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Old December 17 2012, 10:56 PM   #181
Squiggy
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

gturner wrote: View Post
The massacre in Newton would be a good week for Chicago, Washington, or New York, where guns are banned.

Oh! When you put it that way, I guess we shouldn't be even talking about it!

Also:
Guns are banned in none of those locations.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:09 PM   #182
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

Well of course a single town is going to have lower murders than an entire country of 60+ million. So it's an unfair comparrison

But lets look at two cities London and New York both have populations of around 8m

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/ap...politan-police

In April 2011 - March 2012

There were 101 homicides in London

NYC had 515 murders in 2011.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa...der_in_nyc.pdf

Both are for roughly 365 days
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Old December 17 2012, 11:14 PM   #183
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

Then try getting a permit. In DC a security guard had to go all the way to the US Supreme Court to get permission to have a gun, won the case, and he still couldn't get the city to issue him a permit without another year of legal action. In Chicago you have to get a license to own a gun, paying big bucks on top of the State Police license, and gun sales are banned. Then you're only allowed one operable gun, and can't even take it to your garage. New York state has the strictest gun laws in the nation, and New York City is insane, requiring licensing in all sorts of ways, including a requirement to pre-approve your schedule when you move your pistol to a shooting range and back.

And those three cities account for about quarter of all US gun homicides. Toss in Philly, Detroit, Baltimore, and LA, all extremely restrictive, and you've got about half the murders accounted for.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:24 PM   #184
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

MacLeod wrote: View Post
Well of course a single town is going to have lower murders than an entire country of 60+ million. So it's an unfair comparrison

But lets look at two cities London and New York both have populations of around 8m

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/ap...politan-police

In April 2011 - March 2012

There were 101 homicides in London

NYC had 515 murders in 2011.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa...der_in_nyc.pdf

Both are for roughly 365 days
Even when London had looser gun laws than NYC, it had a much lower homicide rate. New York's gun restrictions far predate London's.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:26 PM   #185
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

gturner wrote: View Post
Then try getting a permit. In DC a security guard had to go all the way to the US Supreme Court to get permission to have a gun, won the case, and he still couldn't get the city to issue him a permit without another year of legal action. In Chicago you have to get a license to own a gun, paying big bucks on top of the State Police license, and gun sales are banned. Then you're only allowed one operable gun, and can't even take it to your garage. New York state has the strictest gun laws in the nation, and New York City is insane, requiring licensing in all sorts of ways, including a requirement to pre-approve your schedule when you move your pistol to a shooting range and back.

And those three cities account for about quarter of all US gun homicides. Toss in Philly, Detroit, Baltimore, and LA, all extremely restrictive, and you've got about half the murders accounted for.
Hard to get ≠ banned
Regulated ≠ banned
need to be licensed ≠ banned

You've cracked the code. Lots of murders happen in cities. I hope you're written your Pulitzer acceptance speech.

Oh, and heaven FORBID we license people who own guns. The horrors. Next thing you know we'll be requiring people who want to drive those automobiles to submit to some form of rules and regulations.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:29 PM   #186
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

Many people will say if tighter gun laws prevented even one murder it was worth it.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:35 PM   #187
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

However, I'm going to call you out on just making stuff up, as you are often want to do.

In 2010 there were 14,748 murders in the US. Let's see how close to "half" those cities were in terms of their murder rate.

NYC: 532
LA: 291
Chicago: 435
Philly: 306
DC: 131
Detroit: 308
Baltimore: 223

Total: 2226 or 15.09%

Close enough.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:42 PM   #188
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

Festivus Toad wrote: View Post
However, I'm going to call you out on just making stuff up, as you are often want to do.

In 2010 there were 14,748 murders in the US. Let's see how close to "half" those cities were in terms of their murder rate.

NYC: 532
LA: 291
Chicago: 435
Philly: 306
DC: 131
Detroit: 308
Baltimore: 223

Total: 2226 or 15.09%

Close enough.
How many of those murders in the us were related to the war on drugs or mental health?
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Old December 17 2012, 11:43 PM   #189
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

HoHoHocutus wrote: View Post
Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
HoHoHocutus wrote: View Post

Not cool. You don't piggyback off of the Supreme Narrator's golden voice to give yourself greater authority and notoriety. It just isn't done.
Huh? What did I do?
Oh, for fuck's sake. I'm clearly talking about the guy who wrote the commentary and attributed it to Morgan Freeman (you know, that thing you linked to and I quoted) and not you. It's not even slightly ambiguous. I swear you do this kind of stuff on purpose.
Sorry. That last message, I was half asleep when I posted it.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:45 PM   #190
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

NightmareB4Holmes wrote: View Post
Festivus Toad wrote: View Post
However, I'm going to call you out on just making stuff up, as you are often want to do.

In 2010 there were 14,748 murders in the US. Let's see how close to "half" those cities were in terms of their murder rate.

NYC: 532
LA: 291
Chicago: 435
Philly: 306
DC: 131
Detroit: 308
Baltimore: 223

Total: 2226 or 15.09%

Close enough.
How many of those murders in the us were related to the war on drugs or mental health?
I don't know. Call up all the police departments. I'm sure they'll be more than happy to give you the information so you can crunch the numbers yourself.
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Old December 17 2012, 11:53 PM   #191
Data Holmes
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

Festivus Toad wrote: View Post
NightmareB4Holmes wrote: View Post
Festivus Toad wrote: View Post
However, I'm going to call you out on just making stuff up, as you are often want to do.

In 2010 there were 14,748 murders in the US. Let's see how close to "half" those cities were in terms of their murder rate.

NYC: 532
LA: 291
Chicago: 435
Philly: 306
DC: 131
Detroit: 308
Baltimore: 223

Total: 2226 or 15.09%

Close enough.
How many of those murders in the us were related to the war on drugs or mental health?
I don't know. Call up all the police departments. I'm sure they'll be more than happy to give you the information so you can crunch the numbers yourself.
No they wouldn't. If they did it would shine the truth of how the war on drugs is being used to pump up the statistics and help turn the US into a police state... Which the gun banners are more than happy to accept in the name of "perceived safety".
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Old December 17 2012, 11:54 PM   #192
MacLeod
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

gturner wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
Well of course a single town is going to have lower murders than an entire country of 60+ million. So it's an unfair comparrison

But lets look at two cities London and New York both have populations of around 8m

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/ap...politan-police

In April 2011 - March 2012

There were 101 homicides in London

NYC had 515 murders in 2011.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa...der_in_nyc.pdf

Both are for roughly 365 days
Even when London had looser gun laws than NYC, it had a much lower homicide rate. New York's gun restrictions far predate London's.
Then I have a question for you, have the tighter gun laws in NYC had an impact an the number of homicides commited by a firearm since they came into force?
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Old December 17 2012, 11:56 PM   #193
Data Holmes
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

MacLeod wrote: View Post
gturner wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
Well of course a single town is going to have lower murders than an entire country of 60+ million. So it's an unfair comparrison

But lets look at two cities London and New York both have populations of around 8m

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/ap...politan-police

In April 2011 - March 2012

There were 101 homicides in London

NYC had 515 murders in 2011.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa...der_in_nyc.pdf

Both are for roughly 365 days
Even when London had looser gun laws than NYC, it had a much lower homicide rate. New York's gun restrictions far predate London's.
Then I have a question for you, have the tighter gun laws in NYC had an impact an the number of homicides commited by a firearm since they came into force?
I do believe they went up...
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Old December 18 2012, 12:07 AM   #194
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Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

gturner, could you please, once, back up your claims with sources?

NightmareB4Holmes wrote: View Post
I do believe they went up...
Goes for you as well.
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Old December 18 2012, 12:14 AM   #195
gturner
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Location: Kentucky
Re: MASSIVE Elementary School Shooting in CT *12-24 Maybe be dead

Festivus Toad wrote: View Post
NightmareB4Holmes wrote: View Post
Festivus Toad wrote: View Post
However, I'm going to call you out on just making stuff up, as you are often want to do.

In 2010 there were 14,748 murders in the US. Let's see how close to "half" those cities were in terms of their murder rate.

NYC: 532
LA: 291
Chicago: 435
Philly: 306
DC: 131
Detroit: 308
Baltimore: 223

Total: 2226 or 15.09%

Close enough.
How many of those murders in the us were related to the war on drugs or mental health?
I don't know. Call up all the police departments. I'm sure they'll be more than happy to give you the information so you can crunch the numbers yourself.
Perhaps you should look at the cities' metro area and get back to me. Chicago metro, for example, jumps to about 1,200. Multiply all those by two or three and you'll be close.
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