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The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old February 16 2013, 08:55 AM   #196
Maurice
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

GameOn wrote: View Post
Yeah I noticed it was CGI in EaF but it does look a lot better in BOBW. It was far too dark in EaF and too clean looking like a lot of CGI in general, the gain really helps to match it to the model shots. It's a shame the incompetent HTV couldn't do something similar with the CGI shot from "Where Silence Has Lease"
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x...ase_hd_096.jpg
That shot is really terrible.
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Old February 16 2013, 11:06 AM   #197
Timo47
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

Maxwell Everett wrote: View Post
jimbotron wrote: View Post
GameOn wrote: View Post
It's a shame the incompetent HTV couldn't do something similar with the CGI shot from "Where Silence Has Lease"
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x...ase_hd_096.jpg
That shot will pop up again in season 4's Clues. Hopefully the effects team responsible for that season will do a better job.
CBS Digital already had to redo it for S3's "The Enemy," so they'll probably just give it to [company name redacted ] for "Clues."
I don't know why, but there were a number of season 1 shots that were perfectly reusable for season 2 and yet HTV redid them (and not for the better) instead of taking advantage for the work of CBS-D.
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Old February 16 2013, 02:00 PM   #198
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

Timo47 wrote: View Post
I don't know why, but there were a number of season 1 shots that were perfectly reusable for season 2 and yet HTV redid them (and not for the better) instead of taking advantage for the work of CBS-D.
This!

Something that concerns me is there are numerous FX shots and planets in Season 3 that we're reused from Season 2 in the original run of Next Gen. I really hope to god there is not one single shot HTV remastered that is used anywhere in this season.
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Old February 16 2013, 02:43 PM   #199
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

MickJo1701 wrote: View Post
I really hope to god there is not one single shot HTV remastered that is used anywhere in this season.
Agreed x1000!
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Old February 16 2013, 07:32 PM   #200
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

There's no way in heck anything from S2 gets used later on. CBS-D cares too much about their product to do that.

I would also love to know why HTV took it upon themselves to redo so much work that was already in the can from CBS-D. Was it pride? Did they ever realize their efforts were inferior, and yet kept going, wasting precious time?

They did, however, use SOME of CBS-D's work. Notably at the end of episodes when the Enterprise warps away (the shot normally in the credits just before the main title). The shot in A Matter of Honor with the Enterprise + Bird of Prey looks suspiciously like CBS-D. You can see the different colors of the Enterprise, a signature of CBS-D, while most of HTV's work made the Enterprise look flat gray. However, the impulse engine was red, which is how it looked by HTV, and not orange, like CBS-D. Some of the planets in S2 were taken from S1, though smudged.

I guess we'll know for sure if the shot is replaced with the original elements in Sins of the Father. Perhaps CBS-D completed the shot, and loaned it to HTV.

Last edited by jimbotron; February 16 2013 at 07:49 PM.
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Old February 16 2013, 07:45 PM   #201
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

CBS-D is a little too good, because we're seeing all the flaws of the 4-footer:

http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/bo...ilerhd_043.jpg

The 6-footer was built to stand up in a feature film (which it later did) The 4-footer, not built by ILM, looks like it was meant for TV, and we're seeing more than we were ever intended to.

Notice the warp pylon - the edges look as if they were spackled. There's also a gnarly crack that extends from the neck. A bit of sanding prior to painting would have fixed that. The model wasn't even a year old at this point.
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Old February 16 2013, 07:49 PM   #202
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

Timo47 wrote: View Post
I don't know why, but there were a number of season 1 shots that were perfectly reusable for season 2 and yet HTV redid them (and not for the better) instead of taking advantage for the work of CBS-D.
In a way I'm kinda glad HTV redid everything for season 2, their work is one step above paper cut outs on a cardboard background but at least it's somewhat consistent. I think having to see the glaring difference between HTV's and CBS-D's footage in the same episode would make things look even worse.
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Old February 16 2013, 08:59 PM   #203
MickJo1701
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

jimbotron wrote: View Post
CBS-D is a little too good, because we're seeing all the flaws of the 4-footer:

http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/bo...ilerhd_043.jpg

The 6-footer was built to stand up in a feature film (which it later did) The 4-footer, not built by ILM, looks like it was meant for TV, and we're seeing more than we were ever intended to.

Notice the warp pylon - the edges look as if they were spackled. There's also a gnarly crack that extends from the neck. A bit of sanding prior to painting would have fixed that. The model wasn't even a year old at this point.
I agree the close up shots of the 4 foot model in HD do bring the flaws in its construction to the forefront, but from further away it doesn't look bad at all.

http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/5x...ght_hd_103.jpg
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/bo...ilerhd_006.jpg

I cant complain though, I'd much prefer an meticulously crafted composite of the 4 foot miniature warts and all than a sloppy, half assed composite of the 6 foot model.
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Old February 17 2013, 09:48 AM   #204
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

I'm really not trying to defend HTV's efforts, but I must say, it's funny how people complained about their decision to make the glow of the impulse section red when CBS Digital had made it orange. Now from what we've seen of the third season, CBS Digital has made it red now, too. And I don't see anyone making a fuss about it. Double standard?
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Old February 17 2013, 12:22 PM   #205
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

Kind of. It fluctuated between orange and red in TNG all the time, so I don't see the big deal.
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Old February 17 2013, 02:03 PM   #206
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

In HTV's case, the rest of the work was far less redeeming in quality. I'm not going to complain about the colour of the impulse engine when 98% of the work is fantastic. With the complaints against HTV's work, the impulse colour was just part of the whole. That being said, I still preferred the orange hue.
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Old February 17 2013, 04:24 PM   #207
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

M wrote: View Post
I'm really not trying to defend HTV's efforts, but I must say, it's funny how people complained about their decision to make the glow of the impulse section red when CBS Digital had made it orange. Now from what we've seen of the third season, CBS Digital has made it red now, too. And I don't see anyone making a fuss about it. Double standard?
Double standard among Trek fans? Perish the thought!
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Old February 17 2013, 07:23 PM   #208
jimbotron
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

I'll take red and orange impulse mismatching episode to episode over blurry, washed out, poorly composited, poorly aligned, stretched, and cropped visual effects anyday.
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Old February 17 2013, 08:28 PM   #209
MickJo1701
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

M wrote: View Post
I'm really not trying to defend HTV's efforts, but I must say, it's funny how people complained about their decision to make the glow of the impulse section red when CBS Digital had made it orange. Now from what we've seen of the third season, CBS Digital has made it red now, too. And I don't see anyone making a fuss about it. Double standard?
The impulse engine on the 6 foot model should be orange and it still is in Season 3.

http://tng.trekcore.com/bluray/image...ler_hd_029.jpg

Tosk is correct that it ranged from red, pink and orange in the Season 1 and 2. CBS D chose orange as the standard colour but it again fluctuated throughout Season 2. The engine glow is red on the 4 foot and 2 foot models and always has done.

http://tng.trekcore.com/bluray/image...ler_hd_025.jpg
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/1x...001_hd_001.jpg
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Old February 17 2013, 08:46 PM   #210
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Re: "Best of both Worlds" - Special Bluray Release

Two questions:
1. Can someone inform me what the specific problem is with the remastered shot form Where Silence Has Lease?
2. Do you think that, for BOBW, they will fix the whole "center of town" reference, and place the away team in the center of the crater rather than near it to reflect O-Brien's dialogue?
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