RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 141,402
Posts: 5,505,835
Members: 25,127
Currently online: 562
Newest member: OneOfFour

TrekToday headlines

Retro Review: The Emperor’s New Cloak
By: Michelle on Dec 20

Star Trek Opera
By: T'Bonz on Dec 19

New Abrams Project
By: T'Bonz on Dec 18

IDW Publishing March 2015 Comics
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Paramount Star Trek 3 Expectations
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Star Trek #39 Sneak Peek
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Star Trek 3 Potential Director Shortlist
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Official Starships Collection Update
By: T'Bonz on Dec 15

Retro Review: Prodigal Daughter
By: Michelle on Dec 13

Sindicate Lager To Debut In The US Next Week
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 22 2012, 03:49 PM   #31
Mage
Commodore
 
Mage's Avatar
 
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

The biggest problem with using established side characters from the show (Dukat, Garak) is the need to explain them. There will always be people going to a Trek movie just for shits and giggles, people who have never seen TNG for example. When you then do a movie about Q, they're going to wonder just who that is, without using half the movie to 'explain' Q to non-Trekkies.
__________________
Niner. Lurker. Browncoat.
Mage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 22 2012, 04:01 PM   #32
JarodRussell
Vice Admiral
 
JarodRussell's Avatar
 
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

Mage wrote: View Post
The biggest problem with using established side characters from the show (Dukat, Garak) is the need to explain them. There will always be people going to a Trek movie just for shits and giggles, people who have never seen TNG for example. When you then do a movie about Q, they're going to wonder just who that is, without using half the movie to 'explain' Q to non-Trekkies.
The audience isn't stupid. There's nothing about the characters you mentioned that can't be explained in a very short exposition. Actually, all you need to understand is what they are (Dukat: Cardassian leader, Garak: former spy, now tailor, Q: omnipotent being) and that they have a history with the main characters. You don't even need to know what history. If it's relevant to the story, it will explain itself during the unfolding of the plot. If it's irrelevant anyway, nobody needs to know it. Seriously, it's not that hard, it happens in every single film you watch.
JarodRussell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 22 2012, 09:21 PM   #33
indianatrekker26
Captain
 
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

Trekky0623 wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
ichab wrote: View Post
Q would have been fine for a cameo appearance, but not an entire movie around him. Tomolak or even Sela would have been better than Shizon for Nemesis. It would have also been nice to see some of the DS9 characters in a movie like Gul dukat, Garak , Quark, or any of the station crew.
How would Q only be good for a cameo but Sela, Tomalok be good to have a whole movie built around?

Q has limitless story potential, the others are one trick villains there to simply offer a stumbling block for the crew. Give me Shinzon every day of the week and twice on Sunday over Sela and Tomalok.
That's why Q is horrible for a movie. There's no way to defeat or overcome Q, so in the end he just presents situations for the crew to deal with that come out of nowhere with no way to stop them. He's good for episodes where there is some sort of lesson to learn and he is the teacher, but again, then the focus is on Q and less so the main characters. It doesn't work for a movie.
i dont buy that argument. TNG's series finale "All Good Things" proved how you could use Q in an antagonistic way, but keep the focus on Picard and the crew. And, to me, "All Good Things" was a far superior story to Generations.
indianatrekker26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 23 2012, 03:53 AM   #34
Bry_Sinclair
Commodore
 
Bry_Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: Tactical withdrawl along the Klingon border
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

I do think it would have been nice to have had Sela in NEM, so they could get all of the old gang back together--even done a Wesley in have her scene cut from the final film but have her appear on screen at some point. Would have been a nice tip of the hat to S1 TNG.
__________________
Avatar: Captain Naya, U.S.S. Renown NCC-1415 [Star Trek: Four Years War]
Manip by: JM1776 (STPMA.net)
Bry_Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 23 2012, 07:59 AM   #35
FelizNavidad
Admiral
 
FelizNavidad's Avatar
 
Location: San Francisco Bay Area, CA
View FelizNavidad's Twitter Profile
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

I wish Katsulas would have still been alive because Tomalak in Nemesis would have made that movie so much better. I would have also wanted to see Sela in that movie. Hell, instead of what we got, I was always hoping Nemesis could have tied up the lose ends from "The Defector" and "Unification".
__________________
Twitter

sjsharksfan39
FelizNavidad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 23 2012, 12:14 PM   #36
Mage
Commodore
 
Mage's Avatar
 
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Mage wrote: View Post
The biggest problem with using established side characters from the show (Dukat, Garak) is the need to explain them. There will always be people going to a Trek movie just for shits and giggles, people who have never seen TNG for example. When you then do a movie about Q, they're going to wonder just who that is, without using half the movie to 'explain' Q to non-Trekkies.
The audience isn't stupid. There's nothing about the characters you mentioned that can't be explained in a very short exposition. Actually, all you need to understand is what they are (Dukat: Cardassian leader, Garak: former spy, now tailor, Q: omnipotent being) and that they have a history with the main characters. You don't even need to know what history. If it's relevant to the story, it will explain itself during the unfolding of the plot. If it's irrelevant anyway, nobody needs to know it. Seriously, it's not that hard, it happens in every single film you watch.
And still, there will be people that are put off by it. That's one of the reasons that Trek movies didn't do all that well compared to other movies. Some non-Trekkies go see them, sure. But most people think 'damn, I probably need to see the shows a lot to get the movies'. So yeah, I stand by my statement, using 'villians' from the show that need explaining won't work. Even with a few short scenes, since you can't help but wonder if you would have enjoyed the movie more if you had seen the show.
__________________
Niner. Lurker. Browncoat.
Mage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 23 2012, 05:42 PM   #37
Kirby
Rear Admiral
 
Kirby's Avatar
 
Location: Alt: 5280
View Kirby's Twitter Profile
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

Garrovick wrote: View Post
I kind of wish they had brought back the villian from "Space Seed" - what was his name again? I bet they could have built a pretty decent movie about him.
I think you mean what was HER name, and it's Lt. Marla McGivers. That traiterous bitch turned on the crew and allowed some Mexican/Indian guy to put Kirk in a giant clothes dryer. Frankly I'm glad they never followed up on that horrible episode.
__________________
Give each other $10, put it on Underhill.
Kirby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 23 2012, 06:10 PM   #38
Freman
Fleet Captain
 
Freman's Avatar
 
Location: Kenora, Ontario, Canada
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

Star Grinch wrote: View Post
I was disappointed they didn't take a rather obvious move and have O'brien on the Defiant with Worf during First Contact. As long as he was with the TNG crew, he deserved being in at least one of the movies.
Agreed. I found it especially annoying that he didn't at least cameo at Riker and Troi's wedding in Nemesis.
__________________
Booyaka!!!!
Freman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 23 2012, 07:29 PM   #39
The Overlord
Captain
 
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

tomalak301 wrote: View Post
I wish Katsulas would have still been alive because Tomalak in Nemesis would have made that movie so much better. I would have also wanted to see Sela in that movie. Hell, instead of what we got, I was always hoping Nemesis could have tied up the lose ends from "The Defector" and "Unification".
Andreas Katsulas died in 2006 and Nemesis was released in 2002, so Tomalak could have been in Nemesis. They just didn't use him.
The Overlord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 24 2012, 03:57 AM   #40
Bry_Sinclair
Commodore
 
Bry_Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: Tactical withdrawl along the Klingon border
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

BillJ wrote: View Post
I would've dropped Denise Crosby into the background of one of the Enterprise scenes in a Starfleet uniform with the Tasha Yar haircut. No lines.

Fandom would've imploded.
Genius idea!!!!!!
__________________
Avatar: Captain Naya, U.S.S. Renown NCC-1415 [Star Trek: Four Years War]
Manip by: JM1776 (STPMA.net)
Bry_Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 24 2012, 04:39 AM   #41
bigdaddy
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Space Massachusetts
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

Trekky0623 wrote: View Post
This would make for a not-so-great movie...
Have you seen TNG movies? What we got was 4.5 not so great movies.

Tasha Yar's daughter should have been the bad guy (gal) in Nemesis. That would have made the movie a lot better. If they wanted a big name bad guy they could have introduced someone as her husband.
__________________
The powerful play goes on, and you may contribute a verse.
bigdaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 24 2012, 03:49 PM   #42
BillJ
Admiral
 
BillJ's Avatar
 
Location: Covington, Ky.
View BillJ's Twitter Profile
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

I'm still confused how Denise Crosby would've made Nemesis better except for the hardest of hard core Trekkies?
__________________
"...the most elementary and valuable statement in science, the beginning of wisdom, is I do not know." - Lt. Commander Data, "Where Silence Has Lease"
BillJ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old December 24 2012, 08:12 PM   #43
FelizNavidad
Admiral
 
FelizNavidad's Avatar
 
Location: San Francisco Bay Area, CA
View FelizNavidad's Twitter Profile
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

The Overlord wrote: View Post
tomalak301 wrote: View Post
I wish Katsulas would have still been alive because Tomalak in Nemesis would have made that movie so much better. I would have also wanted to see Sela in that movie. Hell, instead of what we got, I was always hoping Nemesis could have tied up the lose ends from "The Defector" and "Unification".
Andreas Katsulas died in 2006 and Nemesis was released in 2002, so Tomalak could have been in Nemesis. They just didn't use him.
Really, I thought he died earlier. It would have been so cool getting Tomalak, Sela, and Spock in Nemesis. Would have made that movie so much better (And not have Data Die awfully would have been a plus too).
__________________
Twitter

sjsharksfan39
FelizNavidad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2012, 04:48 PM   #44
Captaindemotion
Vice Admiral
 
Captaindemotion's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

Mage wrote: View Post
The biggest problem with using established side characters from the show (Dukat, Garak) is the need to explain them. There will always be people going to a Trek movie just for shits and giggles, people who have never seen TNG for example. When you then do a movie about Q, they're going to wonder just who that is, without using half the movie to 'explain' Q to non-Trekkies.
Not really. I don't think one needs to have seen Space Seed to enjoy TWOK or Best of Both Worlds to enjoy FC (and of course the Borg Queen didn't even appear in BOBW).

Characters like Carol Marcus were also supposed to have had a history with Kirk but, even though they'd never appeared in a tv show or movie before, their connections were generally established with a line or two of dialogue. Why would it be harder or more distracting to do so with a character who has appeared onscreen before?
__________________
Hodor!!!!!!!
Captaindemotion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2012, 05:10 PM   #45
Greg Cox
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Oxford, PA
Re: Characters from the TV shows who should have appeared in the movie

Captaindemotion wrote: View Post
Mage wrote: View Post
The biggest problem with using established side characters from the show (Dukat, Garak) is the need to explain them. There will always be people going to a Trek movie just for shits and giggles, people who have never seen TNG for example. When you then do a movie about Q, they're going to wonder just who that is, without using half the movie to 'explain' Q to non-Trekkies.
Not really. I don't think one needs to have seen Space Seed to enjoy TWOK or Best of Both Worlds to enjoy FC (and of course the Borg Queen didn't even appear in BOBW).

Characters like Carol Marcus were also supposed to have had a history with Kirk but, even though they'd never appeared in a tv show or movie before, their connections were generally established with a line or two of dialogue. Why would it be harder or more distracting to do so with a character who has appeared onscreen before?
Good point. We probably overestimate the difficulty of reviving old characters sometimes, forgetting that it's not necessary for the audience to know every tiny detail of an old character's backstory just to follow the story on the screen. After all, The Wrath of Khan didn't need to mention poor Marla by name, let alone explain that Khan's dead wife was a former Stafleet historian . . . .
__________________
www.gregcox-author.com
Greg Cox is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 08:46 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.