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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old December 17 2012, 08:36 PM   #16
Christopher
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
but I think by this point it's become enough of a pop-culture meme that it would more likely evoke laughter from the audience than the desired mood.
Don't be blinded by fandom. Nobody in the so called "general audience" knows it.
On the contrary -- it's been referenced widely in pop culture. Aside from the use in The Cable Guy mentioned above, it's been used as a gag in The Simpsons, Futurama, the Chris Elliott sitcom Get a Life, and Warehouse 13. There was also a Dexter's Laboratory cartoon that used a pastiche of the music in a "Gamesters of Triskelion" parody sequence set at an SF convention, and I'm sure there have been other pastiches as well.
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Old December 18 2012, 01:47 AM   #17
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
Shilliam Watner wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post

Hehehe, finally someone of the involved who admits the last film wasn't Star Trek.
I caught that too.
Except Giaccino doesn't mean it the way the so called haters would like to interpret it.
From his point of view as a composer, it didn't feel right to incorporate TOS music in the first one because in TOS they were already together and a family. Something which didn't start to happen in XI until the end.
Casino Royale did a similar thing. The James Bond theme wasn't played at all until the very end of the film. He wasn't Bond up until that point.
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Old December 18 2012, 02:15 AM   #18
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

What Christopher calls "The long-line 'song' portion of the Courage theme" was, I thought, badly used in Trek '09 - I especially loathed the repetition of it. It's not a verse of a longer song (despite the existence of the Roddenberry lyrics); the "second verse, same as the first" treatment was all wrong.
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Old December 18 2012, 02:31 AM   #19
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
Shilliam Watner wrote: View Post
I caught that too.
Except Giaccino doesn't mean it the way the so called haters would like to interpret it.
From his point of view as a composer, it didn't feel right to incorporate TOS music in the first one because in TOS they were already together and a family. Something which didn't start to happen in XI until the end.
Actually, using the theme at the end was a sign of success. A rebirth, if you will. It made one think of the past and also of things to come. Hell, I teared up when I heard it.

I might not have this one hundred percent correct, but I remember Abrams saying there was some debate about when use Courage's TOS theme, and if it should be used at all. He finally decided it had to be at the end of the movie, after they (maybe even meaning those off-screen as well) had earned it.
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Old December 18 2012, 02:43 AM   #20
Christopher
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

Enterprise is Great wrote: View Post
SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
From his point of view as a composer, it didn't feel right to incorporate TOS music in the first one because in TOS they were already together and a family. Something which didn't start to happen in XI until the end.
Casino Royale did a similar thing. The James Bond theme wasn't played at all until the very end of the film. He wasn't Bond up until that point.
Exactly. This is a common practice among composers. Hans Zimmer has spoken of how he didn't really express his Batman theme fully in Batman Begins until the end of the picture. And I'm not sure, but aside from the main titles, I don't think John Williams really used his Superman theme in Superman: The Movie (at least, not more than snippets) until Clark put on the costume and flew over the camera.

A theme represents a character, entity, or idea, and if the thing it represents isn't fully formed until the final act of the movie, it isn't emotionally appropriate to use the theme before then. You can hint at it, evolve it over the story alongside the characters' evolution, but you don't use it before it's been earned.
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Old December 18 2012, 06:23 AM   #21
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

Christopher wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
but I think by this point it's become enough of a pop-culture meme that it would more likely evoke laughter from the audience than the desired mood.
Don't be blinded by fandom. Nobody in the so called "general audience" knows it.
On the contrary -- it's been referenced widely in pop culture. Aside from the use in The Cable Guy mentioned above, it's been used as a gag in The Simpsons, Futurama, the Chris Elliott sitcom Get a Life, and Warehouse 13. There was also a Dexter's Laboratory cartoon that used a pastiche of the music in a "Gamesters of Triskelion" parody sequence set at an SF convention, and I'm sure there have been other pastiches as well.
I've heard it played in arenas when fights break out during NHL games.
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Old December 18 2012, 05:31 PM   #22
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

TorontoTrekker wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post

Don't be blinded by fandom. Nobody in the so called "general audience" knows it.
On the contrary -- it's been referenced widely in pop culture. Aside from the use in The Cable Guy mentioned above, it's been used as a gag in The Simpsons, Futurama, the Chris Elliott sitcom Get a Life, and Warehouse 13. There was also a Dexter's Laboratory cartoon that used a pastiche of the music in a "Gamesters of Triskelion" parody sequence set at an SF convention, and I'm sure there have been other pastiches as well.
I've heard it played in arenas when fights break out during NHL games.
That's awesome. I've never heard that, but that's amazing!
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Old December 18 2012, 06:01 PM   #23
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

trekker670 wrote: View Post
TorontoTrekker wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post

On the contrary -- it's been referenced widely in pop culture. Aside from the use in The Cable Guy mentioned above, it's been used as a gag in The Simpsons, Futurama, the Chris Elliott sitcom Get a Life, and Warehouse 13. There was also a Dexter's Laboratory cartoon that used a pastiche of the music in a "Gamesters of Triskelion" parody sequence set at an SF convention, and I'm sure there have been other pastiches as well.
I've heard it played in arenas when fights break out during NHL games.

That's awesome. I've never heard that, but that's amazing!
Might be quite a while before it happens again, though.
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Old December 18 2012, 07:02 PM   #24
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Re: Breaking News: Michael Giacchino Wants To Add TOS Music Into New M

gottacook wrote: View Post
What Christopher calls "The long-line 'song' portion of the Courage theme" was, I thought, badly used in Trek '09 - I especially loathed the repetition of it. It's not a verse of a longer song (despite the existence of the Roddenberry lyrics); the "second verse, same as the first" treatment was all wrong.
I loved it to death when I heard it. It was the cherry on top of the love-letter to TOS that this movie represented. An unrepentant and glorious affirmation of Star Trek's roots.

Seriously. I got chills.
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