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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

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Old February 20 2013, 06:28 PM   #31
The Wormhole
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

Brendan Moody wrote: View Post
RTD does go on about the legal difficulties regarding the Brigadier in The Writer's Tale, and how Haisman and Lincoln were so uncooperative that RTD had at one point considered giving up.
Could you give a page number or a general location for that? Before posting I looked in the index for references to the Brigadier, and found only two; page 400 where Davies gets the idea, and page 402 where Courtney is at the read-through. There's nothing in-between about any difficulties. There's also no entry for Haisman or Lincoln in the index.
Huh, just did a quick look through and couldn't find anything. I knew I read it somewhere.
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Old February 20 2013, 06:34 PM   #32
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

Mr Awe wrote: View Post
StCoop wrote: View Post
Mr Awe wrote: View Post
^ What legal hoops?
Much like the Daleks and Terry Nation, the copyright on the Brig would be shared with Mervyn Haisman & Henry Lincon, who seemed to be (understandably) waiting for the right offer before they'd let him be used.
Argh, I always forget the British system were somehow the show doesn't retain the rights to the characters and stuff. In the US, this is a non-issue. If you write for a show, you know that you don't own what you're writing (I'm sure it's in the contract).

But, this never seemed to be an issue for the Brigadier character the other times he returned in the original series?

Mr Awe
It's apparently not quite that simple in the US, since Tom Paris got a new name in Voyager so they didn't have to pay Royalties in every episode for Nick Lacarno
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Old February 20 2013, 06:57 PM   #33
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

Sindatur wrote: View Post
It's apparently not quite that simple in the US, since Tom Paris got a new name in Voyager so they didn't have to pay Royalties in every episode for Nick Lacarno
I think the difference is in the US you get paid if they use your character but you don't get any say over what they do with it.
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Old February 20 2013, 07:01 PM   #34
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

StCoop wrote: View Post
Sindatur wrote: View Post
It's apparently not quite that simple in the US, since Tom Paris got a new name in Voyager so they didn't have to pay Royalties in every episode for Nick Lacarno
I think the difference is in the US you get paid if they use your character but you don't get any say over what they do with it.
Ahhhh...OK, yea, havng to pay for a character's usage, is often enough of a deterrent in itself.
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Old February 20 2013, 07:07 PM   #35
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

Makes me wonder how we finally managed to get a Brigadier action figure. Or, maybe that's why it took as long as it did.

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Old February 20 2013, 07:09 PM   #36
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

Redfern wrote: View Post
Makes me wonder how we finally managed to get a Brigadier action figure. Or, maybe that's why it took as long as it did.
Well, one of them's dead and the other one lost a lawsuit against Dan Brown...
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Old February 20 2013, 07:20 PM   #37
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

StCoop wrote: View Post
Redfern wrote: View Post
Makes me wonder how we finally managed to get a Brigadier action figure. Or, maybe that's why it took as long as it did.
Well, one of them's dead and the other one lost a lawsuit against Dan Brown...
As mentioned, Henry Lincoln was the Holy Blood writer who didn't join the other two in their case against Dan Brown, which meant he didn't have to pay the legal costs when it failed!
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Old February 20 2013, 07:25 PM   #38
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

StCoop wrote: View Post
Sindatur wrote: View Post
It's apparently not quite that simple in the US, since Tom Paris got a new name in Voyager so they didn't have to pay Royalties in every episode for Nick Lacarno
I think the difference is in the US you get paid if they use your character but you don't get any say over what they do with it.
Also, in the US (or at least with Trek) it only applies to characters, not alien species. People like Gene L Coon or Maurice Hurley don't collect royalties whenever Klingons, Romulans or Borg are used.
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Old February 20 2013, 07:45 PM   #39
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
StCoop wrote: View Post
Sindatur wrote: View Post
It's apparently not quite that simple in the US, since Tom Paris got a new name in Voyager so they didn't have to pay Royalties in every episode for Nick Lacarno
I think the difference is in the US you get paid if they use your character but you don't get any say over what they do with it.
Also, in the US (or at least with Trek) it only applies to characters, not alien species. People like Gene L Coon or Maurice Hurley don't collect royalties whenever Klingons, Romulans or Borg are used.
But they were, I believe, on the permanent writing staff at the time - ie, salaried workers on a permanent contract - rather than freelancers contributing a single script. The key test case would, I guess, be whether Paul Schneider (who was a freelancer when he wrote Balance of Terror) does own the Romulans.
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Old February 20 2013, 08:30 PM   #40
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

diankra wrote: View Post
From what I understand, it's more Haisman than Lincoln (Henry Lincoln was, notably, the one member of the trio who wrote The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail who didn't join in with the unsuccessful attempt to sue Dan Brown for Da Vinci Code profits). It may be no coincidence that some of their other creations have finally returned to the series now that Haisman himself has passed on and the decisions are taken by his heirs (who don't feel his bitterness over The Dominators incident in quite the same way).
diankra, what was the "Dominators incident"?

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Old February 20 2013, 08:55 PM   #41
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

Haisman and Lincoln were very unhappy about the way the production of The Dominators went: there were problems over the copyright for the Quarks (which they hoped would be as big as the Daleks and make their fortune, and which may have been licenced to TV Comic without their OK), and the script editor (disliking what he was getting) cancelled their six episode commission after receipt of episode four and wrote his own single episode conclusion (plus an extra filler episode stuck onto the front of The Mind Robber).*
They took their name off the serial, and started legal action to try and prevent its transmission (which may be why a complete set of prints has always been kept by the BBC, as evidence related to the case. That's pure speculation, but it would explain why The Dominators was at one point the only complete story form the black and white years in the archives apart from An Unearthly Child).
The case was eventually settled out of court and the serial shown as planned, but the pair never wrote for the series again, with the third Yeti story that was already in the works being dropped as a result.


*Edit: Actually, I think he cancelled after getting episode five,m at which point he re-edited 3&4 into one episode and then wrote his own one episode conclusion. But it stil ended up as a five parter rather than the six originally commissioned.
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Old February 20 2013, 09:52 PM   #42
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Re: Adventures in Space & Time & Misdirection?

diankra wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
StCoop wrote: View Post

I think the difference is in the US you get paid if they use your character but you don't get any say over what they do with it.
Also, in the US (or at least with Trek) it only applies to characters, not alien species. People like Gene L Coon or Maurice Hurley don't collect royalties whenever Klingons, Romulans or Borg are used.
But they were, I believe, on the permanent writing staff at the time - ie, salaried workers on a permanent contract - rather than freelancers contributing a single script. The key test case would, I guess, be whether Paul Schneider (who was a freelancer when he wrote Balance of Terror) does own the Romulans.
I recall a Starlog article in the early 90s on this. If I remember correctly, Scheider wasn't eligible for royalties on the Romulans.

Jerome Bixby attempted to get royalties for the Mirror Universe when Deep Space Nine started using it annually, but his claim was rejected as the Mirror Universe was a concept rather than a character.
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