Crew age and nu-Trek

[Christopher]

^Yes, as capable, but not a supergenius.

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Kirk in TOS was so ridiculously young for his job that they made a point of it in the writers guide.

What, you didn't notice that every other starship commander we saw in the series - other than Pike, the proto-Kirk - was greying? Tracey, Wesley, Decker...

As for Chekov - it's just a movie. Chekov is Chekov, that's why he's there. This kind of hair-splitting is like the old joke about the historian who tried to prove that Hamlet wasn't written by William Shakespeare, but by another guy named William Shakespeare.

[daveyNY]

Timo wrote:

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...In essence, Pavel and Pyotr just switched places (that is, names) between the universes.

And yes, any character younger than Kirk could be a completely different individual with a familiar name, "altered" because of Nero's meddling. Uhura, too, appears different: she now is a cunning linguist rather than a switchboard operator, and is romantically interested in Spock - although whether thanks to different body chemistries or just slightly different career histories, we don't know.

Spock's age is somewhat more strongly established than those of the other characters quoted as speculative, because of TAS "Yesteryear" where the only variable is the year in which the episode (stardate 5373, FWIW) took place - a variable in all TOS episodes as well, basically, and not that much of an issue. We learn that Spock was seven years old in a time period that was 30 years in the past of the episode's framing story, sharp. Just a tad older than Kirk, then, and quite in keeping with the various live-action portrayals.

Timo Saloniemi

I see what you did there...

And frankly...





"I Like It!"

[Christopher]

Timo wrote:

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And yes, any character younger than Kirk could be a completely different individual with a familiar name, "altered" because of Nero's meddling. Uhura, too, appears different: she now is a cunning linguist rather than a switchboard operator, and is romantically interested in Spock - although whether thanks to different body chemistries or just slightly different career histories, we don't know.

Actually Uhura has routinely been portrayed as an expert linguist in Trek tie-in literature. As with her first name Nyota, it's something that's been accepted conventional wisdom about the character for generations and was finally made canonical in the film. We do know from "The Changeling" that she's fluent in both Swahili and English, at least.

As for her romantic interest in Spock, see their scenes together in "The Man Trap" and "Charlie X." There is definitely a canonical basis for that relationship. The movie didn't add anything to Uhura's character that wasn't potentially there. It just gave her development she was never given in the original show.

[ROBE]

I remember a character in a comedy show wishing his parents had never met so he could be two different people.

[daveyNY]

Wouldn't a Third Party have to be involved in the bedroom, for one to be two different people, genetically speaking of course... ?

[YARN]

My Name Is Legion wrote:

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Kirk in TOS was so ridiculously young for his job that they made a point of it in the writers guide.

What they wrote in the writer's guide doesn't matter. They could've had a good chip dip recipe in there too.

What we saw on screen was a 35 year-old actor depicting a character who was never noted for being a particularly young captain. What we are shown on screen implied a man who was a decade older than his Junior Officers. Consider the conversation McCoy and Kirk have about Lt. Bailey and how Kirk is pushing him because he reminds him of the young man who was so many years ago.

He certainly does not seem like an old-man, but he doesn't seem wet behind the ears either. He seems like a Hornblower-type, an ambitious and capable officer, not too young for the job, but not delayed in the career ruts of less glorified officers. Consider, for example, that one can get a four-year-degree in four years, and compare that to the reality where most people do it in 5 1/2 or more. Kirk is one of those guys who gets it done in four.

My Name Is Legion wrote:

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What, you didn't notice that every other starship commander we saw in the series - other than Pike, the proto-Kirk - was greying? Tracey, Wesley, Decker...

Proto-Kirk or not Pike is another example of a Starfleet Captain of the sort who would command a ship like the Enterprise.

And Kirk was much more often running into Commodores and other guys who could pull rank to enhance dramatic tension. Decker was a Commodore, so he should be a few years older.

My Name Is Legion wrote:

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As for Chekov - it's just a movie.

Of course it is just a movie. What does this have to do with anything?

My Name Is Legion wrote:

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Chekov is Chekov, that's why he's there. This kind of hair-splitting is like the old joke about the historian who tried to prove that Hamlet wasn't written by William Shakespeare, but by another guy named William Shakespeare.

I know, it's like fans of franchises enjoy talking about these stories in detail or something. It's like they could fill entire forums with threads dedicated to facts that non-fans don't care about. If you ever run into a board like that, I suggest that you flee!

[Cinema Geekly]

Chekov never really gets any back story in ST09 and all we know is that Nero's appearance and actions taken altered the natural course of that universe.

As a result Chekov may have entered into the academy at a different time, his interests may have changed in relation to his studies ultimately making a slightly different person from the PRIME Chekov.

I mean we saw that effect BIG TIME in Kirk where the premature death of his father radically changed his character.

[Christopher]

Cinema Geekly wrote:

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As a result Chekov may have entered into the academy at a different time, his interests may have changed in relation to his studies ultimately making a slightly different person from the PRIME Chekov.

But that doesn't explain the overt difference in the two Chekovs' ages. Chekov Prime explicitly gave his age as 22 in "Who Mourns for Adonais" (2267), and Abramsverse Chekov explicitly gave his age as 17 in the movie (2258), so there's a 4-year discrepancy.

Of course, there is one simpler explanation: Chekov Prime could've actually been 26 in "Adonais" but was claiming to be younger for some reason. But why would he pretend to be more inexperienced than he actually was? Normally you'd expect someone of that age and status to pretend to be older, not younger.

There's always the fallback idea that maybe he didn't mean 22 Earth years, but given that he's pretty clearly from Russia, why would he use a different planet's calendar?

[Set Harth]

YARN wrote:

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Consider, for example, that one can get a four-year-degree in four years, and compare that to the reality where most people do it in 5 1/2 or more. Kirk is one of those guys who gets it done in four.

Kirk is one of those guys who gets it done in three.

[YARN]

Set Harth wrote:

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Kirk is one of those guys who gets it done in three.

nu-Kirk certainly is. But then again nu-Kirk goes from suspended cadet to ship captain in a day.

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Chekov is Chekov. He's the navigator on the Enterprise, younger than the other characters.

The rest is nonsense.

[Timo]

That required one retconn, Chekov's age.

Why would that have been "required"? Chekov being younger (although born earlier) than in TOS doesn't really serve any specific purpose other than allowing McCoy to doubt his abilities until he proves his youthful genius. Chekov being the same age as in TOS would work out just fine in those terms, since the storyline perfectly well accommodates undergraduates in Kirk's posse: a thirteen-year-old genius first-year cadet would fit right in.

That is, making nu-Chekov a graduate at seventeen after it has been spelled out that most people spend four years or more at Starfleet Academy requires us to believe that he enrolled at thirteen. (Or at something like sixteen, if he was even more driven and clever than nu-Kirk, but still...) It sort of undermines the one thing that is special about the career path of the main hero.

Timo Saloniemi

[Carcazoid]

Betcha they made Chekov 17 in the movie just to piss off the Wesley haters.

[Christopher]

Carcazoid wrote:

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Betcha they made Chekov 17 in the movie just to piss off the Wesley haters.

I think they did it because making him 13 (which he would've been if they hadn't changed his age) would've been even more Wesley-like.