How could the Dominion War doesn't effect the economy of Federation?

[KamenRiderBlade]

One common bad point in "Star Trek" writers is that they have a tendency to make Starfleet / UFP look incompetant by having technological failures, dumb rules, or incompetant people to create artificial drama.

Babylon 5, many Sci-Fi animes don't have their writers depend on these tropes.

It's the one part about Trek Writers that I hope to abolish if they ever create more TV series in the future.

There are many ways to create drama, using those stock tropes only make the protagonists look worse then they really should be is just bad writing.

[Timo]

Ergo getting a outside source is very beneficial to keeping manufacturing / repairs at full capacity.

...And giving the Jem'Hadar another target to aim at, easing the burden on primary duranium facilities in the UFP.

Timo Saloniemi

[KamenRiderBlade]

Timo wrote:

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...And giving the Jem'Hadar another target to aim at, easing the burden on primary duranium facilities in the UFP.

Timo Saloniemi

That's a different way of looking at it.

[Deks]

KamenRiderBlade wrote:

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Or the Federation might be consuming Duranium faster then they can replicate / produce given wartime energy levels.

Ergo getting an outside source is very beneficial to keeping manufacturing / repairs at full capacity.

In a complimentary capacity to avoid possible shortages during wartime... yes.
But not as a primary source.

[Brainsucker]

wait, according Memory Alpha, Replicator is :

A replicator was a device that used transporter technology to dematerialize quantities of matter and then rematerialize that matter in another form. It was also capable of inverting its function, thus disposing of leftovers and dishes and storing the bulk material again. (TNG: "Lonely Among Us"; DS9: "Hard Time", "The Ascent"; VOY: "Year of Hell", "Memorial")

So..., don't tell me again that replicator use only deuterium to magically produce anything. Or... Memory Alpha is actually false?

[Deks]

Memory Alpha is NOT a canon source of information.
Per the actual on-screen data:
"Replicators convert energy into matter" - matter was never mentioned.

[brian577]

Deks wrote:

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Doesn't that strike you as poor writing?
To rely on any 1 species or source for something as vital as ship construction materials in the face of highly advanced technology that is basically integrated EVERYWHERE and is capable of creating practically anything is utterly unsustainable.
Ship construction materials would have to be made from readily available superior synthetic materials that can be made in abundance using the least amount of energy and resources... especially if we are talking about sustainability (let alone a war which was EXPECTED even).

I find it highly improbable, that they were never able to analyze the material and make a synthetic version - plus the material is NOT new.

Besides... Voyager constructed the second Delta Flyer which had a Duranium enforced hull (the first version had a Tetraburnium alloy that allowed the ship to withstand heavy atmoshperic pressure).
If Voyager was able to construct that ship at a spur of a thought and synthesize these materials (which they had to), the raw materials needed would have to be readily available in their environment (almost any given environment) that can be turned into synthetic Duranium, or Duranium is already replicable from energy alone (although granted, Voyager also could have traded with other races to get Duranium... if not the raw materials needed for its making).

Consisdering Voyager's bad writing, specifically that they were able to construct the ship at all with their supposedly limited resources, I'll take DS9's writing over there's.

[Deks]

brian577 wrote:

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Consisdering Voyager's bad writing, specifically that they were able to construct the ship at all with their supposedly limited resources, I'll take DS9's writing over there's.

I wouldn't, seeing how DS9 often times dumbed everything down and made characters look like morons who are LESS advanced than WE are (and the Dominion War - not to mention the Founders, were a complete joke).
At least in Voyager, even though it wasn't completely explained, construction of the Delta Flyer was mostly in line with the technology at their disposal and level of thinking the characters should have employed throughout the show.

[Brainsucker]

Deks wrote:

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Memory Alpha is NOT a canon source of information.
Per the actual on-screen data:
"Replicators convert energy into matter" - matter was never mentioned.

The problem Deks, Memory Alpha could give some "episodes Reference". So what about you? Where is that statement come?

brian577 wrote:

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Consisdering Voyager's bad writing, specifically that they were able to construct the ship at all with their supposedly limited resources, I'll take DS9's writing over there's.

I agree with you.

[T'Girl]

Brainsucker wrote:

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The problem Deks, Memory Alpha could give some "episodes Reference". So what about you? Where is that statement come?

What episode were you referring too"

[Brainsucker]

Merry Christmas wrote:

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What episode were you referring too"

replicator was a device that used transporter technology to dematerialize quantities of matter and then rematerialize that matter in another form. It was also capable of inverting its function, thus disposing of leftovers and dishes and storing the bulk material again. (TNG: "Lonely Among Us"; DS9: "Hard Time", "The Ascent"; VOY: "Year of Hell", "Memorial")

I copy this from Memory Alpha. Look at the last one. They give us the episodes reference. Look at that, The three series. TNG, DS9 and VOY.

[Timo]

Usually, such references are completely erroneous or subject to interpretation. One would have to go to each episode to see what is said or shown.

In this particular case, let's see what each episode has to say.

"Lonely Among Us": The word "replicator" is never even used. The tidbit being referred to is apparently this phrase: "You've seen something as fresh and tasty as meat, but inorganically materialised out of patterns used by our transporters." This neither supports or contradicts either of the models of replication: matter out of energy, or matter out of other matter.

"Hard Time": All we get wrt the replicator is that one puts the dishes back into it after eating. We saw such things in "Cardassians" already; why this particular episode is picked as a reference is unknown. Again, no real support or objection to the first claim made in the article. Only the second claim about recycling is supported.

"The Ascent": Again a reference to putting dishes back into the machine, only relevant to the second claim.

"Year of Hell": No idea what MA wants to reference here, as the replicators go offline for most of the episode.

"Memorial": Another reference to putting dishes back into the replicator.

So basically all that these supposed references give us is that dishes should be put back into the machine or mommy gets angry. We don't even learn what happens to the dishes when the button is pressed. Are they really recycled, or merely destroyed for convenience?

The first claim made in the entry is baseless in light of these particular references.

Timo Saloniemi

[T'Girl]

double post

[T'Girl]

Brainsucker wrote:

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replicator was a device ...

Please pardon the misunderstanding Brainsucker. I meant what episode was Deks referring too when he said ...

Per the actual on-screen data: "Replicators convert energy into matter"

I'm not sure where Deks obtained this quote.

[Brainsucker]

Merry Christmas wrote:

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Please pardon the misunderstanding Brainsucker. I meant what episode was Deks referring too when he said ...

Per the actual on-screen data: "Replicators convert energy into matter"

I'm not sure where Deks obtained this quote.

Ah I'm sorry too for the miss understanding

Timo wrote:

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Usually, such references are completely erroneous or subject to interpretation. One would have to go to each episode to see what is said or shown.

In this particular case, let's see what each episode has to say.

"Lonely Among Us": The word "replicator" is never even used. The tidbit being referred to is apparently this phrase: "You've seen something as fresh and tasty as meat, but inorganically materialised out of patterns used by our transporters." This neither supports or contradicts either of the models of replication: matter out of energy, or matter out of other matter.

"Hard Time": All we get wrt the replicator is that one puts the dishes back into it after eating. We saw such things in "Cardassians" already; why this particular episode is picked as a reference is unknown. Again, no real support or objection to the first claim made in the article. Only the second claim about recycling is supported.

"The Ascent": Again a reference to putting dishes back into the machine, only relevant to the second claim.

"Year of Hell": No idea what MA wants to reference here, as the replicators go offline for most of the episode.

"Memorial": Another reference to putting dishes back into the replicator.

So basically all that these supposed references give us is that dishes should be put back into the machine or mommy gets angry. We don't even learn what happens to the dishes when the button is pressed. Are they really recycled, or merely destroyed for convenience?

The first claim made in the entry is baseless in light of these particular references.

Timo Saloniemi

Well I don't know. Maybe there is no official info about this replicator in STar Trek