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Old March 6 2013, 12:21 AM   #6166
kirk55555
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

By dark, I mean more like the grim and gritty Image stuff. Where the idea of dark/mature was idiotic plots, people with "dark"/gritty personalities (90% of the new 52, including Wonder Woman and Superman) and stuff like that. It seems like every hero will do stuff that just doesn't fit (Wonder Woman is so casual about murder/klilling she makes a klingon look like a pacifist, Warrior =/= casual killing), or just acts like I'd expect an early Image character to. They also have costumes that are just as stupid, although for different reasons than the Image heroes (for the most part, not counting Liefeld's books). I didn't mean dark like horror/gory/disturbing stuff (although several titles are disturbing, but not because they are that kind of dark ).
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Old March 6 2013, 12:23 AM   #6167
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

DC is hardly dark. There are things that I haven't liked about the relaunch, and I've been a pretty consistent critic throughout the thread as most of you know who have been following it, but Kirk55555 makes it out to be absolutely garbage. That's hardly the case with it at all. Is it perfect? Not in the least? Has DC made mistakes? Sure...but there are still some great books out there. People have mentioned them many times in this thread.
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Old March 6 2013, 12:24 AM   #6168
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

^^^To kirk55555

I think you're reading a different DCU than I am. You should, though, check out Wonder Woman's solo book. It's great.
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Old March 6 2013, 12:36 AM   #6169
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
^^^To kirk55555

I think you're reading a different DCU than I am. You should, though, check out Wonder Woman's solo book. It's great.
I read the first six issues. It was garbage, especially the art (the greek gods have never looked stupider). The story isn't the worst of the New 52, but it was bad. I also HATE the "Wonder Woman is from an island, so she gets confused about the real world" stuff, and lets not forget her making Klingon's look like teletubbies. There have been much worse runs, but the current one is pretty worthless. I have read a lot of the new 52 books for atleast a few issues, and most of it is bad. I don't hate everything I don't read, but everything I don't read or hate is just garbage. Some had potential (JL Dark might have kept my attention if it didn't get boring, and make Zatanna into a stripper) but it didn't live up to it. Some were just offensively bad (like Teen Titans and Red Hood and The Outlaws, which I actually stayed with out of curiosity much longer than I should have). Overall, DC is easily putting out the worst mainstream comics ever right now. The old DC had bad stuff, like all companies do. But, the bad stuff they are putting out now is beating even the worst of the old stuff. Well, ok, nobody beats All Star Batman as worst Batman, but I've always though Miller's Batman stories were horrible anyway, so it would be unfair to compare even Snyder's bad stuff to the things Frank miller has turned out, especially in recent years.
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Old March 6 2013, 01:15 AM   #6170
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

kirk55555 wrote: View Post

I read the first six issues. It was garbage, especially the art (the greek gods have never looked stupider). The story isn't the worst of the New 52, but it was bad. I also HATE the "Wonder Woman is from an island, so she gets confused about the real world" stuff, and lets not forget her making Klingon's look like teletubbies.
I have no idea what you're talking about... what's the teletubbie thing?

And I get the idea that someone from a culture that might be isolated or different not understanding something in another culture. My wife is from India, that happened frequently when she came to America.

And again, we obviously see things VERY differently. It's not garbage. Not even close.
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Old March 6 2013, 01:55 AM   #6171
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

kirk55555 wrote: View Post
I read the first six issues. It was garbage, especially the art (the greek gods have never looked stupider).
You lost me completely.

Cliif Chiang's art on Wonder Woman has been nothing short of absolutely gorgeous.
The story isn't the worst of the New 52, but it was bad. I also HATE the "Wonder Woman is from an island, so she gets confused about the real world" stuff
None of that has been in Wonder Woman at all. There was some of it in Justice League but that was before Lee's departure and the subsequent improvement of the book.

Some were just offensively bad (like Teen Titans and Red Hood and The Outlaws, which I actually stayed with out of curiosity much longer than I should have).
Ok, I will actually agree with you on those. Both of those book have been pretty terrible. Starfire in particular has been almost ruined. Tim is a favorite character of mine, and I really think he deserves a better book than the wretched Teen Titans. Remember when that was practically DC's flagship book? What the hell happened?
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Old March 6 2013, 02:43 AM   #6172
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

I stopped reading WW because the story wasn't grabbing me after 5 issues or so, but I'll agree the art looked terrible. Not attractive at all.
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Old March 6 2013, 03:00 AM   #6173
Nerys Myk
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

I understand that Chiang's style isn't in the current vogue, but to call it terrible mystifies me. He's solid artist with a good sense of design and storytelling.
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Old March 6 2013, 03:01 AM   #6174
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

In 1991, these same people would have called Bruce Timm an artistic hack.
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Old March 6 2013, 03:11 AM   #6175
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

Yeah, look at that ridiculous art-deco style. Everything looks far too simple, and the blending of different time periods just destroys any credibility.. Geez, it's the 90s, people. Learn to use a computer.
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Old March 6 2013, 03:28 AM   #6176
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

kirk55555 wrote: View Post
I don't hate everything I don't read, but everything I don't read or hate is just garbage.
uh... what?
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Old March 6 2013, 03:35 AM   #6177
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

i'll stick up for WW. i love the story and the artwork. you could say its simple, but it really fits with the story IMO.
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Old March 6 2013, 10:41 AM   #6178
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

"Wonder Woman" is one of the best things to come out of the relaunch, and Cliff Chiang is the unsung hero of that book People in this thread know I've come to enjoy his work a great deal Not to mention that Azzy has slowly building a grand story. It fast has become my favourite book of the New 52.
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Old March 6 2013, 10:55 AM   #6179
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

kirk55555 wrote: View Post
Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
^^^To kirk55555

I think you're reading a different DCU than I am. You should, though, check out Wonder Woman's solo book. It's great.
I read the first six issues. It was garbage, especially the art (the greek gods have never looked stupider). The story isn't the worst of the New 52, but it was bad. I also HATE the "Wonder Woman is from an island, so she gets confused about the real world" stuff, and lets not forget her making Klingon's look like teletubbies. There have been much worse runs, but the current one is pretty worthless. I have read a lot of the new 52 books for atleast a few issues, and most of it is bad. I don't hate everything I don't read, but everything I don't read or hate is just garbage. Some had potential (JL Dark might have kept my attention if it didn't get boring, and make Zatanna into a stripper) but it didn't live up to it. Some were just offensively bad (like Teen Titans and Red Hood and The Outlaws, which I actually stayed with out of curiosity much longer than I should have). Overall, DC is easily putting out the worst mainstream comics ever right now. The old DC had bad stuff, like all companies do. But, the bad stuff they are putting out now is beating even the worst of the old stuff. Well, ok, nobody beats All Star Batman as worst Batman, but I've always though Miller's Batman stories were horrible anyway, so it would be unfair to compare even Snyder's bad stuff to the things Frank miller has turned out, especially in recent years.
Interesting that you feel that way because I've been drawn more to the New 52 and have almost completely abandoned Marvel. This change was happening before the reboots. Marvel was losing my interest after Dark Reign/Siege concluded with the half-ass Fear Itself and other major events that just didn't grab my interest.

I read a good swath of the New 52 at first and while I've stopped reading most of those books, that is in part to financial and space issues, more so than lack of interest. I like the new Wonder Woman book. I think the take on the Greek gods is different, creative. Something that I've never seen before. I'm not completely on board with the take on Wonder Woman, however I can't say that the books are not compelling and if I had the time/space/money I would continue reading to see where it was all going.

Though I do agree with you that some of the New 52 books aren't good. I couldn't get into the artwork or stories for Teen Titans or Red Hood. The Flash has been boring to me. I think Superman, up until the H'el arc at least, hasn't been a satisfying reading experience. I didn't like the disconnect in time between Action and Superman. A little Grant Morrison goes a long way and his Action lost my interest. I thought the Superman book was hampered by whatever Morrison was cooking up in Action.

Overall I think Green Lantern, Aquaman, Batman, Batwing, Batwoman, Batman & Robin, Nightwing, Batgirl, Wonder Woman, Supergirl, Suicide Squad, I Vampire, Green Lantern Corps have largely been enjoyable (the one's I've read anyway). Also the first arc of Animal Man made me interested in a character I had zero interest in prior. I also liked the first Demon Knights arc. And Jeff Lemire seems to have a good thing going with Green Arrow now, at least from what I could tell from #17.
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Old March 6 2013, 11:23 AM   #6180
Mike Farley
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

I only read the first issue of Wonder Woman and didn't like it at all. But I wouldn't categorize it as "garbage." It's just something that doesn't appeal to me. I don't think there's anything at the Big 2 or the mid-level publishers that I would call garbage. It's all professionally produced work.

Some of it I like.
Some of it I don't.

Okay....maybe Ann Nocenti's Green Arrow...
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