RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 139,589
Posts: 5,424,167
Members: 24,809
Currently online: 562
Newest member: Super Scout

TrekToday headlines

Star Trek: Alien Domain Game Announced
By: T'Bonz on Sep 15

Red Shirt Diaries Episode Three
By: T'Bonz on Sep 15

Made Out Of Mudd Photonovel
By: T'Bonz on Sep 15

Takei Has Growth Removed
By: T'Bonz on Sep 15

Retro Review: Tears of the Prophets
By: Michelle on Sep 12

New Wizkids Attack Wing Ships
By: T'Bonz on Sep 12

Coto Drama Sold To Fox
By: T'Bonz on Sep 12

Braga Inks Deal
By: T'Bonz on Sep 12

Remastered Original Series Re-release
By: T'Bonz on Sep 11

UK Trek Ships Calendar Debuts
By: T'Bonz on Sep 10


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old February 5 2013, 07:15 PM   #31
137th Gebirg
Rear Admiral
 
137th Gebirg's Avatar
 
Location: Who is John Galt?
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Jackson_Roykirk wrote: View Post
Anji wrote: View Post
TWOK is done. I'm not paying to see it remade.

So is JJ going to treat these franchises like leftovers: just kinda put it all in a cassarole dish, pop it in the oven and then tell us in the family it's something new and exciting he just whipped up? (I'm a mom, I know how this goes.)

And if he does this kinda stuff to Star Trek, I can just imagine what he's going to do to Star Wars.
I would argue that TWoK is barely about the Genetically Engineered Superman we saw in Space Seed. If it wasn't for the fact that Montalban reprised his original Space Seed role (at least in character name) and a couple of references back to some details of Space Seed, it would have been very difficult to determine that the plot of TWoK was any kind of Space Seed sequel at all.

TWoK had almost nothing at all do do with the "Genetically Engineered Supermen who would rule the world" plot. It was simply about what happens after one of those Supermen goes mad with revenge.

I loved TWoK for what it was -- it was a great film. However, I would love to see a REAL Space Seed sequel featuring one or more of the Botany Bay's genetically engineered super-humans in the 23rd century Federation (I mean a cool and calculating one with all his wits about them -- not one who's gone mad). I'm not saying this film will be that -- although it might. And if it were, it would NOT be a TWoK rehash; it would be a true sequel to Space Seed.
They made such an attempt in Enterprise with the "Augments". It was kind of "eh", IMO...
__________________
Gebirgswick - Ind, Tra, Sec & Env.
137th Gebirg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 10 2013, 05:17 PM   #32
Joby
Fleet Captain
 
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Jackson_Roykirk wrote: View Post
[I would argue that TWoK is barely about the Genetically Engineered Superman we saw in Space Seed. If it wasn't for the fact that Montalban reprised his original Space Seed role (at least in character name) and a couple of references back to some details of Space Seed, it would have been very difficult to determine that the plot of TWoK was any kind of Space Seed sequel at all.

TWoK had almost nothing at all do do with the "Genetically Engineered Supermen who would rule the world" plot. It was simply about what happens after one of those Supermen goes mad with revenge.

I loved TWoK for what it was -- it was a great film. However, I would love to see a REAL Space Seed sequel featuring one or more of the Botany Bay's genetically engineered super-humans in the 23rd century Federation (I mean a cool and calculating one with all his wits about them -- not one who's gone mad). I'm not saying this film will be that -- although it might. And if it were, it would NOT be a TWoK rehash; it would be a true sequel to Space Seed.
I agree with this. There was really nothing about the genetically engineered superman angle other then Khan mentioning he had a superior intellect. Khan only showed his super strength once IMO. It was when he lifted Chekov with one arm on Ceti Alpha V. I don't consider Khan throwing a few debris around the Reliant at the end of the movie as a show of super strength b/c we have no way of assessing how much that weighs, but we do know how much a human around Chekov's size would weigh.

If it wasn't for Khan lifting Chekov (and then mysteriously pulling him down) while he interrogates him and Captain Terrell on Ceti Alpha V, I would never guess they were people that had any type of superior strength and intellect. Hell Khan's followers in TWOK all seemed like doped up hippies anyway, hardly a MENSA crowd. When I was a kid this plot point was completely missed by me.

By the way, this is my first post back to the TREKBBS in over 3 years!! It's good to be back, the new movie brought me back!! This place sure has changed since back in 2000.
Joby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 10 2013, 06:23 PM   #33
Jackson_Roykirk
Commodore
 
Jackson_Roykirk's Avatar
 
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Joby wrote: View Post
...If it wasn't for Khan lifting Chekov (and then mysteriously pulling him down) while he interrogates him and Captain Terrell on Ceti Alpha V, I would never guess they were people that had any type of superior strength and intellect. Hell Khan's followers in TWOK all seemed like doped up hippies anyway, hardly a MENSA crowd. When I was a kid this plot point was completely missed by me...
It's more than that. They could have even overtly told us they had superior intellect a strength in TWoK, but it still did not utilize/exploit the potential storylines that were alluded to in Space Seed.

Joby wrote: View Post
By the way, this is my first post back to the TREKBBS in over 3 years!! It's good to be back, the new movie brought me back!! This place sure has changed since back in 2000.
Welcome back!
You can check your sombrero at the door, a watch the blue nacelles light up the darkness.
__________________

...With shoes that cut, and eyes that burn like cigarettes
With fingernails that shine like justice and a voice that is dark like tinted glass...
Jackson_Roykirk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 10 2013, 06:36 PM   #34
Franklin
Rear Admiral
 
Location: In the bleachers
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Joby wrote: View Post
Jackson_Roykirk wrote: View Post
[I would argue that TWoK is barely about the Genetically Engineered Superman we saw in Space Seed. If it wasn't for the fact that Montalban reprised his original Space Seed role (at least in character name) and a couple of references back to some details of Space Seed, it would have been very difficult to determine that the plot of TWoK was any kind of Space Seed sequel at all.

TWoK had almost nothing at all do do with the "Genetically Engineered Supermen who would rule the world" plot. It was simply about what happens after one of those Supermen goes mad with revenge.

I loved TWoK for what it was -- it was a great film. However, I would love to see a REAL Space Seed sequel featuring one or more of the Botany Bay's genetically engineered super-humans in the 23rd century Federation (I mean a cool and calculating one with all his wits about them -- not one who's gone mad). I'm not saying this film will be that -- although it might. And if it were, it would NOT be a TWoK rehash; it would be a true sequel to Space Seed.
I agree with this. There was really nothing about the genetically engineered superman angle other then Khan mentioning he had a superior intellect. Khan only showed his super strength once IMO. It was when he lifted Chekov with one arm on Ceti Alpha V. I don't consider Khan throwing a few debris around the Reliant at the end of the movie as a show of super strength b/c we have no way of assessing how much that weighs, but we do know how much a human around Chekov's size would weigh.

If it wasn't for Khan lifting Chekov (and then mysteriously pulling him down) while he interrogates him and Captain Terrell on Ceti Alpha V, I would never guess they were people that had any type of superior strength and intellect. Hell Khan's followers in TWOK all seemed like doped up hippies anyway, hardly a MENSA crowd. When I was a kid this plot point was completely missed by me.

By the way, this is my first post back to the TREKBBS in over 3 years!! It's good to be back, the new movie brought me back!! This place sure has changed since back in 2000.
Well, their superior intellect would be implied by the ease with which they were able to figure out how to use the systems on the Reliant and "fly" it.
Of coures, contrast that with the "book learning" version of really manning a starship, where they had no idea about prefix codes, and later in the movie, Khan's battle tactics were two-dimensional.
__________________
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Franklin is online now   Reply With Quote
Old February 16 2013, 10:30 PM   #35
publiusr
Commodore
 
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Harrison could always awaken Khan...
publiusr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 19 2013, 12:16 PM   #36
Sigokat
Commander
 
Sigokat's Avatar
 
Location: Fort Bragg, NC but from Chicago (currently deployed)
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Didn't Khan do some sort of meditation chant prior to prying open the doors to his quarters in Space Seed?

To me, if I'm remembering correctly, always kind of showed the superior strength of the "supermen"
Sigokat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 19 2013, 03:11 PM   #37
137th Gebirg
Rear Admiral
 
137th Gebirg's Avatar
 
Location: Who is John Galt?
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Meditation techniques, yes, but I don't think there was a chant attached to it. They did have that weird electric sitar music going in the background, though. I thought his crushing the phaser like it was play-dough was pretty indicative of his strength as well. As much as I love Wrath of Khan, that was the one major thing that I always thought they messed up on - a fight between Kirk and Khan. Or, at the very least, some kind of better interaction than trading jibes across the comm-link.
__________________
Gebirgswick - Ind, Tra, Sec & Env.
137th Gebirg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 19 2013, 04:11 PM   #38
Sigokat
Commander
 
Sigokat's Avatar
 
Location: Fort Bragg, NC but from Chicago (currently deployed)
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Oh yeah, the phaser, I had forgotten about that as well! And yeah, its almost as if the writers of TWOK forgot that Khan was supposed to be both physically and mentally superior to regular humans.

Oh and on a side note, I was in the mess hall here in Afghanistan today for lunch and a terp walked by and his name tape said Khan. it took all I had not to jump up in front of him and yell "KHAAAAAAAAAAAN!" Of course he would of had no idea what I was talking about and I probably would have gotten a referral to mental health as well...so i didn't do it. I don't know, i thought it was funny when I thought of it. LOL
Sigokat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 19 2013, 07:54 PM   #39
M'Sharak
Definitely Herbert. Maybe.
 
M'Sharak's Avatar
 
Location: Terra Inlandia
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

Sigokat wrote: View Post

Oh and on a side note, I was in the mess hall here in Afghanistan today for lunch and a terp walked by and his name tape said Khan. it took all I had not to jump up in front of him and yell "KHAAAAAAAAAAAN!" Of course he would of had no idea what I was talking about and I probably would have gotten a referral to mental health as well...so i didn't do it. I don't know, i thought it was funny when I thought of it. LOL
Heh heh - context matters.
__________________
"Recently my 8 year-old cousin asked me, with a wicked twinkle in his eye, if I'd ever microwaved a banana. I'm terrified to try, but I'm sure whatever happens—splattering, abrupt, radioactive—sounds exactly like an Annie Clark guitar solo."
M'Sharak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 20 2013, 01:05 PM   #40
CommanderRaytas
Rear Admiral
 
CommanderRaytas's Avatar
 
Location: Dr Insano's goggles
Re: Maybe the Villian Was Originally Khan?

publiusr wrote: View Post
Harrison could always awaken Khan...
Please don't curse it into existence, thanks.
__________________
Joseph Smith...MAGICAL AIDS FROG!The Book of Mormon (Trey Parker & Matt Stone)
It was a nice day ... AND THEN EVIL CAME!
The Collected Works of Stephen King, condensed version
CommanderRaytas is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 08:56 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.