of goo leaves the Link, it starts to exhibit isolated thought processes. But those are absorbed into the whole as the glob returns; if a lot of "individuality" has been accumulated, as with Odo and the rest of The Hundred, it just takes a bit longer.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old March 22 2013, 04:24 PM   #3
WesleysDisciple
Lieutenant Commander
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

i really like that idea.. that the link is a collective entity.

"the drop becomes the ocean, the ocean becomes the drop"



Basicly the individual mebers, are as much philosophys, or ways at looking at things, that remain strong enough as entitys outside of the link, that they keep retaking separate form

Odo might be able to urge the link to greater compassion.
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Old March 22 2013, 06:03 PM   #4
Pavonis
Commodore
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

Why would Odo bring greater compassion to the Great Link? He's not particularly compassionate. He's not really much different from the rest of the changelings, in fact. He seeks "justice", which isn't much different from the changeling-wide desire for order, in fact, it's pretty much the same thing. Odo wants "Justice", but only justice that he sees as such. If there's any exchange of views, it would be that Odo would end up being overwhelmed by the Great Link's view of Solids. It is far more likely that Odo would come around to their way of thinking, rather than bringing them to his way.
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Old March 22 2013, 07:54 PM   #5
indolover
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Re: How does Changeling society operate?

It's also likely that the other Changelings would simply dismiss him or ignore his views. Some of them may see their defeat at the hands of the solids as more reason to detest/fear them.
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Old March 22 2013, 08:18 PM   #6
_C_
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Re: How does Changeling society operate?

It's possible their individuality dissolves when they slip into the Link and they regain it when they leave. What one experienced is experienced by all once an individual dips back into the living ocean. This was greatly evidenced in the final DS9 episode where Odo spreads the cure for the morphogenic virus just by rejoining the Link. He became its savior.

If just two Changelings link up, they form a mini-Link. But it's also been shown that they can control what information is passed around--Odo said during his judgement he sensed they were hiding things from him.

Also, once, Odo and the female Changeling had sex in their solid forms because Odo wanted to show her how solids experience intimacy, and she said it was just a pale shadow of what the Link offers. In a way, I see the Female as Odo's antithesis in the series. She's everything he wants to be, but in a way so twisted he turns away from it until she's taken out of the picture.

Think of the juxtaposition at the end of the series. The Female gets stuck in a prison, away from the Link after living it her whole life. Odo is 'released' by Kira and joins the Link after spending much of his life without it.

I think WITHOUT the Female calling the shots, the rest of them would realize solids aren't so bad via Odo's memories. After all, his SOLID friends risked their lives for HIM to cure him of the virus that was killing the Changelings.
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Old March 22 2013, 10:22 PM   #7
Captain McBain
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Re: How does Changeling society operate?

It seems to me that the Female Changeling is the leader of the Great Link.
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Old March 22 2013, 11:58 PM   #8
Pavonis
Commodore
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

The female changeling looked to be the leader of the Dominion forces in the Alpha Quadrant, but not necessarily the leader of the entire Dominion. That would be like assuming Eisenhower was the leader of the United States during World War II.
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Old March 23 2013, 02:01 AM   #9
_C_
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Re: How does Changeling society operate?

She had the Vorta to help her.
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Old March 23 2013, 03:33 AM   #10
indolover
Fleet Captain
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

Probably any given Founder in a specific region is technically the leader of all Dominion governance. So all resources, whether social, military, economic, etc. are under his or her control. This may explain why the Female Changeling was the ultimate ruler of Dominion Cardassia. Yes, Dukat, Damar and Broca were the heads of government but they were largely puppet positions. Dukat/Damar/Broca still had to answer ultimately Weyoun and to the Female Changeling.
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Old March 23 2013, 03:59 AM   #11
Captain McBain
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Re: How does Changeling society operate?

Pavonis wrote: View Post
The female changeling looked to be the leader of the Dominion forces in the Alpha Quadrant, but not necessarily the leader of the entire Dominion. That would be like assuming Eisenhower was the leader of the United States during World War II.
Technically, Eisenhower was the leader of the US during WWII, just as Obama (gulp!) is leader of our nation now.
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Old March 23 2013, 04:50 AM   #12
Pavonis
Commodore
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

Really, dude? You don't know the difference between President Roosevelt and General Eisenhower? Or are you under the impression that Ike was president during World War II?
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Old March 25 2013, 07:22 PM   #13
Worf'sParmach
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Re: How does Changeling society operate?

I think it's a lot like the Borg, a single collective mind when they are linked. But unlike the Borg, the members are able to think and behave independently when they are not linked.

I have always wondered what type of facilities they would need to have to do all their evil bidding. If they exist in a big soup pool of people, I guess they don't need houses or roads or real infrastructure the way solids would. But where do they do their genetic engineering to make Vorta and Jem'Hadar? Where do they build ships, develop science, etc. I imagine there has to be more than just that random rock edge on their planet, right?

Pavonis wrote: View Post
The female changeling looked to be the leader of the Dominion forces in the Alpha Quadrant, but not necessarily the leader of the entire Dominion. That would be like assuming Eisenhower was the leader of the United States during World War II.

Great analogy, too bad McBain killed it


I never got the impression that she ran the whole Dominion or the Great Link. Actually, I'm betting that no one runs the Great Link. I think they exist the same way the Borg were originally conceived (that is until motion picture dramatic license added an over-sexed Borg Queen)
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Old March 25 2013, 08:04 PM   #14
Pavonis
Commodore
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

I'm confused. My history books and research indicated that Franklin Roosevelt and subsequently Harry Truman was the leader (i.e., the President, where the buck stops, etc) during World War II (which ran from 1941 to 1945 for the United States). Dwight Eisenhower was the top Allied general (not counting any Soviets) during the war. Are the rest of you under the impression that Eisenhower was President during World War II??

While it is clear that the Female Founder was head of the Dominion forces in the Alpha Quadrant, it does not follow that she was head of the entire Dominion.
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Old March 25 2013, 09:00 PM   #15
Timo
Admiral
 
Re: How does Changeling society operate?

I imagine there has to be more than just that random rock edge on their planet, right?
Probably not. After all, the Founders would want to keep the Dominion as far away from them as they possibly can!

The two remote and desolate worlds where we find Founders in "The Search" and "Broken Link" are hideouts, places where the Founders remain unseen and hidden from all Solids, including those they keep at an arm's length through integrating them into the Dominion. The worlds are rather tellingly located on the outer fringes of the Dominion or even outside it (as evidenced by the ease by which our heroes reach those places from the wormhole Gamma end, which is originally located outside the Dominion).

They certainly wouldn't want to build any Jem'Hadar or Vorta there, let alone ships or weapons - all they would really need is a communications room for contacting a select bunch of Vorta in the Dominion proper, and telling them how to run the show. We see some facilities on the first hideout world, namely those used for interrogating the Defiant captives, and some Vorta there, but there might be very little else on that planet besides the big seas of Founder goo and the few inspirational rock outcroppings sticking out of the seas.

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