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Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

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Old February 3 2013, 07:42 AM   #76
Anwar
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Re: 'Dark Frontier' Where the Borg went wrong?

The Defiant wasn't meant to fight the Borg all on its own, it was meant to be part of a new Battlefleet of Starships for fighting the Borg and it got shelved because they came up with superior vessels without any of the Defiants' flaws (the Sovereign, the Akira, the Norway, the Sabre and Steamrunner classes).

The only reason they were scared of the Borg was because at the time they didn't know much about them.
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Old February 3 2013, 03:13 PM   #77
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Re: 'Dark Frontier' Where the Borg went wrong?

Anwar wrote: View Post
The Defiant wasn't meant to fight the Borg all on its own, it was meant to be part of a new Battlefleet of Starships for fighting the Borg and it got shelved because they came up with superior vessels without any of the Defiants' flaws (the Sovereign, the Akira, the Norway, the Sabre and Steamrunner classes).

The only reason they were scared of the Borg was because at the time they didn't know much about them.
Nothing to do with one cube totalling an entire fleet then?
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Old February 3 2013, 08:39 PM   #78
Anwar
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Re: 'Dark Frontier' Where the Borg went wrong?

An entire fleet the Borg were prepared for, thanks to Locutus. And because Starfleet didn't know squat about how to fight them and this was their first major engagement with them. And most of those ships being older vessels to begin with.

I mean heck, the original script for "First Contact" had there being a fleet of Borg ships engaging a Starfleet armada, not one Cube. With most of the Borg fleet being destroyed in normal combat.
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Old February 3 2013, 09:45 PM   #79
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Re: 'Dark Frontier' Where the Borg went wrong?

A modern day US aircraft carrier vs. the Spanish Armada.

Hell martin Sheen wimped out with The Final Countdown.

Time Tunnel or stop Pearl Harbour from being decimated by the Japanese?

That would have been a fantastic fight to watch.
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Old February 4 2013, 03:45 AM   #80
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Re: 'Dark Frontier' Where the Borg went wrong?

Anwar wrote: View Post
An entire fleet the Borg were prepared for, thanks to Locutus. And because Starfleet didn't know squat about how to fight them and this was their first major engagement with them. And most of those ships being older vessels to begin with.

I mean heck, the original script for "First Contact" had there being a fleet of Borg ships engaging a Starfleet armada, not one Cube. With most of the Borg fleet being destroyed in normal combat.
well that would have been a joke.

You have to remember the context with which the Borg were introduced.

to quote Q:
You judge yourselves against the pitiful adversaries you've encountered so far - the Romulans, the Klingons. They're nothing compared to what's waiting
You can't outrun them, you can't destroy them. If you damage them, the essence of what they are remains. They regenerate and keep coming. Eventually you will weaken. Your reserves will be gone. They are relentless!
The Borg were NOT introduced as some villain of the week, the whole purpose of them was to be something beyond what starfleet could realistically handle. Sure they could scrape an even numbers encounter with the romulans, barely, but the borg were supposed to be LEVELS above that. They have massive, technologically advanced ships, the collective consciousness and experience of millions. They can adapt to you a hundred times as fast as you can think up new ways to combat them, The Borg were in essence an unstoppable force.

For Voyager hardcore fans, they don't want to admit the show got some things wrong, so they instead point the finger at TNG saying that the borg in TNG were "silly" and "overpowered" and "unrealistic" I myself am a fan of the show but I am resoloute, voyager watered down the borg, badly.

In the end, they were no more of a threat than " the pitiful adversaries you've encountered so far - the Romulans, the Klingons" They lost their edge, and it was illogical writing that did it.
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Old February 4 2013, 04:52 AM   #81
Anwar
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Re: 'Dark Frontier' Where the Borg went wrong?

Infern0 wrote: View Post
The Borg were NOT introduced as some villain of the week, the whole purpose of them was to be something beyond what starfleet could realistically handle. Sure they could scrape an even numbers encounter with the romulans, barely, but the borg were supposed to be LEVELS above that. They have massive, technologically advanced ships, the collective consciousness and experience of millions. They can adapt to you a hundred times as fast as you can think up new ways to combat them, The Borg were in essence an unstoppable force.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with making it clear that there were other beings more powerful than the Borg out there. Q even said so, he said the Borg were just one race out of many that were out there that the Feds would encounter.

What was silly, was them being so scared in the first place because they'd already faced more powerful beings than the Borg in TOS and TNG.

For Voyager hardcore fans, they don't want to admit the show got some things wrong, so they instead point the finger at TNG saying that the borg in TNG were "silly" and "overpowered" and "unrealistic" I myself am a fan of the show but I am resoloute, voyager watered down the borg, badly.
Nope, the Borg were never meant to be Galactic Enemy No.1. They were just supposed to be a reminder to the Feds that they shouldn't rest on their laurels.

Q wouldn't have introduced them to something they couldn't defeat based on everything else we know about him.

In the end, they were no more of a threat than " the pitiful adversaries you've encountered so far - the Romulans, the Klingons" They lost their edge, and it was illogical writing that did it.
No, Guinan (who had experience in these matters) argued against Q that the Feds would prevail, and she was ultimately shown to be the correct one.

VOY didn't go far enough, it should've made it clear that the DQ is loaded with races and Empires that have been (successfully) fighting off the Borg right from the Borg's beginnings and that they are not some kind of Supreme enemy. Just the introduction to the next tier of Civilizations the Galaxy offers.
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Old February 4 2013, 04:38 PM   #82
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Re: 'Dark Frontier' Where the Borg went wrong?

I couldn't agree more! This is just the point I had to prove to my stepdad the other day. What can you do with a society that doesm't even bother recreating--or even trying to recreate--the technology that could make them even more epic? Not to mention the Borg hate hair (I hate anyone who hates hair lol).
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