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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

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Old January 12 2013, 11:41 AM   #1
DalekJim
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Rank the Masters

The evil counterpoint to that other thread....

1) Peter Pratt/Geoffrey Beevers

Creepy zombie Master. The Deadly Assassin is my favourite Master appearance. A being of pure hate and cunning that uses his intellect to almost tear Gallifrey apart.

2) Anthony Ainley

I'm referring mainly to his turn in Logopolis/Castrovalva but also his masterful performance in Survival. JNT made him ham it up in other stories but he could be a real, genuine threat if given the right story.

3) Roger Delgado

Love him, easily the most iconic. I think he's a bit too cuddly and cosey at times though and prefer the more menacing above incarnations.

4) Eric Roberts

Oh, wonderfully over the top and silly. The liquid snake thing was pretty cool too.

5) Derek Jacobi

Not on-screen nearly long enough but showed real danger and menace for the 4 minutes he was around. Would have liked to have seen more.

6) John Simm

Unlike most fans, I actually like him in the Series 3 finale. Then we get End of Time and a Master plotline/performance that Simm has repeatedly expressed shame of in interviews. Still, I really liked him in Series 3, when he didn't have stupid CGI superpowers, so hopefully Moffat can rehabilitate him.
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Old January 12 2013, 11:46 AM   #2
Nagisa Furukawa
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Re: Rank the Masters

TV wise, my list would be the same as yours (maybe switch Delgado and Ainley's positions cause of those middle Ainley stories like The King's Demons or Mark of the Rani, though he was excellent in the stories you mentioned). So how about a little extended universe love? I'd rank the non-TV Masters as:

The War King (from the Faction Paradox range)
The once-again decrepit Master (from Dust Breeding and Master)
The Man with the Rosette (from The Adventuress of Henrietta Street)
The robot Master (from Scream of the Shalka)
The comics Master (from The Fallen and The Glorious Dead)
The Tzun Master (from First Frontier and Happy Endings)
The ghost Master in the TARDIS (from Sometime Never...)

I'd take any of them over Simm shooting laser bolts, getting weepy around Tennant and screaming "DINNNNNNNNNATIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIMMMMME!" though.
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Old January 12 2013, 11:55 AM   #3
DalekJim
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Re: Rank the Masters

Christ, that was shit.

Also, you missed Mark Gatiss in that Big Finish Unbound .
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Old January 12 2013, 01:34 PM   #4
Cutter John
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Re: Rank the Masters

Roger Delgado The definative Master. Full of charm, yet still deadly as a snake.

Anthony Ainley - He hammed it up at times, but he got the job done when they gave himn a break from mustache twirling. Its a damn shame he didn't live to do any audios.

Derek Jacobi - I could watch him read the phone book. A pity they couldn't keep him on for at least one full story.

John Simm - Sorry guys, I liked him (even though in my reality, I would have tapped Anthony Head for the part, but ah well).

Peter Pratt/Geoffrey Beevers - Was never a big fan of the corpse Master. Sorry.

Eric Roberts - Ugh, the less said the better.
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Old January 12 2013, 01:40 PM   #5
Konata Izumi
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Re: Rank the Masters

The End of Time Master's completely acceptable to me both as a stylistic choice, and continuity-wise. Driven into a corner with no escape, or something (I call it surrealism), together with his greatest love in the same situation, both of them falling apart mentally; of course they would cry together, and of course the already insane wacky Master would eat hamburgers in that masterful instance of black comedy. As a stylistic choice, it's great fun.

I too would like to see Simm at full strength with 11, grown into a very different person. Someone's going to play the continuation anyways so it wouldn't ruin the ending in any way.

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I can't send private messages here until 2 weeks and 50 posts, DalekJim I sent you some emails through Gallifrey Base a while ago, blame Nagisa for guiding me this far lol (wherever that quote's from). They're not too coherent mind.

Last edited by Konata Izumi; January 12 2013 at 02:40 PM.
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Old January 12 2013, 02:41 PM   #6
DalekJim
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Re: Rank the Masters

I think my GB profile probably has a really old email address I don't use any more. Hell, I don't think I've checked or sent an email in like a year. Facebook kinda killed the need for it.
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Old January 12 2013, 05:59 PM   #7
diankra
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Re: Rank the Masters

Oh god, I'd blotted Go-Go-Gadget Master leaving comedy skeletons behind from my mind. Simm goes straight to bottom of last now I've been reminded, until such time as he's given a chance to redeem his portrayal.
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Old January 12 2013, 06:09 PM   #8
DalekJim
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Re: Rank the Masters

Him and Tennant stare longingly in to eachother's eyes for the sake of YouTube fanvids set to Coldplay.
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Old January 12 2013, 08:11 PM   #9
Konata Izumi
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Re: Rank the Masters

^Is Coldplay any good?

Are you going to read the emails? Unless you can't access them at all. Facebook addition most welcome.
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Old January 12 2013, 08:20 PM   #10
All-Seeing I
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Re: Rank the Masters

I didn't really rate Geoffrey Beevers' performance in The Keeper of Traken, but he has more than redeemed himself in the Big Finish audios - his overripe, rich and yet rotten tones conjure up the decaying Master far better than the second-rate makeup he wore on the show.

Roger Delgado could be a bit too likeable at times; it was hard not to, he had such style and panache! But his relationship with the 3rd Doctor was actually the most disturbing thing - I got the distinct impression that the Master was really just playing at being the villain to keep his exiled friend amused, coming up with bonkers schemes for the 3rd Doc to foil. That scene at the end of Terror of the Autons, when the Doctor grins that he's quite looking forward to his next encounter with the Master, despite the fact that UNIT soldiers and civilians had died during their skirmish, was, I thought, chilling; they were just two gods amusing themselves.

I quite enjoyed Eric Roberts camp, hammy turn in the TV Movie; Anthony Ainley, although the most evil of the Masters I thought, was hamstrung by the limitations imposed upon him, as well as a rather silly outfit. Not nearly enough Derek Jacobi, but what we got was superb. John Simm's was a refreshingly different take - loved the phone call between him and the Doctor in The Sound of Drums, great bit of eye acting from Simm when he realizes Who's on the other end of the line! I had no real problem with his End of Time iteration of the botched regeneration Master, and would welcome a different return performance, but is there really much more mileage in the character? His storyline was pretty much resolved, and before that we had 30-odd years of him just fighting for survival. Maybe, like in the novel The Adventuress of Henrietta Street, he should realize that his time is over and the universe is ready for another type of villain.
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Old January 12 2013, 08:41 PM   #11
Konata Izumi
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Re: Rank the Masters

All-Seeing I wrote: View Post
but is there really much more mileage in
Always.
All-Seeing I wrote: View Post
Maybe, like in the novel The Adventuress of Henrietta Street, he should realize that his time is over and the universe is ready for another type of villain.
Supposedly Moffat rips off the books quite a bit.
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Old January 12 2013, 09:52 PM   #12
The Borgified Corpse
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Re: Rank the Masters

Of course, Roger Delgado is the master at being the Master and always will be. His combination of charm & menace was always perfect.

Anthony Ainley is kind of like Brandon Routh to Delgado's Christopher Reeve. He's not as good but he's the best we could ever expect considering his predecessor is dead.

Derek Jacobi is always brilliant in everything. If only we could have kept his Master around a little longer.

John Simm is far from my favorite. He'll never be an icon on par with Delgado or Ainley. Some of his scenes are way too over the top. But then, what wasn't over the top in "The End of Time"? Overall, Simm acquitted himself well considering the material he was given. And I love his final scene where he saves the Doctor by attacking Rassilon, the man who was responsible for driving him insane in the first place. It was such a fitting end for the character, IMO, that they would need a REALLY good reason to bring him back at all.

Eric Roberts was half decent doing the flamboyant Master. I just didn't care for him as the black leather clad "Terminator" Master.

Personally, I have a hard time even counting the "zombie" Masters Peter Pratt & Geoffrey Beavers.

Cutter John wrote: View Post
John Simm - Sorry guys, I liked him (even though in my reality, I would have tapped Anthony Head for the part, but ah well).
Anthony Head as the Master becomes Prime Minister? So, would that mean that Doctor Who would exist in the same continuity as Little Brittain.

Konata Izumi wrote: View Post
All-Seeing I wrote: View Post
Maybe, like in the novel The Adventuress of Henrietta Street, he should realize that his time is over and the universe is ready for another type of villain.
Supposedly Moffat rips off the books quite a bit.
Really? I'm not really aware of a lot of book rip-offs in the Moffat era (except for River Song being kind of a rip-off of Bernice Summerfield). I do recall some actual adaptations/rip-offs in the RTD years. "Human Nature" was adapted from Paul Cornell's novel of the same name. The Cybermen in a parallel universe plot of "Rise of the Cybermen" bears certain similarities to the 7th Doctor novel "Loving the Alien." That's about all I can think of so far.

I just want to know when will Moffat adapt "An All-Consuming Fire" as a crossover special with Sherlock?
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Old January 12 2013, 10:20 PM   #13
Konata Izumi
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Re: Rank the Masters

The Borgified Corpse wrote: View Post
Really? I'm not really aware of a lot of book rip-offs in the Moffat era (except for River Song being kind of a rip-off of Bernice Summerfield).
I think it was something to do with the large Series 5-6 arc. I guess that might be it though. It's tv stories he rips off the most.
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Old January 12 2013, 11:18 PM   #14
Josan
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Re: Rank the Masters

Cutter John wrote: View Post
Roger Delgado The definative Master. Full of charm, yet still deadly as a snake.

Anthony Ainley - He hammed it up at times, but he got the job done when they gave himn a break from mustache twirling. Its a damn shame he didn't live to do any audios.

Derek Jacobi - I could watch him read the phone book. A pity they couldn't keep him on for at least one full story.

John Simm - Sorry guys, I liked him (even though in my reality, I would have tapped Anthony Head for the part, but ah well).

Peter Pratt/Geoffrey Beevers - Was never a big fan of the corpse Master. Sorry.

Eric Roberts - Ugh, the less said the better.
I'm too tired to type much and since this is my exact ranking with essentially the same reasons... Thanks for reading my mind, Cutter John.
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Old January 13 2013, 05:40 AM   #15
Chris3123
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Re: Rank the Masters

1. Ainley
2. Delgado
3. Jacobi
4. Roberts
5. Simm

I can't place Prat or Beevers because I can't really remember their portrayals, and I'm too lazy to look them up.

Simm is last because his incarnation was portrayed just way too silly sometimes, especially in The End of Time with his crazy superpowers.
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