La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

[Tallguy]

ssosmcin wrote:

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The only time the sound quality bugged me was with the first GNP release. The tapes for The Cage and WNMHGB were in such bad shape, it was just a little too shrill for me. It didn't help that the score were out there to begin with. Now they're soooo much nicer and easier on the ears.

Shrill is not a bad description. They weren't horrendous but the new ones are much much nicer.

ssosmcin wrote:

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Now that I'm hearing The Cage score in such great quality and clarity, rather than the smear-a-thon we've lived with since the mid-80's, I can detect a soprano during the credits. I never heard that voice before, which is a real eye (or ear) opener.

Wow, that's got to be quite an experience. I always could hear the vocal, even on the GNP. OTOH, I discovered with TMP that there were some times where I would say "Oh WOW I could never hear that before!" Then I'd go listen to an earlier recording and discover that I could hear it, I just hadn't given the old recordings the laser-like focus I've given these.

TREK_GOD_1 wrote:

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...or, you can ask yourselves:

1. Which season's music says "Star Trek" to you more than the rest--or do they equally represent that feeling/thought?
2. Do you think TOS' music is the greatest ever composed for the ST franchise?
3. Among the best--or the best score ever composed in TV history?

1. Season 1. Hands down. For one thing look at season three and see how much of 2 they re-recorded vs. how much of 1 they were STILL using. But to me Charlie X IS Star Trek. There is certainly a lot more, don't get me wrong. But if you only had Charlie X you'd have a very good representation of the whole show. More so (IMHO) than any other score.

2. No. I love it, but the movies are going to win that fight. But after that? Yes, TOS all the way.

3. I'll waffle on that one. I'm too close to it to really make an unbiased judgement. Lost and nuBSG are pretty darn good. And that Gold fellow scores the heck out of Doctor Who. But I can't think of any other show I'd drop $200 for at a chunk.

[ssosmcin]

1. Which season's music says "Star Trek" to you more than the rest--or do they equally represent that feeling/thought?

That's a tough question. I can tell you what scores I prefer, but I can't sat if one season's music sounds more "Star Trek" than the others.

2. Do you think TOS' music is the greatest ever composed for the ST franchise?

Among the best at any rate. Goldsmith and Horner did grand things, but Sol Kaplan brought movie music to the TV. I think someone else said that too.

3. Among the best--or the best score ever composed in TV history?

That's an impossible question to answer, since there has been so much great music in TV. I'll say it's my favorite, about even with the John Williams Lost In Space music. Of its era, it's easily in the top one or two. The fullness of the sound belies the number of musicians. These guys all sound great, among their best sounding work. Compare the same composers' scores to the Man from UNCLE stuff, where the ensembles were much smaller - and it showed. The music was thin and sounded like a "couple of guys in a garage." With Trek, it's like night and day.

[Garrovick]

TREK_GOD_1 wrote:

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...or, you can ask yourselves:

1. Which season's music says "Star Trek" to you more than the rest--or do they equally represent that feeling/thought?

2. Do you think TOS' music is the greatest ever composed for the ST franchise?

3. Among the best--or the best score ever composed in TV history?

1. That's a real toughie. Season 1 has The Corbomite Maneuver, The Enemy Within, Charlie X, Shore Leave, and WNMHGB, while Season 2 has Amok Time, The Doomsday Machine, Friday's Child, The Trouble with Tribbles, Who Mourns for Adonais?, and Catspaw - Not to mention Season 3 with Spectre of the Gun, Elaan of Troyius, The Empath, and The Paradise Syndrome. I can't choose a season, they are all essential IMO.

2. Yep. Without a doubt. Especially considering the time constraints that the composers/musicians had to work under. Nothing against the movies or other series work, but TOS stands above them all.

3. I don't know about TOS being among the best in TV history - there's been an awful lot of great music composed over the years, and comparing TOS to many other equally classic shows is like comparing apples to oranges, really. But if you narrow it down to TV Sci-Fi shows, I'd put TOS among the all-time greats, for sure.

I've listened to the whole release now, and it's been quite an educational experience for me. I've got a few other thoughts:

I never realized that each season had a certain amount of library music. I always thought that each track was originally composed for a specific episode and then re-used later as needed. I was shocked to find that the music for Kirk's speech to Mirror Spock at the end of "Mirror, Mirror" was a library cue. I also felt that about some of the re-recorded Gerald Fried music (especially Down the Throat) that was used in Season 3.

I've really gained an appreciation for the work of Gerald Duning. I never really considered him as one of the "great" TOS composers before, but his stuff really is excellent, especially (IMO) The Paradise Syndrome and The Empath.

I really wish Sol Kaplan had scored more TOS episodes. The track where the two Kirk's confront each other in the engine room is my all-time single favorite track of ST music. I'd have almost been willing to pay the $200 for "The Enemy Within" alone. I just wonder how it would have been if he had scored some episodes that were actually scored with music from other episodes - I'd love to hear an original Kaplan score for "The Galileo Seven" or "Arena" or "Obsession".

Just a few random thoughts. Overall, I thoroughly love this release and it was worth every last penny.

[KirkPicard]

Re-listeining to disc 1, track 24. Is the last part of "Stronger and Stronger" cut off? At about 33:21 of "Where No Man" the shot changes to the Enterprise in orbit with additional music and fades out as Scotty inserts the new bridge console. Is that part tracked from another piece earlier in the episode?

Update:
OK, sounds as if this part is from 0:08-0:20 into "Beyond the Pale"

[ssosmcin]

Yeah, we're so used to the tracking, even within episodes of original music, that it's easy to forget some of it is tracked. Or it just doesn't sound "right" unedited. This is one of those tracks, so I had to go back and add that bit from Beyond the Pale. Now it sounds right.

[ssosmcin]

Must rescue this thread from oblivion. Never fear, Sargon is here.

As I go through the music, I find myself noticing how some cues work better in episodes they were tracked in, rather than those they were composed for. A great score for a crappy episode can work so much better in a good episode (whereas a great score for a great story works best in its home episode). An example would be the cue from "Spock's Brain" called "Magic Helmet #2" where Bones puts on the teacher hat. It's a fantastic cue that tries so hard to make what's happening seem important, but falls flat because the situation is just so damned stupid.

However, that same piece of music is used in "The Tholian Web" as Kirk is finally beamed back aboard. In contrast to "Spock's Brain" the music here works beautifully. It underscores the desperation, the last ditch effort and then finally the feeling of victory that they got him back just in time. It makes the scene memorable and caps a fine episode perfectly. In fact, whenever I hear that cue, I think of Web over Brain every time.

Anyone else finding this as they listen?

[Christopher]

^I don't think that scene in "Spock's Brain" is stupid. In fact, I think it's one of DeForest Kelley's finest moments on the show. The way he delivers that line, "A child could do it!" -- it's awesome.

But there are some cues from "The Enemy Within" that I do tend to associate more with "Arena." And the portion of the "Spock's Brain" score where the Morgs are stalking the landing party and about to attack tends to remind me more of its uses in other episodes like "The Savage Curtain."

[mos6507]

There definitely is an artistry to compiled scores. I mean, one need only look at 2001, for instance. Just because something was written for one purpose doesn't mean it can't work equally well if not better in another context. Even though it was done as a cost-cutting measure, it doesn't mean it can't be very effective. I was rewatching the drinking scene in "By Any Other Name" and that is chocked full of tracked music. Some of the way the music was slotted in was a little abrupt, but it certainly works beautifully, and it's one of the signature TOS moments. I doubt anybody who watches the episode is going to be thinking "Gee, that music doesn't seem to match what's going on. It must be tracked. How cheap!" Even if you recognize the piece and where it comes from, it doesn't mean you can't also appreciate how it slots into the different frame. This topic resonates for me because I'm currently not using a film scorer for my shorts, so I have to use compiled music, and I can tell you that there is a lot of thought that goes into it, at least if you want to do it _well_.

[Christopher]

Whereas I often do notice that a tracked cue doesn't fit the action very closely. Decades of watching and rewatching shows with tracked music gave me a feel for when the music was tailored to the scene and when it wasn't. And as a rule, I prefer the former. Tracked cues often do feel like rough or marginal fits to what's onscreen, especially if they're built around themes that were specifically meant to represent particular characters or entities from the episode they were written for. (One instance that comes to mind is a cue from the animated series Gargoyles that was written for a scene of martial-arts sparring and thus had a loosely Japanese flavor to it. It was frequently reused as just a generic action cue in later episodes and didn't fit as well. And the distinctive theme for the character Macbeth was often used in contexts having nothing to do with Macbeth, which was annoying to me.)

And sometimes you're limited by the style of the available music. I've said before that I think "A Piece of the Action" would've been stronger if they'd ponied up for an original score that fit the Jazz-Age mobster milieu.

[ssosmcin]

Christopher wrote:

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^I don't think that scene in "Spock's Brain" is stupid. In fact, I think it's one of DeForest Kelley's finest moments on the show. The way he delivers that line, "A child could do it!" -- it's awesome.

To each his own, and I agree De's work is great. But at this point in the episode, I find it difficult to take much of this seriously. It's just been too "out there" for me to consider the situation important. The score, which is, again, great, works very hard, but much as I enjoy the episode, I'm not buying it. But that's just me. "Spock's Brain" is a guilty pleasure, but I'm well aware it's Irwin Allen worthy (on Irwin's best day).

Christopher wrote:

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But there are some cues from "The Enemy Within" that I do tend to associate more with "Arena." And the portion of the "Spock's Brain" score where the Morgs are stalking the landing party and about to attack tends to remind me more of its uses in other episodes like "The Savage Curtain."

I'm the same way with cues from "What Are Little Girls Made Of?" used in "Arena." The much used "Ruk Protect" for example.

[Garrovick]

ssosmcin wrote:

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I'm the same way with cues from "What Are Little Girls Made Of?" used in "Arena." The much used "Ruk Protect" for example.

There are several tracks from "Is There In Truth No Beauty" that I tend to associate with "Day of the Dove" quite a bit, especially the music used in "Dove" for the emotion-vampire (or whatever it's called).

There's also a track from "Amok Time" that was used in "Journey to Babel" for the scene where Amanda pleads with Spock in his quarters to help save Sarek's life that just works so beautifully in that scene.

Also, whenever they play the track from "The Corbomite Maneuver" where they first attempt to evade the cube, and then destroy it, I always think of Captain Christopher attempting to intercept the Enterprise with his F-104.

[The Warlord]

Still heard nothing as to regards to that Spock's Brain cue. I honestly believe it is missing from the set, and if it is indeed a composite cue, the detail heard in it, the natural fade etc, leads me to speculate it cannot be drawn from the elements we have on the Spock's Brain disc.

[feek61]

The thing that really surprises me about the set is how many recordings of the main theme and ending credit music there is. I knew there were a couple but it seems there are quite a few on the collection (which I frickin' love).

[ssosmcin]

I'm still revisiting this set and it's been like two months since I got it. Easily the crown jewel in my library and one hell of an amazing collection.

[RandyS]

ssosmcin wrote:

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I'm still revisiting this set and it's been like two months since I got it. Easily the crown jewel in my library and one hell of an amazing collection.

I know what you mean. I listened to the whole thing over the first two weeks I had it, and have been thinking about revisiting it too, which I might just do after I finish listening to my Batman Animated Series soundtracks.

Which by the way, is ALSO a great collection of music.