Saldana: Uhura-Spock

[RandyS]

Dream wrote:

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You guys know that Vulcan and Human sex is awesome right?

And, exactly HOW would you know that??

[serenitytrek1]

Shazam! wrote:

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As a by-product of the character, possibly, but the stoic outsider getting the girl is as cliché and tired today as your lantern jawed hero getting the girl has ever been.

Any Spock / Uhura inference in TOS is lucky coincidence. It's not even something I EVER saw brought up until post Trek XI

There was probably enough Kirk / Uhura interaction in TOS as well if you looked for it. Heck, even the Uhura / Scotty stuff in the movies was BLATANT.

Nope.... I flat out disagree; the stoic character that gets the girl is not clihe because it hardly ever happens. What is clihe is the pretty boy always getting the girl

You obviously no nothing about romance. ....

The most clihe aspect of a romance plot is the popular pretty boy and pretty girl living happily ever after without little effort or getting together with no real legitimate reason asides from that fact that both of them are pretty.

Those are the clihe romance that appeal to teen girls. the romance in star trek 09 or even in any of JJ Abrams movies and tv shows are nothing like that.

[Shazam!]

serenitytrek1 wrote:

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The most clihe aspect of a romance plot is the popular pretty boy and pretty girl living happily ever after without little effort or getting together with no real legitimate reason asides from that fact that both of them are pretty.

Those are the clihe romance that appeal to teen girls.

Twilight says hi.

serenitytrek1 wrote:

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the stoic character that gets the girl is not clihe because it hardly ever happens. What is clihe is the pretty boy always getting the girl

You obviously no nothing about romance. ....

I guess I don't. My understanding was that it's between compatible individuals with mutual likes and dislikes and a basic aesthetic appreciation of one and other on a superficial and / or chemical level coupled with an appropriate balance of intellectual stimulus based on ideology and humour.

I now know that's it nothing more than hot people hooking up. Thanks!

[The Mirrorball Man]

Shazam! wrote:

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Oh, well that's okay then.

"They're kissing again! Do we HAVE to hear the kissing parts?"

[serenitytrek1]

Shazam! wrote:

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Twilight says hi.

I guess I don't. My understanding was that it's between compatible individuals with mutual likes and dislikes and a basic aesthetic appreciation of one and other on a superficial and / or chemical level coupled with an appropriate balance of intellectual stimulus based on ideology and humour.

I now know that's it nothing more than hot people hooking up. Thanks!

No you don’t understand romance, which is fine...you are a guy. Romance is not really a guy thing and since Hollywood is as superficial as ever, most of the recent romantic films in Hollywood is all about sex and lust. It makes sense for you to describe romance as noting more than a hook up between 2 people.

This is one of the main reasons why JJ Abrams didn’t want to pair kirk/uhura in the first place.Kirk in star trek 2009 is the embodiment of all thing sex and lust in other words the cliché romance. When Kirk first meets uhura in the bar all he wants to do is sleep with her.

I don’t think that is the way Spock behaves and no it’s not because he is Vulcan. Am sure there are some vulcans that think it is logical to experiment with sex.
Spock just seems to be more level-headed and focused so if he were to date anyone, he probably won’t date a girl like Galia who is the female version of Kirk.
(Galia was the green girl...Uhura’s roommate)

Also again look at Uhura’s statement to kirk. To her, Kirk is a farm boy that likes to have sex with farm animals.

I for one thought that was quite a nasty and bitchy comment but it was metaphorically true. Uhura, despite acting like a bitch knew that guys like kirk only wants to get into her pants. she immediately turns him down because she is not that type of girl. she want a more serious person in other words a guy like Spock.

This is perhaps the most important reason why the Spock/Uhura romance is not a cliché. It was a very well done romance.

I also do not like the Twilight series ....So I wont be saying hello.

[Franklin]

Nerys Myk wrote:

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Isn't that at the core of Spocks appeal to many in the female audience and the basis of more than one TOS episode?

This is an overstatment, perhaps, but I think the attraction or mystique of Spock to women fans in TOS was that he was both highly desirable and seemingly unobtainable. He was a distant, cold figure. And lonely. A woman may be tempted to think, "I know that's not really him, and if I had the chance, I could break through and get to him." In the show, that was personified by Nurse Chapel. In the end, Spock represented unrequited love, which probably even added to his attraction.

Whether or not one likes the idea of Spock having an open relationship with Uhura or not, thematically, their relationship changes that TOS image of Spock. The mystique is gone. The attraction of unobtainability is gone. And so is unrequited love. Instead, it's about Spock learning how to love, and Uhura gets the chance many female fans may have fantasized about in the 1960s. This Spock is not lonely.

[Shazam!]

serenitytrek1 wrote:

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I also do not like the Twilight series ....So I wont be saying hello.

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you can dismiss its global appeal to literally MILLIONS of female fans.

There's a reason why they chose Spock over say, Scotty or Sulu as a potential love interest. He embodies the stoic, emotionally distant, damaged goods etc model of a contemporary romantic lead designed to appeal to a certain demographic.

It's a trick designed to get some extra butts in the seats and on that level I can't deny that it worked perfectly.

Personally, I found it tired and predictable. Had it been Scotty or Sulu... man, that would have been interesting.

No you don’t understand romance, which is fine...you are a guy.

Also, kinda sexist.

[The Mirrorball Man]

Shazam! wrote:

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Personally, I found it tired and predictable. Had it been Scotty or Sulu... man, that would have been interesting.

In what way? How would that have served the movie, and how would it have worked thematically?

[serenitytrek1]

Shazam! wrote:

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Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you can dismiss its global appeal to literally MILLIONS of female fans.

There's a reason why they chose Spock over say, Scotty or Sulu as a potential love interest. He embodies the stoic, emotionally distant, damaged goods etc model of a contemporary romantic lead designed to appeal to a certain demographic.

It's a trick designed to get some extra butts in the seats and on that level I can't deny that it worked perfectly.

Personally, I found it tired and predictable. Had it been Scotty or Sulu... man, that would have been interesting.

Also, kinda sexist.

No offence but what global appeal does Twilight have?

Twilight is the worst Hollywood film franchise ever. I don’t care how much money it made at the box office.box office has never equalled quality.

Didn’t Breaking Dawn 2 win 7 Razzies awards including worst film at last week’s ceremony?

Twilight is marketed to silly teen girls.

Sparkling pretty boy marries equally sparkling pretty girl and they live happily ever after without any sacrifice.

Now that is the definition of a cliché romance.

I don’t remember the spock/uhura relationship been anything like that.

And no... they could not go with Scotty or Sulu beause they are not leading characters. Kirk and Spock are the main characters.

let me refresh your memory of the golden trios in some of the biggest film franchises ever.

Luke-Han-Leia..(star wars)

Harry-Ron-Hermione (harry potter)

Anakin-Padme-Obiwan (star wars)

Peeta-Katniss-Gale (hunger games)

Captain Jack Sparrow- Elizabeth-Will Turner (pirates of the carribbean)

Kirk-Uhura-Spock (star trek 2009)

Edward-Bella-Jacob (Twilight) I will add twilight since you are a fan.

In case you want to know the similarties between all this cahracters..they all had leading roles in the films and the romantic plot is between at least 2 of the characters I mentioned.

[serenitytrek1]

Franklin wrote:

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This is an overstatment, perhaps, but I think the attraction or mystique of Spock to women fans in TOS was that he was both highly desirable and seemingly unobtainable. He was a distant, cold figure. And lonely. A woman may be tempted to think, "I know that's not really him, and if I had the chance, I could break through and get to him." In the show, that was personified by Nurse Chapel. In the end, Spock represented unrequited love, which probably even added to his attraction.

Whether or not one likes the idea of Spock having an open relationship with Uhura or not, thematically, their relationship changes that TOS image of Spock. The mystique is gone. The attraction of unobtainability is gone. And so is unrequited love. Instead, it's about Spock learning how to love, and Uhura gets the chance many female fans may have fantasized about in the 1960s. This Spock is not lonely.

I don’t really think the Mystique is gone. It is still , after all a different Spock and it doesnt matter how good Quinto is as Spock. Nimoy's Spock will always be the icoinc Spock.

I have heard many fans say that Zachary Quinto's Spock was even more cold and distant than TOS Spock.

Most people call NU-Spock an emo.
.
In the ending scene of the 09 film when TOS Spock tells NU-Spock to put aside logic and do what feels right.

Do you think TOS Spock said those words to NU-Spock because he regretted the cold and distant part of his life that made him miss a lot of human things like love.



Remember Leia Kemoli or even Christine Chapel.

I don’t know how true this is , but I heard that Gene Rodenberry initially planned for Spock and Chapel to get married but it never happened.


Like I said...I dont know how true those rumors are.



NU-Spock seems to find the right balance between logic and everything including love.

[Franklin]

serenitytrek1 wrote:

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I don’t really think the Mystique is gone. It is still , after all a different Spock and it doesnt matter how good Quinto is as Spock. Nimoy's Spock will always be the icoinc Spock.

I have heard may fans say that Zachary Quinto Spock was even more cold and distant than TOS Spock.

Most people call NU-Spock an emo.
.
In the ending scene of the 09 film when TOS Spock tells NU-Spock to put aside logic and do what feels right.

Do you think TOS Spock said those words to NU-Spock because he regretted the cold and distant part of his life that made him miss a lot of human things like love.



Remember Leia Kemoli or even Christine Chapel.

I don’t know how true this is , but I heard that Gene Rodenberry initially planned for Spock and Chapel to get married but it never happened.


Like I said...I dont know how true those rumors are.



NU-Spock seems to find the right balance between logic and everything including love.

I think part of the mystery of TOS Spock was his unobtainability and yet his latent sexuality (like he could explode at any moment). Women suspected that if they could get him to hug them, he probably wouldn't stop there. (Being a man, I can only speculate. Sorry if that sounds overgeneralized.)
I do think seeing Quinto's Spock with his first girlfriend does remove some of that mystique. Spock Prime seemed to both fear and desire intimacy (as in closeness). But this Spock seems far more comfortable in exploring this part of his humanity than Spock Prime was. Maybe some of it has to do with his father telling him he actually loved his mother. Hey, if it was OK for dad, who is full Vulcan, then -- .

I definitely believe this Spock will reach his, "If I were human, I believe my response would be, go to hell," moment in life a lot sooner than Spock Prime did.

So many people say so many things, but what I've heard is if TOS had continued, they may have toyed with a Spock-Uhura relationship, not Spock and Chapel. but over the decades, it's hard to separate out fact from fabrication or just a person's sincere but bad memory.

[M'Sharak]

Franklin wrote:

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I definitely believe this Spock will reach his, "If I were human, I believe my response would be, go to hell," moment in life a lot sooner than Spock Prime did.

Star Trek 3: Spock Amok... coming to a theatre near you in 2016.

[Shazam!]

Franklin wrote:

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I definitely believe this Spock will reach his, "If I were human, I believe my response would be, go to hell," moment in life a lot sooner than Spock Prime did.

He was basically there at the end of Trek XI.

serenitytrek1 wrote:

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In case you want to know the similarties between all this cahracters..they all had leading roles in the films and the romantic plot is between at least 2 of the characters I mentioned.

Yes, it's certainly a common cinematic trope. Or cliché, if you will.

All I'm saying is that I think the Spock / Uhura relationship was a cheap trick used to insert unnecessary melodrama (as if Spock didn't have enough going on in that movie) and to drag a few extra female butts to the seats, that there was a reason they used Spock outside of say, Scotty, as emotionally detached and / or distant leading men are very much en vogue as evidenced by Twilight etc

If you disagree, fine, but don't accuse me of not getting it because I'm a 'man'. It's rude and needlessly dismissive.

[serenitytrek1]

Shazam! wrote:

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He was basically there at the end of Trek XI.

Yes, it's certainly a common cinematic trope. Or cliché, if you will.

All I'm saying is that I think the Spock / Uhura relationship was a cheap trick used to insert unnecessary melodrama (as if Spock didn't have enough going on in that movie) and to drag a few extra female butts to the seats, that there was a reason they used Spock outside of say, Scotty, as emotionally detached and / or distant leading men are very much en vogue as evidenced by Twilight etc

If you disagree, fine, but don't accuse me of not getting it because I'm a 'man'. It's rude and needlessly dismissive.

No offence again but you are still dont uderstand much. A cliché romance is a romance with two perfect pretty people having a relationship based on lust , superficiality and shallowness.

And again, they could not use scotty because he had a supporting role and was hardly a character in the first film. the love story must always been between the main leads. so that will be kirk/spock, spock/uhura or kirk/uhura. why is that so hard to understand.

There is nothing cliché about that. what will be cliché will be the substance and depth of the romantic relationship.

Also there is nothing wrong with attracting women...you are the one that is been sexist. You think trek should be all about actions and explosions and should have no feminine attribute like romance.

JJ trying to appeal to the masses is not a cheap trick it is a smart trick to make star trek more commercially successful and more popular among men and women.

In case you dont know but every film in history,regardless of its genre has always had added a romantic plot to the story line.

A lot of men loved Titanic.... they are just too ashamed to admit it.

[Malaika]

not surprised that the actors are so evasive about it

Zoe Saldana in another interview said:

“Whether they are together or not that will remain to be seen. But come on, I'm not going to ruin the element of surprise! I signed papers, trust me! I will lose a kidney if I say too much!”
well

this bit by Zachary Quinto from a recent article for EW is interesting though

"I think we tapped into something in the first film that a lot of people weren't expecting, which is the emotional undercurrent and how powerfully it runs through him. That continues in this film. There are things that happen to him -- and things that he's part of -- that are incredibly personal. That was really exciting for me both physically and emotionally."


I guess you won't know what he's talking about until may though

Shazam! wrote:

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The Spock / Uhura thing is a load of forced melodrama, pandering to a tween audience conditioned to the female lead falling for the emotionally distant handsome male.

It's a lazy attempt at giving the Uhura character a 3rd dimension and probably more insulting to the character than any of the lowest Uhura moments TOS presented us with.

so what Spock finally getting the girl could be pandering to socially awkward nerds that dream to get the hottest girl for once

the old " pandering to" argument...
girls only like romance, the fanboys only wants actions and don't want the girl to distract the guys from their videogames.. what next? who wants to add more stereotypes?
up this point breaking them up would be as fan pandering as keeping them together

fyi, most of the shippers in the trek fandom, that are women, are slash fans anyway...

The Mirrorball Man wrote:

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In what way? How would that have served the movie, and how would it have worked thematically?

perhaps because ~thematically~ the few times the black girl is the love interest of the white guy, the latter is a secondary character (better if unattractive). Now that's predictable.
(notice how MCcoy didn't get a mention in that above comment )
That would surely fit with Hollywood-pre-established set of rules when it comes to love interests for characters like Uhura and would, therefore, be a cliché.
It is ironic, isn't it? say hi to intersectionality
Even nowadays, it takes more guts to put her with the white iconic protagonist, add that it's Spock of the two... whoa those crazy writers...

I'm just saying. Thing is, I'm white but Uhura is not a white girl and it's good to remember it.