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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old December 16 2012, 07:10 AM   #16
NicholasM79
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

I'm sorry, but how do we know that? I think we've just all gotten accustomed to it being possibly wrong on reruns and home video. I would be sure to say that the music changes from year to year, even on an ID like that.

And here is something that makes this a home video phenomenon. On the 2nd season Mission: Impossible DVDs, the 5.1 track has the 1966 recording of the fanfare on episodes from the second half of the season. But if you switch to the 2.0 mono track, the revised recording that I linked to is there. So I'm more inclined to think that the second recording was used on all Desilu/Paramount shows in the 1967-1968 season.
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Old December 16 2012, 07:17 AM   #17
ClassicTVMan81
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

NicholasM79 wrote: View Post
I'm sorry, but how do we know that? I think we've just all gotten accustomed to it being possibly wrong on reruns and home video. I would be sure to say that the music changes from year to year, even on an ID like that.

And here is something that makes this a home video phenomenon. On the 2nd season Mission: Impossible DVDs, the 5.1 track has the 1966 recording of the fanfare on episodes from the second half of the season. But if you switch to the 2.0 mono track, the revised recording that I linked to is there. So I'm more inclined to think that the second recording was used on all Desilu/Paramount shows in the 1967-1968 season.
I wonder how it would have sounded on the 16mm prints (before VHS was commonplace)?

~Ben
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Old December 16 2012, 06:39 PM   #18
Dalen Quaice
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

As luck has it, I have around dozen episodes in my 16mm collection.

Unfortunately, the Paramount and/or Desilu logo is cut from all of my 2nd season episodes if I recall correctly. However, I will pay attention to these the next time I get a chance to screen my films. I MAY have it, because I'm almost 100% certain I've seen Nicholas's version of the 1968 logo with the Desilu music before. I have not found it on any of the official Paramount tapes yet. It could be on the first 5 Volume set released in 1980 called "Television Classics" -- as these were earlier film transfers than the 83-84 transfer.

I also have a number of 16mm "film chain recordings" on video tape from the very early 80's right before the switch to distribution on video. Often times, the end credits were cut early on these as I recall.

As a matter of historical fact: The sale of Desilu to Paramount was official on July 28, 1967 -- all 1967 episodes, starting with "Mirror, Mirror" should have a Copyright (c) MCMLXVII by Paramount Pictures and Norway Corporation underneath. Norway was, of course, Gene Roddenberry's production company and is always present on the correct logos AFTER 1966. The 1966 Desilu logo had no copyright originally-- which actually caused all episodes prior to "Mirror, Mirror" to go into public domain until they were reclaimed by Paramount in 1978 when the Copyright Act of 1976 went into effect. Hince, the 1978 copyright was added to earlier episodes.

All 3rd season episodes for certain should have the zoom in style Paramount Television logo with the orange/yellow background -- this logo should not be on any other season other than the 3rd -- the music was recorded by Wilbur Hatch after the 2nd season had aired. Therefore, it couldn't have been on any 2nd season episode.

All 1968 episodes of the 2nd season should have the Paramount logo with the Desilu music -- that should be (latest to earliest): Assignment: Earth, Bread and Circuses, The Ultimate Computer, The Omega Glory, By Any Other Name, Patterns of Force, Return to Tomorrow, A Private Little War, The Immunity Syndrome, A Piece of the Action, and The Gamesters of Triskelion.

All 1967 episodes AFTER the sale of Desilu should have the Desilu logo with the Paramount and Norway byline as mentioned above: The Trouble with Tribbles, Wolf in the Fold, Obsession, The Deadly Years, Friday's Child, Journey to Babel, Metamorphosis, I, Mudd, Catspaw, The Doomsday Machine, The Apple, and Mirror Mirror.

The 1966 Desilu logo with no copyright should be on: The Changeling, Who Mourns for Adonais?, and The Amok Time.

Last edited by Dalen Quaice; December 16 2012 at 07:08 PM.
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Old December 24 2012, 10:07 PM   #19
Dalen Quaice
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

I have found some of the 2 episode Columbia House Collector's Edition VHS tapes to review. These are marked Columbia House Video on the spine and say (c) 1991 on the back of the tapes. There are apparently two other issues from Columbia House: CBS Video and RE-TV.

I have 3 tapes: The Galileo Seven + Court Martial from Season 1, Bread & Circuses + The Doomsday Machine from Season 2, and Elaan of Troyius + Spectre Of The Gun from Season 3.

Of interest is that Bread and Circuses is (c) 1968. That's right, it should have the Paramount logo with the Desilu music!
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Old January 7 2013, 06:47 AM   #20
Dalen Quaice
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

Regarding the Galileo Seven in the Collector's Edition - no episode trailers, the transfer is the same as on the black box transporter issue tapes otherwise. The logo at the end is the 1966 Desilu with the 1978 Paramount copyright followed by the 1982 Paramount TV logo.
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Old October 6 2014, 05:10 PM   #21
Dalen Quaice
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

I'm going to revive this old thread because I've just recently acquired, after years of searching, a 16mm copy of "The Immunity Syndrome" with the fabled Paramount rising circle logo and the Desilu music!

It is this logo (not my picture) with the music from the clip I linked to earlier in the thread.

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/847...visionlogo.png
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Old October 6 2014, 10:31 PM   #22
mb22
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

I wonder why the initial Desilu episodes had no copyright notices. The non-aired pilots did:

http://postimg.org/image/57rb1wnpf/

http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/1x...ehdalt1549.jpg
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Old October 6 2014, 11:19 PM   #23
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

It's threads like this that really make me wish we had a truly accurate presentation of the series on Blu-Ray and DVD. All of this information is being lost to time. I'd love to have all the episodes with the correct credits in the first season, logos, network tags and billboards, previews as they were (if the "NEXT WEEK" clips still exist), the truly accurate sound mix included and production company logos intact. True "night of broadcast" prints. I'd be thrilled.
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Old October 7 2014, 12:21 AM   #24
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

Mr. Spook wrote: View Post
It's threads like this that really make me wish we had a truly accurate presentation of the series on Blu-Ray and DVD. All of this information is being lost to time. I'd love to have all the episodes with the correct credits in the first season, logos, network tags and billboards, previews as they were (if the "NEXT WEEK" clips still exist), the truly accurate sound mix included and production company logos intact. True "night of broadcast" prints. I'd be thrilled.
Yeah, tbh I've always thought that the people who create home video releases on TV shows undervalue just how much their target audience wants 'the real thing' as originally broadcast. In the very early days of home video for example, it wasn't uncommon for TV shows (those that got released on video, anyway) to be edited into a single "movie length" presentation, because the distributors figured that on home video as a medium, people were going to watch right through the tape anyway instead of having to wait a week for the next instalment -- which I think was a misunderstanding of the audience's want to have the episodes as presented originally, tops and tails intact, and even ad-caps at the fade outs where applicable.

On the opposing side of the argument however is the issue of broadcast order vs production order. The current tack is to present the episodes in the original broadcast order, so Season One always opens with The Man Trap, etc. Whereas for years, the tapes opted for production order instead, and there are many fans who will defend the production order as the most pure way to present the episodes. So, the issue is very much a two-sided coin.
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Old October 7 2014, 12:44 AM   #25
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

Lance wrote: View Post

On the opposing side of the argument however is the issue of broadcast order vs production order. The current tack is to present the episodes in the original broadcast order, so Season One always opens with The Man Trap, etc. Whereas for years, the tapes opted for production order instead, and there are many fans who will defend the production order as the most pure way to present the episodes. So, the issue is very much a two-sided coin.
I'm sure CBS will sell us an extra special Blu-ray set with the episodes in production order for the 50th Anniversary. All for just $99.95 per season!
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Old October 7 2014, 02:39 AM   #26
erastus25
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

Lance wrote: View Post
Mr. Spook wrote: View Post
It's threads like this that really make me wish we had a truly accurate presentation of the series on Blu-Ray and DVD. All of this information is being lost to time. I'd love to have all the episodes with the correct credits in the first season, logos, network tags and billboards, previews as they were (if the "NEXT WEEK" clips still exist), the truly accurate sound mix included and production company logos intact. True "night of broadcast" prints. I'd be thrilled.
Yeah, tbh I've always thought that the people who create home video releases on TV shows undervalue just how much their target audience wants 'the real thing' as originally broadcast. In the very early days of home video for example, it wasn't uncommon for TV shows (those that got released on video, anyway) to be edited into a single "movie length" presentation, because the distributors figured that on home video as a medium, people were going to watch right through the tape anyway instead of having to wait a week for the next instalment -- which I think was a misunderstanding of the audience's want to have the episodes as presented originally, tops and tails intact, and even ad-caps at the fade outs where applicable.

On the opposing side of the argument however is the issue of broadcast order vs production order. The current tack is to present the episodes in the original broadcast order, so Season One always opens with The Man Trap, etc. Whereas for years, the tapes opted for production order instead, and there are many fans who will defend the production order as the most pure way to present the episodes. So, the issue is very much a two-sided coin.
The Twilight Zone DVD set it very good about maintaining original broadcast integrity. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe they have the original soundtrack in all cases, and also include ad bumpers. The special features are full of promo materials and vintage interviews. It's great.
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Old October 7 2014, 02:40 AM   #27
NicholasM79
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

Dalen Quaice wrote: View Post
I'm going to revive this old thread because I've just recently acquired, after years of searching, a 16mm copy of "The Immunity Syndrome" with the fabled Paramount rising circle logo and the Desilu music!
I'm just curious, was this a syndication print or a NBC print? (I'm guessing the former.)
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Old October 7 2014, 04:08 AM   #28
Lance
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

erastus25 wrote: View Post
Lance wrote: View Post
Mr. Spook wrote: View Post
It's threads like this that really make me wish we had a truly accurate presentation of the series on Blu-Ray and DVD. All of this information is being lost to time. I'd love to have all the episodes with the correct credits in the first season, logos, network tags and billboards, previews as they were (if the "NEXT WEEK" clips still exist), the truly accurate sound mix included and production company logos intact. True "night of broadcast" prints. I'd be thrilled.
Yeah, tbh I've always thought that the people who create home video releases on TV shows undervalue just how much their target audience wants 'the real thing' as originally broadcast. In the very early days of home video for example, it wasn't uncommon for TV shows (those that got released on video, anyway) to be edited into a single "movie length" presentation, because the distributors figured that on home video as a medium, people were going to watch right through the tape anyway instead of having to wait a week for the next instalment -- which I think was a misunderstanding of the audience's want to have the episodes as presented originally, tops and tails intact, and even ad-caps at the fade outs where applicable.
The Twilight Zone DVD set it very good about maintaining original broadcast integrity. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe they have the original soundtrack in all cases, and also include ad bumpers. The special features are full of promo materials and vintage interviews. It's great.
I'm very much a fan of TV shows on DVD including the full ad bumpers and such. Yes, I know they're technically irrelevant, but I love seeing them there all the same for nostalgic reasons (and also because they're one of those things that syndicators tend to chop off, so they're a nice indicator that something is 'complete and intact'). Some episodes of The Real Ghostbusters on DVD included them as well.
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Old October 7 2014, 05:34 AM   #29
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

The only issue with the Twilight Zone DVD and BD release is that they include the Bernard Herrmann theme throughout the entire first season. However, the more famous Marius Constant theme was introduced around 2/3 of the way in. The home video version introduces it in the second season. Unless, of course, it was wrong in syndication and it was corrected for home video....
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Old October 7 2014, 10:23 AM   #30
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Re: Questions about Star Trek VHS Prints

When I bought The Hitch Hiker's Guide To The Galaxy on double VHS back in the day, the first 3 and the second 3 episodes had all been edited back to back, which I found incredibly convenient to watch as it was an ongoing storyline. In fact, throughout the 80's and 90's I would often follow this practise for other serialised television - classic Dr Who, for example. For other TV series (such as Star Trek) this technique is less effective, and it was always a bit of a shame to lose the endcaps of an episode (even though I would invariably fastforward through them).

Fortunately, with "seamless branching" on BluRay it should be possible to have it both ways, right?
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