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Old March 9 2013, 01:43 PM   #106
Turtletrekker
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Re: Friction at DC

It's not about how he expresses himself, it's the actions he takes actively trying to deny rights and privleges to others.

To my mind, he is little different from Fred Phelps and the Westboro Baptists. They can believe what they want, but it's the actions that they take (Protesting at funerals and such) that make them truly despicable.
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Old March 9 2013, 01:59 PM   #107
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Re: Friction at DC

"Little different" to Fred Phelps? Seriously? Card is a board member of a non-profit organisation that wishes to keep the definition of marriage what it has been. He hasn't picketed a funeral, declared people will burn in hell or anything of the sort.

In fact, short research will show that he renounced his views that homosexual acts should be criminalised. This puts him very far away from the Westboro Baptist's views.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:23 PM   #108
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Re: Friction at DC

Turtletrekker wrote: View Post
It's not about how he expresses himself, it's the actions he takes actively trying to deny rights and privleges to others.
And the action of him writing this Superman story was going to deny rights and privledges of others. You may as well assault him while he walks down the street; that action of living holds the same offense.

It's about appropriate response. You are denying the man the right to live because he once supported something you don't like.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:24 PM   #109
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Re: Friction at DC

DalekJim wrote: View Post
"Little different" to Fred Phelps? Seriously? Card is a board member of a non-profit organisation that wishes to keep the definition of marriage what it has been. He hasn't picketed a funeral, declared people will burn in hell or anything of the sort.
Exactly--but the hardliners wish to tie thought to action, thus demonizing to the point of total supression. At least screamers of this kind are exposing how much they are like the very kind of people who seek to silence opposing views.

All so fitting.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:28 PM   #110
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Re: Friction at DC

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post

Exactly--but the hardliners wish to tie thought to action, thus demonizing to the point of total supression.
You may want to look up the guys ramblings.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:37 PM   #111
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Re: Friction at DC

Hound of UIster wrote: View Post
No it's both an online and paper comic. The online version gets released before the physical copies ship.

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
Comic companies cancel titles often. Take a look at the number DC alonr has dropped in the past 5 years. A decade.
And that is not good. The turnover is just one of the signs they are not doing too well.
Not so fast: you were specifically citing the OSC petition as:

Their cancellation threshold is around 10-20,000 so yes 16,000 or even 4000 could make or break a book
--a potential threat, but the next point you miss is that if a OSC title was cancelled, it would not be some grand threat to DC as it pulls titles often. His would just be another in along line of axed titles, so in the grand scheme of things, it means nothing--ther than to ideologues who want it to mean something.

No you are missing the point. People boycotting the comic, the editors paying for a story that will never see the light of day, that eats away at their bottom line.
See the previous reply.

The bad rep, that is going to hurt sales and hurt their future plans for Superman. And Warner isn't going to be too pleased either with the bad publicity.
Where is your proof of this regarding Superman? Superman is bigger than 16,000 complaints few even care about, and to the majority of the population even aware of the character (far beyond the realm of comic book readers), Superman is Mickey Mouse. The character has a pop-cultural meaning removed from the little political dust ups of the times(if it even qualifies as that). That's how the biggest brands survive.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:39 PM   #112
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Re: Friction at DC

Nagisa Furukawa wrote: View Post
DalekJim wrote: View Post
Do these people seriously believe those with minority views shouldn't be entitled to any kind of employment? What kind of vile view is that?
This is precisely the issue for me.

I have no problem with any individual who refuses to buy something Card's written (actually, I have no problem with any individual refusing to buy anything they don't want to for any reason).

I don't have a problem with someone expressing their views on Card and recommending to others that they not buy it either.

I start to have a problem when we get petitions, as the article says, "calling for DC to remove him from the book." That is crossing the line. Don't like his Superman story? Don't buy it. But to lobby for him to lose his job? Sickening, just sickening.
So you can boycott a product, that's fine and dandy. You can also tell anyone in the world you wish that you are doing so and why, except the company that actually produces the product, because that would be sickening...

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Old March 9 2013, 02:49 PM   #113
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Re: Friction at DC

DalekJim wrote: View Post
Modern liberalism continues to get more insane. Welcome to Obama's brave new world.
And I think that after 8 f@#ckings years of "if you don't support the president you're a terrorist" Republicans pretending to be the guardians of the First Amendment like they actually give a s@#t about it is funny as hell.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:55 PM   #114
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Re: Friction at DC

Let's turn this on its head for a minute; let's boycott Chris Sprouse for his intolerance of other people's views. That man should never get work again. Right?

That does bring up an interesting point, though. How does DC really feel about Sprouse doing this? Sprouse just showed himself to be unreliable and willing to leave his publisher in a lurch based on whim. Is this someone you give more work to? Can you depend on them? Sprouse has been highly unprofessional here. If he didn't want to work with Card in the future, then that's fine; but to back out on your commitment to drawing an inoffensive story? I wouldn't hire Sprouse again.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:58 PM   #115
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Re: Friction at DC

Pingfah wrote: View Post
So you can boycott a product, that's fine and dandy. You can also tell anyone in the world you wish that you are doing so and why, except the company that actually produces the product, because that would be sickening...
No, unlike you I believe in free speech so I think people can, and should, say what they like. Honesty is a virtue I treasure. The problem comes when people are hypocrites about it and demand that people they disagree with on legal definitions should be unable to produce art. To me that is offensive.

Personally I'm not too invested in Orson Scott Card's comic book career but he did write Ender's Game which is a really good book and a very significant sci-fi novel. Should that now be boycotted due to the author's views? Should it be banned from being sold? I find that ideology ludicrous.

The concept of offence is so distorted, fetishised and warped in our culture. People feel they have the right not to be offended and that those who cause offence should be shunned. I couldn't disagree more.
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Old March 9 2013, 03:03 PM   #116
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Re: Friction at DC

DalekJim wrote: View Post
Pingfah wrote: View Post
So you can boycott a product, that's fine and dandy. You can also tell anyone in the world you wish that you are doing so and why, except the company that actually produces the product, because that would be sickening...
No, unlike you I believe in free speech
I read as far as I needed to. Cheers
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Old March 9 2013, 03:03 PM   #117
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Re: Friction at DC

Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
The boycott isn't about bringing down DC. DC is not being threatened. ONE comic book is being boycotted. So, your point is... pointless...
That would apply to you, since you are complaining about personal opinion having nothing to do with the duty or substance of his job. Attempted thought and action control of a business.

That is where you stand.

Sure. That's an option. And just let things like racism and homophobia continue. But, then, it's not really your problem, so who cares, right?
Crossed the border of hyperbole long ago.

Some people DO care. Some people like to try and make the world a better place. You are free to participate or not
Better in your opinion. Funny how you cannot even consider that the OSC side may sincerely believe the same thing.


The company might not shelve the story. It's up to them. It's called the Free Market. Why shouldn't the market be able to speak to the producers?
You can say whatever you want, but you flee from the point: why are you incapable of exercising free will and buying something else? Or are you a person seeking absolute thought and action control over any and all entities? Smells like the latter.

Ok, then you prove the opposite. That his advocacy of bigotry reflects WELL on DC.
See the point about "Funny how you cannot even consider that the OSC side may sincerely believe the same thing" regarding the "better world" concept. You are so hostile and one-sided in your view, that the other side is "the wrong side" in this matter.

Over 50 percent of Americans support gay marriage. That's not media, that's math. I know reality challenges your conceptions of what you think Americans believe... but... it'll be ok.
Yes, because polls are really capturing the true opinion of half of 300+ million individuals, from the child to the elderly. As Mitt Romney learned somewhere around summer of last year, some polling data is not an accurate measure of real world opinion or action.

The market of ACTUAL comic book buyers is SO small. That, again, 16,000 is a significant number.
As noted to another member, titles are cancelled often--the point being if a OSC comic was cancelled, why is suddenly more significant that the other stack of titles yanked since 2000?

But... it would be the companies choice.
Ohhh no. This thread has served as the stage for a number of members advocating anything other than allowing DC to handle its own affairs. any action to follow is DC's business,

I didn't get my panties in a twist when the "Million" Moms tried to protest JC Penny's hiring of Ellen.
But you ARE getting your panties in a bunch over OSC's business relationship with DC.

Do YOU get upset with the Million Moms? Are YOU consistent in your thinking?
Nice try, but not working, as you remain the one hostile and one-sided here.
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Old March 9 2013, 03:07 PM   #118
DalekJim
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Re: Friction at DC

Pingfah wrote: View Post
DalekJim wrote: View Post
Pingfah wrote: View Post
So you can boycott a product, that's fine and dandy. You can also tell anyone in the world you wish that you are doing so and why, except the company that actually produces the product, because that would be sickening...
No, unlike you I believe in free speech
I read as far as I needed to. Cheers
The irony here is painful. When trying to make out that you believe in free speech, selectively ignoring and censoring what I say is a really daft move.
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Old March 9 2013, 03:11 PM   #119
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Re: Friction at DC

Censorship?

Oh man, please go on, you are hilarious.
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Old March 9 2013, 03:16 PM   #120
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Re: Friction at DC

It's clear you have no real desire for debate or points to bring to the table, so there seems little point.
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