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Old March 1 2013, 07:24 PM   #31
T'Girl
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

Dick_Valentine wrote: View Post
Well they had that stupid movie night idea, I guess they could've all gathered round for the latest hot new band night and it wouldn't really have changed tooooo much ...
They could pretend that part of every episode was amateur night among the crew.

Outfit the hot new band in ugly blue jumpsuits.

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Old March 1 2013, 09:27 PM   #32
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

Maybe one of the stupidest ideas I've heard regarding Trek. Talk about a disconnect!!
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Old March 1 2013, 09:50 PM   #33
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

They could have had a stage in the mess hall equipped with holographic projectors, and played the "retro 2001 is cool in 2151" angle. I really can't see it fitting in with the version of Enterprise we actually got, though.

If they ever do a Starfleet Academy TV series, it'd be a perfect fit.
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Old March 1 2013, 10:07 PM   #34
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

feek61 wrote: View Post
Maybe one of the stupidest ideas I've heard regarding Trek. Talk about a disconnect!!
Well, I can kind of see what the executive's point of view was. After all, album cross-promotions have long been an important source of revenue for the small networks -- first The WB and UPN, now The CW. It's something they do on a number of their shows and it helps keep them in business. So probably this executive's specific job was, in part, to look for opportunities to incorporate album/band promotions into any and every show the network made. I doubt he saw Enterprise as a natural fit, but he was trying to figure out a way to make it happen anyway because that was part of his job, his particular responsibilities and priorities. The show's creators make the show their top priority, but the network executives need to make the overall needs of the network their priority, and sometimes -- often -- those come into conflict.
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Old March 1 2013, 11:19 PM   #35
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

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Yes but... this TrekCore interview remark leads me to think that appealing to a younger demographic via new pop music was only a small part of the deal.

Seems to me that directly promoting whatever "hot young bands" was the main factor, what with the album card appearing at the eps end and all that.

The big thing seems to be having these (again) "hot young bands" appear directly, performing their songs, in the eps, as part of a promotion deal.

Having the crew only listening to their music, or playing their music, probably wouldn't be enough. Sounds like the bands had to show up playing on-screen somehow.

Maybe that's not the case, but that's my read of the interview. It needn't be that way. I remember the eps promos used pop music, a way could have been found to use more of it without directly including the "HOT YOUNG BANDS" in the ship's restaurant.
Eh, there's several ways it could have been done.

As previously mentioned, it could be a broadcast they are watching, or they could slide them into holoprograms, or as just mentioned, have the band members guest sar as Star Fleet personnel competing in a talent contest.

Now, of course, none of these ideas could be used every week, and working a band in every week, would likely be a disster anyways, but, no reason they couldn't find ways to do it a few times a season.

Another possibility might be to have different bands sing the opening theme.
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Old March 1 2013, 11:42 PM   #36
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

SchwEnt wrote: View Post
Yes but... this TrekCore interview remark leads me to think that appealing to a younger demographic via new pop music was only a small part of the deal.
I thought that all the rubbing off in the decon scenes were them trying to appeal to a younger demographic?

It probably did the exact opposite for many people. It made me feel so embarrassed that I was watching ENT at times.

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The show's creators make the show their top priority, but the network executives need to make the overall needs of the network their priority, and sometimes -- often -- those come into conflict.
One of the advantages that TNG and DS9 had that VOY and ENT didn't was that TNG/DS9 didn't have to answer to any network since both were first run syndication shows. Paramount decision to bypass the big networks was a blessing. Trek was dealt a terrible blow when the first run syndication market died off.
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Old March 1 2013, 11:52 PM   #37
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

Sindatur wrote: View Post
Another possibility might be to have different bands sing the opening theme.
Yep. Remixes & cover versions. One week Evanescence. Noel Gallagher the next. Linkin Park the next.

But this being UPN, we'd have gotten some (now long forgotten) talent show winner doing it... They'd take that great idea and turn it into shit, because Enterprise had a demographic and you can stretch that slightly, but it wouldn't ever completely fit in with who their other programming was aimed at.

I wonder if Berman & Braga ended up in anyway resentful of Manny Coto? I mean the reviews are much better for that last season, and clearly UPN seemed to have completely given up on tinkering with Enterprise - probably because its fate was already sealed - but there's a new found freedom, in which the show is finally allowed to be a Star Trek fans could identify with. Certain pre-existing elements from the show's history like the Orions and Augments, meeting some of that desire for more sexualisation and eye candy for a general audience, having been right there all along.

On the basis of "In a Mirror, Darkly" they ought to have kept changing the theme tune every year. Weirdly, the song became more upbeat in the darkest season. Some contrasts between music and the scene surrounding it work. This one didn't for me. "Impulse" and T'Pol is screaming in Sickbay. Cut to the happy clappy song. "Twilight" and the whole Earth is gone. Cut to the inspirational theme.

I'd have been quite keen to see Enterprise get a few "All Along the Watchtower" moments a lá BSG...
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Old March 2 2013, 12:01 AM   #38
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

It was an interesting juxtaposition, to say the least
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Old March 2 2013, 12:03 AM   #39
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

ChristopherPike wrote: View Post
I'd have been quite keen to see Enterprise get a few "All Along the Watchtower" moments.
The last thing Trek needed was to copy other shows. For all the people that kept preaching how much nuBSG was SO much better than Trek, they certainly have disappeared now that nearly all interest in nuBSG has died off.
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Old March 2 2013, 12:37 AM   #40
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

The whole idea is rather odd, but it's not like there's never been music in Trek that goes outside of theme songs and incidental music. I think what I dislike the most about it is the concept of it being a regular thing. Why not have it, but as a rare occurrence? Bring in whoever - dress them up as crew members and make it some sort of - the crew is getting a well-deserved break - or whatever. Hell, I actually write a pair of E2 crew members as playing guitar and singing because you've got a century to kill so why not do a little coffee house kind of act? But it would have to be small.

Part II of an E2 two-parter (try saying that three times fast) - Archer: How'd you entertain yourselves over the course of a century? I mean, other than having kids and dodging the Xindi? Karyn: We turned the Observation Lounge into a performance space. Some of the intervening generations, well, you know not everyone is into science. Some of them turned out to be really artistic, and musically talented. My Uncle Pete is; c'mon and I'll take you.
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Old March 2 2013, 12:39 AM   #41
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

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The whole idea is rather odd, but it's not like there's never been music in Trek that goes outside of theme songs and incidental music. I think what I dislike the most about it is the concept of it being a regular thing. Why not have it, but as a rare occurrence? Bring in whoever - dress them up as crew members and make it some sort of - the crew is getting a well-deserved break - or whatever. Hell, I actually write a pair of E2 crew members as playing guitar and singing because you've got a century to kill so why not do a little coffee house kind of act? But it would have to be small.
They learned their lesson after all the bad singing by the hippies in "Way to Eden" which terribly dated the series.

That's the reason we only have classical and Jazz music in TNG.
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Old March 2 2013, 12:40 AM   #42
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

King Daniel wrote: View Post
It was an interesting juxtaposition, to say the least
Especially since none of the characters on BSG, are even from the same species as Bob Dylan...

The more I think about this, the more I think music from popular culture is an inevitability in the next Star Trek series. That's basically how Hollywood works. It doesn't necessarily make it a bad thing. Loads of popular film and TV shows I appreciate do it. But you can count examples done by this franchise on the fingers of one hand... Only the theme tune of this show polarises. No pun intended! That'll largely be because its in your face, and potentially repeated ad nauseum. Where incidental music can be subtle and leaving the audience curious to discover more, while blending in with the drama.
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Old March 2 2013, 01:10 AM   #43
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

Dream wrote: View Post
jespah wrote: View Post
The whole idea is rather odd, but it's not like there's never been music in Trek that goes outside of theme songs and incidental music. I think what I dislike the most about it is the concept of it being a regular thing. Why not have it, but as a rare occurrence? Bring in whoever - dress them up as crew members and make it some sort of - the crew is getting a well-deserved break - or whatever. Hell, I actually write a pair of E2 crew members as playing guitar and singing because you've got a century to kill so why not do a little coffee house kind of act? But it would have to be small.
They learned their lesson after all the bad singing by the hippies in "Way to Eden" which terribly dated the series.

That's the reason we only have classical and Jazz music in TNG.
Oh, it definitely dates it - but you can have music that wouldn't have as much of danger of that.

The real problem is the attempt to be cutting edge. Any time that's done, a show ends up being dated, and often really, really quickly. Consider, if you will, The Mod Squad and Laugh-In. Very hip for their time. Cringe-inducingly dated now. Hell, just look at SNL's musical guests from years back, particularly the 70s. Leo Sayer - eek!

Hence put out something unplugged, very low key. Not the next (or current) hit for anyone.

Not Culp (or Hayes) of course, but something like this. Something that does NOT look pro.
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Old March 2 2013, 01:51 AM   #44
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

The network execs may be at fault for not letting Voyager and Enterprise be the shows they were supposed to be, but you can't blame them for all the shitty scripts that plagued both shows.

I doubt the network execs told them: "Make 5 time travel episodes a season", or "Make the temporal cold war absurdly convoluted, and not in a mysterious exciting Lost or Twin Peaks sense, but rather in a 'Just fucking stupid and impossible to logically track' sense."

They could have made a much better show with more serialized arcs. They could have made a much better show with an episodic 25th century show. But with such low standards for scripts, they could have never produced anything anyone liked.

Between the end of DS9 and the 3rd season of Enterprise, both the execs and the writers displayed absolutely no idea what the people who still tuned in every week wanted in a television show. The execs thought they wanted the same repetitive predictable drivel you see on a show like Full House, and the writers thought they wanted rehashes of successful TNG tropes. None of them ever thought 'Hey, let's have a character driven show with exciting adventure and smart action', which is what might have kept the franchise going a little longer.
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Old March 2 2013, 02:07 AM   #45
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Re: Enterprise: Exec wanted "Top Bands" on the show

JirinPanthosa wrote: View Post
Between the end of DS9 and the 3rd season of Enterprise, both the execs and the writers displayed absolutely no idea what the people who still tuned in every week wanted in a television show. The execs thought they wanted the same repetitive predictable drivel you see on a show like Full House, and the writers thought they wanted rehashes of successful TNG tropes. None of them ever thought 'Hey, let's have a character driven show with exciting adventure and smart action', which is what might have kept the franchise going a little longer.
To be fair, Braga wanted some character and political stuff for his version of season 1, which was about building the Enterprise after a Klingon attack. The problem was the execs wanted the TNG formula and no continuity, so the writers just had to follow the orders from on high until the poor ratings caused the execs to loosen up the reigns for S3 and S4.
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