Putting the Shatner "ego issue" from TOS to rest - Page 5

Carcazoid · January 3 2013, 08:09 PM

I heard that the two got in a scuffle on set one day and Shatner bit off Doohan's finger.

Or maybe that was the mirror universe.

A beaker full of death · January 3 2013, 09:24 PM

And the shame of it is that they had such good chemistry on screen. That shuttlecraft scene in TMP is pure gold.
Of course, pros can fake chemistry. That's why we see so little of it today.

jayrath · January 3 2013, 09:33 PM

BeatleJWOL wrote:

maybe too his subsequent career slump in the 1970s was less about typecasting and more about stories of his bad behavior as part of the TOS cast.

Yes, of course. Hollywood was abuzz about the star of a minor (and failing) series that was cancelled, and how he allegedly didn't treat all the day players as full-blown stars themselves. Gee, who could blame producers for not casting him? I'm sure that was their very top concern.

Borjis · January 4 2013, 12:42 AM

T'Girl wrote:

One of the criticisms that I read of Shatner was that at the end of the day, instead of hanging out with his fellow actors, he would leave the studio and spend time with his established friends and his family. He treated his fellow actors as co-workers and not his new best friends.

I thought that as well, until I read Koenig's book about the making of TMP. There are photos of the cast and crew playing softball and Shatner is there. I was surprised to see that.

RandyS · January 4 2013, 01:39 AM

Gov Kodos wrote:

YARN wrote:

Gov Kodos wrote:

It could be my imagination, but in III there was supposed to be a scene where Sulu gets offered command of Excelsior. It happens around the same time Kirk contacts him about stealing the Enterprise. I could be remembering a scene from the book, though.

OK. I don't see how that scene would have served the needs of the plot (i.e., Kirk escaping from Captain Pompous on his pompous new ship). If it was there, however, I'd be curious as to why it was there. Did Takei make demands?

You'd need someone to say if it is in the book or not since I don't have it to confirm the scene is there or just my misremembering. It's absence doesn't change the flow of the movie. If there were anything to add, I'd rather it were how Uhura ran electronic interference for the get away and got out of the transporter station and to the Vulcan Embassy for asylum.

The scene in question was in the novelization of Star Trek II and was part of the shuttle scene where Kirk and Sulu have the following exchange:

Kirk: I hate inspections.

Sulu: I'm delighted. Any chance to go aboard the Enterprise.

Kirk: Well, I for one am glad to have you at the helm for three weeks. I don't think these kids can steer.

What happened with the scene in the film, I have no idea, but I remember it being in the novel. Of course, we all know that novelists (JM Dillard in this case) flesh out the story, adding things that were not in the movie (movies 3 and 5 for example don't even start until the books are well over 100 pages in), so wiether or not this scene was a part of the script, I can't say.

Iamnotspock · January 4 2013, 03:22 AM

RandyS wrote:

What happened with the scene in the film, I have no idea, but I remember it being in the novel. Of course, we all know that novelists (JM Dillard in this case) flesh out the story, adding things that were not in the movie (movies 3 and 5 for example don't even start until the books are well over 100 pages in), so wiether or not this scene was a part of the script, I can't say.

From an earlier draft found online (credited to Jack B. Sowards and Samuel A. Peeples).

29 INT. SPACE SHUTTLE 29

A new composite. Bones, Sulu, Uhura and Kirk -- who
sits, reading. Through the windows we can see the
approach to the starship ENTERPRISE. Kirk looks up,
nods. Sulu activates a comm button.

SULU
Enterprise, this is Admiral Kirk's
party on final approach.

ENTERPRISE VOICE
(filtered)
Enterprise welcomes you. Prepare
for docking.

Kirk looks up from his book as Sulu sits next to him.

KIRK
I really must thank you.

SULU
(embarrassed)
I am delighted; any chance to go
aboard Enterprise, however briefly,
is always an excuse for nostalgia.

KIRK
I cut your new orders personally. By
the end of the month, you'll have your
first command: USS EXCELSIOR.

SULU
Thank you, sir. I've looked
forward to this for a long time.

KIRK
You've earned it. But I'm still
grateful to have you at the helm
for three weeks. I don't believe
these kids can steer.

Sulu laughs.

Dale Sams · January 4 2013, 03:57 AM

I'm think it's in Takei's book that he says Shatner kept tanking takes and eventually Meyer said "Let's move on".

Personally, I find it just as likely that Meyer was choosing to save taking Shatner to task over his "condo scenes" rather than belabor this minor point....as it is that Takei is lying.

YARN · January 4 2013, 06:30 AM

Dale Sams wrote:

I'm think it's in Takei's book that he says Shatner kept tanking takes and eventually Meyer said "Let's move on".

Personally, I find it just as likely that Meyer was choosing to save taking Shatner to task over his "condo scenes" rather than belabor this minor point....as it is that Takei is lying.

So an early draft of the Star Trek II script. Is it actual shooting script? If not, then Shatner didn't tank the line.

And suppose that line is in the film and Sulu is in command of another ship in later films. Are we going to follow the Adventures of Captain Day Player and his anonymous crew on his unbeloved ship or are we going to stick with the main cast on the Enterprise? This would have been a Denise Crosby move and for what? To get a fictional promotion in a fictional world?

NewHorizon · January 4 2013, 04:36 PM

Does anymore really need to be said?

http://youtu.be/HU2ftCitvyQ

Dale Sams · January 4 2013, 04:52 PM

YARN wrote:

Dale Sams wrote:

I'm think it's in Takei's book that he says Shatner kept tanking takes and eventually Meyer said "Let's move on".

Personally, I find it just as likely that Meyer was choosing to save taking Shatner to task over his "condo scenes" rather than belabor this minor point....as it is that Takei is lying.

So an early draft of the Star Trek II script. Is it actual shooting script? If not, then Shatner didn't tank the line.

And suppose that line is in the film and Sulu is in command of another ship in later films. Are we going to follow the Adventures of Captain Day Player and his anonymous crew on his unbeloved ship or are we going to stick with the main cast on the Enterprise? This would have been a Denise Crosby move and for what? To get a fictional promotion in a fictional world?

Oh believe me, in my circle, we make more fun of the guy who gets in a snit over "losing a fictional promotion in a fictional world" than the guy who supposedly caused it.

CoveTom · January 4 2013, 05:36 PM

T'Girl wrote:

One of the criticisms that I read of Shatner was that at the end of the day, instead of hanging out with his fellow actors, he would leave the studio and spend time with his established friends and his family. He treated his fellow actors as co-workers and not his new best friends.

Is that... bad? I have a career, I am happy in my job, and I like my co-workers and get along well with them. But when the work day ends, I go home and spend time with my family. If I want to something social, I do it with my "established friends." I've never once spent any time with my co-workers in a social setting. In fact, it would feel weird for me to do so.

Why does Shatner have to embrace his co-workers as "his new best friends"?

ssosmcin · January 4 2013, 05:42 PM

RandyS wrote:

Of course, we all know that novelists (JM Dillard in this case) flesh out the story,

Vonda N. McIntyre, actually. This jumped out because she and I have the same last name. :-)

J.M. Dillard took over the novelizations with Star Trek V.

TREK_GOD_1 · January 4 2013, 05:55 PM

CoveTom wrote:

Why does Shatner have to embrace his co-workers as "his new best friends"?

Because the post series myth in print and some areas of fandom (1970s) sold the idea that the TOS cast were like one big family, when it was more like a couple of parental figures and a bunch of ill-tempered adopted kids tagging along for the ride.

Some seem to forget that actors--if they have any sense at all--do have relationships in their real lives which have nothing to do with work, but this celebrity-centric culture pushes the idea that performers' only family is the Hollywood family (there's much that can be read into the motives for that), and everything else is an afterthought.

Apparently, Shatner did not agree with that.

TrickyDickie · January 4 2013, 06:34 PM

Shatner visited my old home town about 8 to 10 years ago. There was a charge of such and such hundred dollars to dine with him and such and such hundred dollars to just be in the same line of motorcycles with him as he took a short ride beside the shore of the local lake. I didn't go because I wasn't going to spend that kind of money for something like that.

That being said, sure, he gets a certain percentage of the proceeds from his appearances, but a lot of the money goes to the ones who organize things and set everything up. It's not easy, there are a lot of logistics involved, permits of various kinds, etc.

I'm not saying that the man has never had ego issues, but sometimes in some of it there can be a false perception when there is a lot more at work than just someone's ego.

Dale Sams · January 4 2013, 06:53 PM

The easy thing to do is just see the shows featuring him and Nimoy together. I've only been to one con, but that was the one I saw. Priceless. Nimoy playing the straight man to Shatner's (apparently) a little inebriated self. I think the best part was when Shatner seemed to forget he had done a Futurama episode and Nimoy is whispering to him "You remember...."

January 3 2013, 08:09 PM	#61
Carcazoid Captain Location: Planet Carcazed	Re: Putting the Shatner "ego issue" from TOS to rest I heard that the two got in a scuffle on set one day and Shatner bit off Doohan's finger. Or maybe that was the mirror universe. __________________ =Carcazoid=

January 3 2013, 09:24 PM	#62
A beaker full of death Vice Admiral	Re: Putting the Shatner "ego issue" from TOS to rest And the shame of it is that they had such good chemistry on screen. That shuttlecraft scene in TMP is pure gold. Of course, pros can fake chemistry. That's why we see so little of it today. __________________ "shall not be infringed" is naturally open to infringements of all kinds, because shut up and think of the children. http://www.americanthinker.com/2013/...#ixzz2ImW0V3GV

January 4 2013, 03:57 AM	#67
Dale Sams Captain	Re: Putting the Shatner "ego issue" from TOS to rest I'm think it's in Takei's book that he says Shatner kept tanking takes and eventually Meyer said "Let's move on". Personally, I find it just as likely that Meyer was choosing to save taking Shatner to task over his "condo scenes" rather than belabor this minor point....as it is that Takei is lying.

January 4 2013, 04:36 PM	#69
NewHorizon Commander	Re: Putting the Shatner "ego issue" from TOS to rest Does anymore really need to be said? http://youtu.be/HU2ftCitvyQ

January 4 2013, 06:34 PM	#74
TrickyDickie Commodore	Re: Putting the Shatner "ego issue" from TOS to rest Shatner visited my old home town about 8 to 10 years ago. There was a charge of such and such hundred dollars to dine with him and such and such hundred dollars to just be in the same line of motorcycles with him as he took a short ride beside the shore of the local lake. I didn't go because I wasn't going to spend that kind of money for something like that. That being said, sure, he gets a certain percentage of the proceeds from his appearances, but a lot of the money goes to the ones who organize things and set everything up. It's not easy, there are a lot of logistics involved, permits of various kinds, etc. I'm not saying that the man has never had ego issues, but sometimes in some of it there can be a false perception when there is a lot more at work than just someone's ego.

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January 4 2013, 06:53 PM	#75
Dale Sams Captain	Re: Putting the Shatner "ego issue" from TOS to rest The easy thing to do is just see the shows featuring him and Nimoy together. I've only been to one con, but that was the one I saw. Priceless. Nimoy playing the straight man to Shatner's (apparently) a little inebriated self. I think the best part was when Shatner seemed to forget he had done a Futurama episode and Nimoy is whispering to him "You remember...."