Skyfall - Grading & Discussion

[doubleohfive]

The gunbarrell was fine where it was in Skyfall. It made for a great "signature" on the series.

Anyway, it's such a minor thing that it doesn't bother me that much.

[Gaith]

^ Yeah. Put the gunbarrel anywhere or nowhere, just don't make Q and M total morons.

[Alidar Jarok]

doubleohfive wrote:

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No.

They've done that already. The same way Star Trek proved in 2009 that there's money (and eyeballs) to be made/delivered with a new approach to an old property, Skyfall delivered exponentially.

You're deluding yourself if you think for a second Eon isn't going to capitalize on the success of Skyfall in every way they can.

Well, the ending seemed to set up a return to the traditional format.

[Professor Zoom]

Gaith wrote:

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^ Yeah. Put the gunbarrel anywhere or nowhere, just don't make Q and M total morons.

Agreed. And, you know, have Bond succeed. At SOMETHING.

[Starkers]

Professor Zoom wrote:

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Agreed. And, you know, have Bond succeed. At SOMETHING.

He did, he klled Silva.

Sheesh I'm glad you guys weren't around when OHMSS came out...

[Professor Zoom]

Starkers wrote:

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He did, he klled Silva.

Sheesh I'm glad you guys weren't around when OHMSS came out...

Oooo... he killed the bad guy after the bad guy succeeded in his goals, way to go Bond! You've really... um... saved the day...

There's a big difference between OHMSS and Skyfall: Bond stopped the Bad Guy from succeeding in OHMSSS (which is a great film.) In Skyfall, Bond practically helps Silva kill M.

In OHMSS, he suffers a personal loss from stopping the bad guy, and that was very moving. In Skyfall, a lot of people die, he fails as the primary mission, and Bond STILL keeps his job.... What does it take to get fired from MI6?

[Starkers]

Silva died thinking he'd failed, not a perfect result but a result nontheless and finally Craig's Bond gets to kill the bad guy rather than some glorified accountant/henchman.

How does he keep his job? By being exceptionally useful? You might as well ask why he wasn't fired after Licence to Kill, or Quantum of Solace or any other film where he goes rogue...

Or how about Casino Royale where he loses Le chrifre, loses the money, and loses the girl! I have no problem with 007 being fallible.

[Lonemagpie]

And as for getting M killed, as I said before, it's pretty clear she wanted it that way - to go out while in the field, face to face with the enemy, rather than be pushed into retirement.

[Professor Zoom]

Starkers wrote:

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How does he keep his job? By being exceptionally useful? You might as well ask why he wasn't fired after Licence to Kill, or Quantum of Solace or any other film where he goes rogue...

How was he useful in this one?

His licence was revoked at the beginning of Licence to Kill, hard to be fired after you've already been fired. And then, he WAS pretty useful in that movie, he did bring down a big ole drug kingpin... So it makes sense to bring him back.

It seems like most of the time he goes rogue, he succeeds...

Or how about Casino Royale where he loses Le chrifre, loses the money, and loses the girl! I have no problem with 007 being fallible.

I have no problem with fallible. But didn't at the end of Casino, he actually did damage to the organization? Don't remember. And him losing the girl, just like in OHMSS...

I don't mind Bond suffering personally, especially to succeed professionally, it makes him tragic and compelling.

Lonemagpie wrote:

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And as for getting M killed, as I said before, it's pretty clear she wanted it that way - to go out while in the field, face to face with the enemy, rather than be pushed into retirement.

I'm sure her Majesty's government is glad that she got her wish...

In the end, as I've said throughout this thread, I think Skyfall looked GORGEOUS and has great actors. Just a truly shitty story. Well, the plotting. The plotting is awful. I just don't think I can be dissuaded from that position.

[Captrek]

Professor Zoom wrote:

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But didn't at the end of Casino, he actually did damage to the organization? Don't remember.

Nope.

The goal of the operation in CR was to get Le Chiffre in deep water so that he would give intelligence on the organization in exchange for protection. That didn’t happen because Mr. White killed Le Chiffre. The only thing Bond ultimately accomplished in CR is the capture of Mr. White... who escaped in the opening act of QoS. (On the upside, that did result in exposing a mole in MI6. On the downside, Bond killed the mole before he could be questioned.)

[Professor Zoom]

Captrek wrote:

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Nope.

The goal of the operation in CR was to get Le Chiffre in deep water so that he would give intelligence on the organization in exchange for protection. That didn’t happen because Mr. White killed Le Chiffre. The only thing Bond ultimately accomplished in CR is the capture of Mr. White... who escaped in the opening act of QoS. (On the upside, that did result in exposing a mole in MI6. On the downside, Bond killed the mole before he could be questioned.)

It's so funny, I really do like Craig as Bond, but damn.... he just never succeeds does he?

[Gaith]

Starkers wrote:

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Or how about Casino Royale where he loses Le chrifre, loses the money, and loses the girl! I have no problem with 007 being fallible.

Yes, he loses le Chiffre, but he captures Mr. White, a higher-up. I call that win.

Vesper continued to serve MI6 while compromised, so her death is no big loss from the brass' POV.

Bond also saves the airliner in CR, so for a brand-new 00 apparently being the first one to seriously investigate a massive criminal organization under rather unique circumstances, I'd say he does fairly well there.

The real question being why Quantum was so unknown to MI6 in the first place.