Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? - Page 2

teacake · February 18 2013, 09:48 PM

I'm just defending ENT from the idea that not having a DS9 style finale lessened it. I like a good finale as much as anyone but I don't think a Trek series needs one to be great.. it's not like Lost or other conspiracy shows where you are pumped into wanting answers. It's just a pretty wrap up for the most part. To me the best part of DS9's finale was that it left Sisko's fate open ended.

And I would have loved a 5th season, reading the descriptions is almost painful because it would have been quite excellent.

DonIago · February 18 2013, 11:16 PM

As someone who believes one of the main goals of a series finale should be to give the audience an idea of where the characters are going (per Lost, I don't necessarily care about questions being answered if the finale handles other things well), I think ENT was lessened by the lack thereof.

To be fair I haven't seen ENT in forever, so I might consider Terra Prime/Demons a reasonable attempt at such.

Mach5 · February 18 2013, 11:47 PM

Demons/TP was a solid season finale, but it doesn't offer any kind of closure for the characters, really. And TATV... TATV completely disregards everything that happened in Season 4, ignores every single bit of character development and feels so much out of place, it's jarring.

VOY's "Endgame" falls short too. After seven years of rooting for the heroes to return home, you don't actually get to see them do it.

ChristopherPike · February 19 2013, 12:14 AM

teacake wrote:

I'm just defending ENT from the idea that not having a DS9 style finale lessened it. I like a good finale as much as anyone but I don't think a Trek series needs one to be great.. it's not like Lost or other conspiracy shows where you are pumped into wanting answers. It's just a pretty wrap up for the most part. To me the best part of DS9's finale was that it left Sisko's fate open ended.

And I would have loved a 5th season, reading the descriptions is almost painful because it would have been quite excellent.

That's cool. Also there are only two ways to get that DS9 level of closure really. The previous shows and movies set in the 23rd & 24th Centuries for the politics of Federation and various non-allied worlds. For the characters, the Pocket Book novels which having done the Romulan War, are now moving onto setting up more of what we might've seen, had they gone beyond 2161 and what the NX-01 crew move onto, career-wise.

Probably very unlikely ENT will get another mention in the JJ Abrams pictures, but you never know. They got away Scott-free with that throwaway line about Admiral Archer's prized beagle

teacake · February 19 2013, 12:59 AM

I'm betting it will get a mention, subtle or otherwise. Maybe we'll just see an NX-01 model in the background on someones bookcase, but it will be there. I think the last movie showed a lot of attention to details.

RandyS · February 19 2013, 01:37 AM

teacake wrote:

ChristopherPike wrote:

Take TATV out of the equation, which I'm inclined to do (because it feels like it was written in isolation and utterly disconnected from the other 19 or so episodes before it) and there's no closure.

I don't need closure since I know what happens in the 24 seasons of Star Trek that follow it.

Same here.

And what exactly is a "proper finale" anyway?? TOS ended without one in 1969 after all.

teacake · February 19 2013, 01:43 AM

Oh I don't know, I think Kirk turning into a woman was its own kind of closure.

DonIago · February 19 2013, 04:48 AM

Ouch.

RandyS · February 19 2013, 05:49 AM

teacake wrote:

Oh I don't know, I think Kirk turning into a woman was its own kind of closure.

Bry_Sinclair · February 21 2013, 03:34 PM

Ending on "Terra Prime" is the best piece of advice I could give anyone. ENT was just starting to find its feet and when it was cancelled, they go and give us "These Are The Voyages" to end with? Major step back.

If it had been a future episode (set in 2161) and just ignored the Riker and Troi stuff it could have been halfway decent.

Dale Sams · February 26 2013, 12:25 AM

Bry, am I to take it that the Battlefield Earth aliens are a part of Star Trek Online canon?

AllStarEntprise · February 27 2013, 05:43 AM

Bry_Sinclair wrote:

Ending on "Terra Prime" is the best piece of advice I could give anyone. ENT was just starting to find its feet and when it was cancelled, they go and give us "These Are The Voyages" to end with? Major step back.

If it had been a future episode (set in 2161) and just ignored the Riker and Troi stuff it could have been halfway decent.

What were they thinking having Riker and Troi in the episode anyway? Watching TATV and Pegasus back to back is so disorienting. You can't help but conclude that Berman and Braga were high when they thought this lazy attempt would swing with fans. Valentine to the fans my ass. Why not set it post Nemesis? Instead of trying to ignore the fact the actors had aged 11 years since the tie-in episode it's connected to first aired. Maybe TATV is in an alternate universe where the ENT-D was never destroyed and the Pegasus story happened years later than it did in the prime timeline.

Dream · February 27 2013, 05:46 AM

Even TNG fans hated TATV. That's how bad it was!

teacake · February 27 2013, 06:24 AM

AllStarEntprise wrote:

What were they thinking having Riker and Troi in the episode anyway? Watching TATV and Pegasus back to back is so disorienting. You can't help but conclude that Berman and Braga were high when they thought this lazy attempt would swing with fans. Valentine to the fans my ass. Why not set it post Nemesis? Instead of trying to ignore the fact the actors had aged 11 years since the tie-in episode it's connected to first aired. Maybe TATV is in an alternate universe where the ENT-D was never destroyed and the Pegasus story happened years later than it did in the prime timeline.

No no, there needed to be a TNG episode with a bloating disease that TATV is set during.

King Daniel · February 27 2013, 11:19 AM

^Whatever happened to Kirk's hands in the last movie was happening to Riker and Troi for the entire episode??

February 18 2013, 09:48 PM	#16
teacake Admiral Location: Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound. With Sehlats.	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? I'm just defending ENT from the idea that not having a DS9 style finale lessened it. I like a good finale as much as anyone but I don't think a Trek series needs one to be great.. it's not like Lost or other conspiracy shows where you are pumped into wanting answers. It's just a pretty wrap up for the most part. To me the best part of DS9's finale was that it left Sisko's fate open ended. And I would have loved a 5th season, reading the descriptions is almost painful because it would have been quite excellent. __________________ Rider: I can't believe you'd kill me for a field of empty holes. J'onn: It's all I have. ■ ■ ■ Janeway does Melbourne

February 18 2013, 11:16 PM	#17
DonIago Rear Admiral Location: Burlington, VT, USA	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? As someone who believes one of the main goals of a series finale should be to give the audience an idea of where the characters are going (per Lost, I don't necessarily care about questions being answered if the finale handles other things well), I think ENT was lessened by the lack thereof. To be fair I haven't seen ENT in forever, so I might consider Terra Prime/Demons a reasonable attempt at such. __________________ --DonIago It was the best of Trek, it was the worst of Trek... "If I lean over, I leave myself open to wedgies, wet willies, or even the dreaded Rear Admiral!"

February 18 2013, 11:47 PM	#18
Mach5 Rear Admiral Location: 里耶卡	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? Demons/TP was a solid season finale, but it doesn't offer any kind of closure for the characters, really. And TATV... TATV completely disregards everything that happened in Season 4, ignores every single bit of character development and feels so much out of place, it's jarring. VOY's "Endgame" falls short too. After seven years of rooting for the heroes to return home, you don't actually get to see them do it. __________________ No religious or family tradition can stand in the way of change.

February 19 2013, 12:59 AM	#20
teacake Admiral Location: Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound. With Sehlats.	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? I'm betting it will get a mention, subtle or otherwise. Maybe we'll just see an NX-01 model in the background on someones bookcase, but it will be there. I think the last movie showed a lot of attention to details. __________________ Rider: I can't believe you'd kill me for a field of empty holes. J'onn: It's all I have. ■ ■ ■ Janeway does Melbourne

February 19 2013, 01:43 AM	#22
teacake Admiral Location: Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound. With Sehlats.	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? Oh I don't know, I think Kirk turning into a woman was its own kind of closure. __________________ Rider: I can't believe you'd kill me for a field of empty holes. J'onn: It's all I have. ■ ■ ■ Janeway does Melbourne

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February 19 2013, 04:48 AM	#23
DonIago Rear Admiral Location: Burlington, VT, USA	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? Ouch. __________________ --DonIago It was the best of Trek, it was the worst of Trek... "If I lean over, I leave myself open to wedgies, wet willies, or even the dreaded Rear Admiral!"

February 21 2013, 03:34 PM	#25
Bry_Sinclair Commodore Location: Along the border of Talarian space	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? Ending on "Terra Prime" is the best piece of advice I could give anyone. ENT was just starting to find its feet and when it was cancelled, they go and give us "These Are The Voyages" to end with? Major step back. If it had been a future episode (set in 2161) and just ignored the Riker and Troi stuff it could have been halfway decent. __________________ Avatar: Captain Hilgrat Ja-Inrosh (deceased), Commanding Officer, U.S.S. Silverfin NCC-4470, Border Service Third Cutter Squadron Manip by: FltCpt. Bossco (STPMA)

February 26 2013, 12:25 AM	#26
Dale Sams Captain	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? Bry, am I to take it that the Battlefield Earth aliens are a part of Star Trek Online canon?

February 27 2013, 05:46 AM	#28
Dream Admiral	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? Even TNG fans hated TATV. That's how bad it was! __________________ TWoP Forums .

February 27 2013, 11:19 AM	#30
King Daniel Admiral Location: KingDaniel has fallen Into Darkness (in England)	Re: Does season 4 of enterprise have closure like DS9's finale had? ^Whatever happened to Kirk's hands in the last movie was happening to Riker and Troi for the entire episode?? __________________ Star Trek Imponderables, fun video mashups of Trek's biggest continuity errors. Episode One Episode Two