TMP on Blu-Ray - Page 2

BillJ · January 8 2013, 06:29 PM

milo bloom wrote:

SLV or go home.

Seriously, there's so many character beats that are hardwired to my memory of that movie, watching it so many times on VHS, that no current version seems right.

I would gladly pay good money for a deluxe three version Bluray set: theatrical, DE and SLV.

This.

MickJo1701 · January 8 2013, 07:24 PM

Flake wrote:

OH and please Paramount, when you re-re-re release TMP on bluray please please don't scrub the grain off. DNR SUCKS. Keep the grain intact, scan at 8k or 16k or whatever and do it right next time. Just ask CBS Digital to do it! (Not HTV)

It would never happen but I would pay real money if the visual effects where recomposed in the same way CBS D is remastering TNG for ST 1-6 instead of half-hearted attempts at cleaning them up with DNR. I'd imagine all the negatives are still stored away and it wouldn't cost anything near the re-post production of 178 episodes. At the very least rescan the movie negatives again and give us a fresh print.

arch101 · January 9 2013, 02:25 AM

The DE is the better version. However, I do own a TMP BluRay because, well, it's bluRay. Every time I look at it I keep wishing it was the DE. I especially miss the DE's audio mix (vastly superior).

Maurice · January 9 2013, 05:28 AM

MickJo1701 wrote:

It would never happen but I would pay real money if the visual effects where recomposed in the same way CBS D is remastering TNG for ST 1-6 instead of half-hearted attempts at cleaning them up with DNR. I'd imagine all the negatives are still stored away and it wouldn't cost anything near the re-post production of 178 episodes. At the very least rescan the movie negatives again and give us a fresh print.

As above...

trevanian wrote:

Maurice wrote:

The original effects elements probably don't exist at this point.

Yeah, didn't an old friend of ours hear that Trumbull wound up throwing a lot of TMP vfx elements away because of space limitations around the time of BLADE RUNNER? That still puts the blame on Paramount, since they should have wanted all that stuff to store in-house to repurpose.

FalTorPan · January 9 2013, 05:39 AM

Ah, that old friend. I wonder what he's been up to.

Flake · January 10 2013, 02:01 PM

I remember on here an expert called 'Mr Stinky Pants' or someone? He would know all there is to know about TMP

Should have done a poll, which version is the best: Theatrical, Extra Long Version or Directors Edition.

Like I said I would assume it is whichever version people owned on VHS/Beta/Laserdisc back in the day and rewatched a lot!

Therin of Andor · January 10 2013, 02:23 PM

Flake wrote:

I remember on here an expert called 'Mr Stinky Pants' or someone?

Also known as The God Thing. A fellow fan from Sydney who moved to the USA. We passed in similar circles in the 80s, did the same weekly comic runs, remember the same bookshops, saw the same sneak previews, but never met.

I would assume it is whichever version people owned on VHS/Beta/Laserdisc back in the day and rewatched a lot!

A true completist has each copy. I still own TMP theatrical in Beta, VHS scan & pan and VHS widescreen, plus the Special Longer Version on VHS, the DVD DE, and an iTunes download and Blu-Ray of the theatrical.

Flake · January 10 2013, 09:57 PM

^^ ah yes, TGT. It is a while ago now I guess

Also its a good thing I am not a completist or else I would be broke

Maurice · January 11 2013, 11:41 AM

TGT occasionally drops TMP related goodies in my email, so he's still out there.

Flake · January 11 2013, 07:15 PM

Regarding Trumbull throwing away his TMP work, do we know what he threw away? Was it everything? Was Trumbull responsible for the Klingon segment & V'Ger transformation or was that Dykstra? (The two FX Elements that wound up in TNG remastered)

Flake · January 11 2013, 07:18 PM

To perhaps half answer my own question...

On the Trumbull & Dykstra thing my recollection is that everything from V'Ger flyover onward is Dykstra? Personally I thought that the FX scenes inside V'Ger (after they are tractored in) are the best FX in the movie.... but those matte paintings in the 'brain complex' are awful !

shatastrophic · January 11 2013, 07:40 PM

The Director's edition is vastly superior to the original. Its editing, special effects, sound effects, and that Wise was involved with it made it way better. I'm not busting the original format which I love as well. But when you look at the Enterprise at the end when they were walking on it and how it looks like it should have, while still fitting in to how the movie looked when it came out it just screams cool.

trevanian · January 11 2013, 08:56 PM

Dykstra is responsible for the opening klingon, the epsilon 9 stuff, a lot of viewscreen graphics, torpedoes and the EXTERIOR of the physical vger, including the first maw that opens up at the front end. He also got stuck with the terrible officer's lounge mess, where production in its infinite wisdom -- how wise & co didn't realize this ahead of time I can't imagine -- shot blue-grey uniforms against a bluescreen.

Trumbull had the cloud (the super pretty stuff), all of the vger interiors (including the terrible wingwalk stuff, which in the theater was only really bad in the profile shot of the saucer, the one where the ship seems about the size of a barn ... the first shot where they come up on the lift, while awful on DVD and not great on laser, seemed fine in the theater.) And he had 98% of the Ent shots (Dykstra did a couple super long shots with a tiny E-A) and the travel pod and drydock and orbital station.

Trumbull's people handled San Francisco and Vulcan, but don't blame them for the Vulcan establishing shots - somebody (katz?) pulled those and gave them to some other company to do, which is why they absolutely suck compared to the version there are many images of Matthew Yuricich painting. That's info from TGT, but I believe it completely. Rocco Gioffre might know more about all this, he was MY's apprentice, and he posts at the stopmotionanimation.com forum for matte paintings (or he did before they redesigned it, haven't been there in awhile.)

That's off the top of my head, I'm sure I'm missing tons of stuff, there are something like 560 VFX shots in the movie.
edit addon: as for why paramount didn't take back and preserve all of the effective elements ... well, that's just brain-dead to me, as in a no-brainer that they still screwed up. Then again, look at how they treated the quarter-million dollar drydock ... it got stuck in some storage facility for nearly 15 years and wasn't protected when shipped, so it was pretty much debris suspended by its internal wiring by the time ILM got it for GENERATIONS.

RAMA · January 26 2013, 07:48 PM

Flake wrote:

I am so relieved we got the original cut of The Motion Picture on Blu-Ray instead of the Director Edition abomination that came out a decade ago. The original cinema release from 1979 is the definitive cut of TMP and no one should tinker with it. It is what it is and shouldn't have been messed with.

I am just glad that Paramount had the usual foresight to render the new DE effects in SD thus sparing us from its HD release. If someone from Paramount reads this, please ensure you never let some fool looking for a quick buck talk you into remastering the DE for the undoubted future blu-ray special uber edition. It is not broken, it does not need fixing, it is what it is and we love it.

The best thing that could happen for any future TMP release would be to go back to original camera negative and rebuild the movie from there using the exact same system CBS digital are using on TNG right now. Imagine those wonderful effects recomposited with 21st century technology... the original elements but without noise/matte lines etc NO NEW CGI, just the original but better.

OH and please Paramount, when you re-re-re release TMP on bluray please please don't scrub the grain off. DNR SUCKS. Keep the grain intact, scan at 8k or 16k or whatever and do it right next time. Just ask CBS Digital to do it! (Not HTV)

Thats funny, I thought the DE was the only thing that made rewatching TMP worthwhile.

Grant · January 26 2013, 08:33 PM

[/QUOTE]

Thats funny, I thought the DE was the only thing that made rewatching TMP worthwhile.[/QUOTE]

I will never watch the theatrical again in my lifetime. I will buy the DC if they release it on Blu-ray.

By the way, no review of the TMP blu-ray claimed it had excessive DNR.

Treks 3 & 4 had the excessive DNR.

Trek 1 and 2 were praised for having the most film-like appearance of the 6.

January 9 2013, 02:25 AM	#18
arch101 Fleet Captain Location: 10 miles west of the Universal Hub	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray The DE is the better version. However, I do own a TMP BluRay because, well, it's bluRay. Every time I look at it I keep wishing it was the DE. I especially miss the DE's audio mix (vastly superior). __________________ "If we (The Boston Herald) live a single day longer than them (The Boston Globe), we win" -Howie Carr

January 9 2013, 05:39 AM	#20
FalTorPan Vice Admiral Location: Out there... thataway.	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray Ah, that old friend. I wonder what he's been up to. __________________ Watch ASTRONUTS! Visit Trekplace! Check out my personal website!

January 10 2013, 02:01 PM	#21
Flake Commodore Location: Manchester, UK	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray I remember on here an expert called 'Mr Stinky Pants' or someone? He would know all there is to know about TMP Should have done a poll, which version is the best: Theatrical, Extra Long Version or Directors Edition. Like I said I would assume it is whichever version people owned on VHS/Beta/Laserdisc back in the day and rewatched a lot!

January 10 2013, 09:57 PM	#23
Flake Commodore Location: Manchester, UK	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray ^^ ah yes, TGT. It is a while ago now I guess Also its a good thing I am not a completist or else I would be broke

January 11 2013, 11:41 AM	#24
Maurice Rear Admiral Location: Maurice in San Francisco	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray TGT occasionally drops TMP related goodies in my email, so he's still out there. __________________ * * * "Star Trek…at times sparkled with true ingenuity, and pure science fiction approaches, and at other times was more carnival like, and very much more the creature of television than the creature of a legitimate literary form." —Rod Serling, 1970"

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January 11 2013, 07:15 PM	#25
Flake Commodore Location: Manchester, UK	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray Regarding Trumbull throwing away his TMP work, do we know what he threw away? Was it everything? Was Trumbull responsible for the Klingon segment & V'Ger transformation or was that Dykstra? (The two FX Elements that wound up in TNG remastered)

January 11 2013, 07:18 PM	#26
Flake Commodore Location: Manchester, UK	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray To perhaps half answer my own question... On the Trumbull & Dykstra thing my recollection is that everything from V'Ger flyover onward is Dykstra? Personally I thought that the FX scenes inside V'Ger (after they are tractored in) are the best FX in the movie.... but those matte paintings in the 'brain complex' are awful !

January 11 2013, 07:40 PM	#27
shatastrophic Commander Location: Mile High City	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray The Director's edition is vastly superior to the original. Its editing, special effects, sound effects, and that Wise was involved with it made it way better. I'm not busting the original format which I love as well. But when you look at the Enterprise at the end when they were walking on it and how it looks like it should have, while still fitting in to how the movie looked when it came out it just screams cool. __________________ LCARS

January 11 2013, 08:56 PM	#28
trevanian Rear Admiral	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray Dykstra is responsible for the opening klingon, the epsilon 9 stuff, a lot of viewscreen graphics, torpedoes and the EXTERIOR of the physical vger, including the first maw that opens up at the front end. He also got stuck with the terrible officer's lounge mess, where production in its infinite wisdom -- how wise & co didn't realize this ahead of time I can't imagine -- shot blue-grey uniforms against a bluescreen. Trumbull had the cloud (the super pretty stuff), all of the vger interiors (including the terrible wingwalk stuff, which in the theater was only really bad in the profile shot of the saucer, the one where the ship seems about the size of a barn ... the first shot where they come up on the lift, while awful on DVD and not great on laser, seemed fine in the theater.) And he had 98% of the Ent shots (Dykstra did a couple super long shots with a tiny E-A) and the travel pod and drydock and orbital station. Trumbull's people handled San Francisco and Vulcan, but don't blame them for the Vulcan establishing shots - somebody (katz?) pulled those and gave them to some other company to do, which is why they absolutely suck compared to the version there are many images of Matthew Yuricich painting. That's info from TGT, but I believe it completely. Rocco Gioffre might know more about all this, he was MY's apprentice, and he posts at the stopmotionanimation.com forum for matte paintings (or he did before they redesigned it, haven't been there in awhile.) That's off the top of my head, I'm sure I'm missing tons of stuff, there are something like 560 VFX shots in the movie. edit addon: as for why paramount didn't take back and preserve all of the effective elements ... well, that's just brain-dead to me, as in a no-brainer that they still screwed up. Then again, look at how they treated the quarter-million dollar drydock ... it got stuck in some storage facility for nearly 15 years and wasn't protected when shipped, so it was pretty much debris suspended by its internal wiring by the time ILM got it for GENERATIONS. Last edited by trevanian; January 11 2013 at 09:02 PM. Reason: drydock addition

January 26 2013, 08:33 PM	#30
Grant Fleet Captain	Re: TMP on Blu-Ray [/QUOTE] Thats funny, I thought the DE was the only thing that made rewatching TMP worthwhile.[/QUOTE] I will never watch the theatrical again in my lifetime. I will buy the DC if they release it on Blu-ray. By the way, no review of the TMP blu-ray claimed it had excessive DNR. Treks 3 & 4 had the excessive DNR. Trek 1 and 2 were praised for having the most film-like appearance of the 6.