Phaser banks on the Constitution class

[Robert Comsol]

King Daniel wrote:

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TAS has been referenced in Deep Space Nine, Enterprise, the remastered TOS and a great deal in JJ Abrams' Star Trek. I'd say that makes it as much part of the universe as any of the other series'.

I think these life support belt EVA suit replacements have been somewhat counter-productive implementing TAS into the bigger picture. On the other hand TAS seems to have inspired the intermix chamber coil of TMP.

Bob

[blssdwlf]

King Daniel wrote:

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TAS has been referenced in Deep Space Nine, Enterprise, the remastered TOS and a great deal in JJ Abrams' Star Trek. I'd say that makes it as much part of the universe as any of the other series'.

Okay, where has DS9, Enterprise, and the remastered TOS reference TAS?

[GSchnitzer]

If anyone is interested, I grabbed screen shots of every phaser and torpedo fire. Find them here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/1090112...th/4842414868/

[blssdwlf]

Vanyel wrote:

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So the Constitution class had never shown dorsal phasers. Assuming TAS is canon, they do. I'm not trying to open up Pandora's Box, but isn't TAS not considered canon?

TOS never showed the port, starboard, midships and aft phasers, either. Are you asking if the ship has a giant blind spot shooting upwards or are you just trying to pin down where the phaser emplacements are?

[CorporalCaptain]

blssdwlf wrote:

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Okay, where has DS9, Enterprise, and the remastered TOS reference TAS?

See http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Star...tionable_canon for an enumeration.

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GSchnitzer wrote:

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If anyone is interested, I grabbed screen shots of every phaser and torpedo fire. Find them here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/1090112...th/4842414868/

Nice.

[blssdwlf]

@CorporalCaptain - Thanks for the link. I was wondering how they snuck in TAS references into the re-mastered TOS. They replaced the Woden and added a visual for Ramart's ship. It doesn't seem like Commodore April was referenced too much outside of TAS though. Oh well.

[CorporalCaptain]

^ The probable appearance of ShiKahr in TOS-R: Amok Time is one of the most dramatic references.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Shi'Kahr

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/File...remastered.jpg

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Amok...ed_information

[blssdwlf]

@CorporalCaptain - So mostly subtle cosmetic changes. I guess that's the only way they could've sneaked it in without altering dialogue.

[Vanyel]

blssdwlf wrote:

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TOS never showed the port, starboard, midships and aft phasers, either. Are you asking if the ship has a giant blind spot shooting upwards or are you just trying to pin down where the phaser emplacements are?

Port, starboard, midships and aft are mentioned, being mentioned means they are there. Where exactly is the question for those phasers. You, I believe, brought up they were mentioned in dialogue.

TAS would seem to be canon, or at least reference material; or "Questionable Canon" as Memory Alpha puts it in the links previously provided.

However, In A Mirror, Darkly only showed the ventral phasers and the aft phasers providing dorsal shots. The Defiant in that episode even tilts to one side to fire torpedoes at the ship attacking her dorsal side. If there was ever a time for dorsal phasers on the saucer to fire, that would have been the time.

So yes, where are the emitters?

[King Daniel]

blssdwlf wrote:

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It doesn't seem like Commodore April was referenced too much outside of TAS though. Oh well.

April was mentioned in on-screen text in the Defiant's computer in "In a Mirror, Darkly"

And also...

John Harrison is seen waving around something referred to (in concept art and audio mixing files) as "April's big gun" on Qo'nos in the Star Trek Into Darkness trailers. And since Robert April just showed up in the first issue of the prequel comic Countdown to Darkness, it seems likely he'll figure into the movie somehow.

[blssdwlf]

Vanyel wrote:

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Port, starboard, midships and aft are mentioned, being mentioned means they are there. Where exactly is the question for those phasers. You, I believe, brought up they were mentioned in dialogue.

TAS would seem to be canon, or at least reference material; or "Questionable Canon" as Memory Alpha puts it in the links previously provided.

However, In A Mirror, Darkly only showed the ventral phasers and the aft phasers providing dorsal shots. The Defiant in that episode even tilts to one side to fire torpedoes at the ship attacking her dorsal side. If there was ever a time for dorsal phasers on the saucer to fire, that would have been the time.

So yes, where are the emitters?

After taking a look at "In A Mirror, Darkly" I think you're going to have a different answer depending on which TOS continuity you're looking at.

TOS:

• Phasers in dialogue:

1. "Balance of Terror": Forward, Port, Starboard and Midship (actual locations unknown)
2. "Arena": Aft (actual locations unknown)

• Phasers seen:

1. Most episodes: Majority beams firing from the forward ventral saucer area.
2. "Balance of Terror", "Errand of Mercy": Pulses firing from forward and starboard ventral saucer area
3. "The Doomsday Machine": phaser firing from "port side" of the ventral saucer dome.

TOS-Remastered

• Phasers in dialogue (same as TOS)
• Phasers seen (standardized to the same forward ventral saucer section on the lower dome except for...)
  1. "The Doomsday Machine": two saucer forward dorsal phasers fire at DDM from Enterprise

Enterprise series

• Phasers in dialogue
  • "In A Mirror Darkly" - forward emitters
• Phasers seen
  • "In A Mirror Darkly"
    • aft phaser emitters visible and fired
    • two forward ventral saucer phaser emitters visible and fired. they later are no longer visible in later battle. they are positioned higher than on the TOS-Remastered version.
    • no visible dorsal emitters on saucer

TAS - the dorsal firing as mentioned by Timo.

Regarding "In A Mirror Darkly" - the aft phasers firing direction pretty much tells us where the enemy ship is so when it is pitching up to fire torpedoes the torpedoes are still having to hook a turn towards the target from what I can tell. The lack of dorsal saucer emitters suggest no phasers there, but curiously the forward ventral emitters that were present in the dock are no longer visible in that same battle. Did the emitters hide themselves once the ship was operational again? If yes, then that could suggest dorsal saucer emitters that were hidden and the aft phasers might have been used because they had a better LOS, IMHO. If no, then there are no dorsal saucer emitters in the Enterprise-series USS Defiant.

But, there are dorsal saucer emitters in TOS-Remastered.

[Albertese]

Interesting. I did a quick analysis of the image from the remastered version of "Doomsday Machine" trying to figure out where those phaser beams are coming from. They're clearly not coming from the dorsal surface.




--Alex

[Timo]

Or the left beam is coming from a forward (close, TMP style) pair of ventral emitters, and the right one is coming from a portside close pair.

A bit of tracking across several consecutive screencaps would be useful here...

Timo Saloniemi

[blssdwlf]

@Albertese - good catch! But wasn't the whole thing about TOS-Remastered was the standardization of where the phasers come from? Since it could not have been from the bottom ventral spot just forward of the lower dome then wouldn't this be a deviation?

I'll have to watch it again tonight to take a look.

[Albertese]

Well, their definitely not coming from the lower dome. But the ringed area seems like a good option to me, especially seeing as how that are would sort of correspond to the refit, as Timo may be suggesting above?

Even though the original footage from "Arena" seems to be suggesting the beams originate higher, up, if I were to play the "producer's intent" card, I would have to assume that that is a simple error in the printing of the optical effect and they had every intention of having those beams come from the area of the dome, as per usual, but they just "missed," probably by either goofing up the cel animation or else not having the equipment lined up right when they did the superimpose.

But, in a WWTTD world, that is where those beams are coming from. I have no problem with assuming there are in fact a ring of phaser emitters at the level of the emitters on the TMP refit ship. Possibly these are the mid-ship phasers and the main phasers are located just forward of the lower sensor dome?

I only have the the 1st season of TOS-r on DVD and I'm too stubborn to subscribe to Netflix so I have no way to actually watch this scene in motion...

--Alex