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 The Trek BBS Physicists say they have found a Higgs boson

 Science and Technology "Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known." - Carl Sagan.

March 16 2013, 08:52 AM   #16
Edit_XYZ
Fleet Captain

Location: At star's end.
Re: Physicists say they have found a Higgs boson

 Asbo Zaprudder wrote: Lowering the rest mass increases atomic size. The radius of an atom is inversely proportional to the electron rest mass m, so the radius of atoms (R) would tend to infinity as m -> 0. Intermolecular (London) forces are roughly proportional to the ionization energy I over R^6, and as I is inversely proportional to R, this force would also quickly go to zero as 1/R^7.
Except you won't have 0 mass.
A soon as you lower your mass to 0, you'll be flying at lightspeed, gaining relativistic mass.

'The radius of an atom is inversely proportional to the electron rest mass m, so the radius of atoms (R) would tend to infinity as m -> 0' - due to the uncertainty principle, not due to mass attraction.
As to your wavefunction, the uncertainty principle allows, due to your relativistic mass, for it to be 'squished up' in a region of space not much larger than the one you now occupy (photons don't occupy infinite space for the same reason).
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"Let truth and falsehood grapple ... Truth is strong" - John Milton

 March 16 2013, 09:05 AM #17 Asbo Zaprudder Rear Admiral     Location: On the beach Re: Physicists say they have found a Higgs boson The part about mass attraction is a straw-man argument that you have introduced. The rest of your argument is a mish-mash of concepts from relativistic and quantum physics.
March 16 2013, 09:11 AM   #18
CorporalCaptain

Location: North America
Re: Physicists say they have found a Higgs boson

 Asbo Zaprudder wrote: Lowering the rest mass increases atomic size. The radius of an atom is inversely proportional to the electron rest mass m, so the radius of atoms (R) would tend to infinity as m -> 0. Intermolecular (London) forces are roughly proportional to the ionization energy I over R^6, and as I is inversely proportional to R, this force would also quickly go to zero as 1/R^7.
 Asbo Zaprudder wrote: Furthermore, as ionization potential is proportional to electron rest mass (which is where I got the 1/R from in my previous post), all the atoms in your body would soon be ionized by lower energy photons until even infra-red radiation from your own body or your surroundings turns you into a rapidly dispersing ionic plasma.
That's a neat discussion here.

I'll chime in that, while there's no reason to doubt any of that, the idea that the Bohr radius is inversely proportional to electron mass has experimental support from the study of muonic hydrogen.
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March 16 2013, 09:13 AM   #19
Edit_XYZ
Fleet Captain

Location: At star's end.
Re: Physicists say they have found a Higgs boson

 Asbo Zaprudder wrote: The part about mass attraction is a straw-man argument that you have introduced. The rest of your argument is a mish-mash of concepts from relativistic and quantum physics.
If you knew that the relation between electron mass and atomic radius is due to the uncertainty principle, you sure didn't show it in your previous posts, Astro.

And the rest of my argument is correct:
Δx
·Δpħ/2
Δp=Δv·m
And the electron's mass is tiny to begin with.

r
/2)/(Δv·m)
In words - the electron's mass can be as small as you wish (and rest or relativistic - it doesn't matter); if it's not 0, the wavefunction of the atom will be squished in a volume of space not much larger than the one it usually occupies.
__________________
"Let truth and falsehood grapple ... Truth is strong" - John Milton

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