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Old November 21 2012, 06:23 AM   #16
Itisnotlogical
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Stealing things doesn't make me feel bad because NPC's seem entirely oblivious to everything and anything except specific built-in events related to the main storyline. I can steal every bit of loot from every single NPC in Morrowind, and none of them would do anything. They wouldn't be forced to move out of their house or anything.
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Old November 21 2012, 07:18 AM   #17
Jimi_James
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

No, I don't feel bad about it, because as a well adjusted adult, I can separate reality from things that don't actually exist.

That being said, I usually do two run throughs of most RPG's, such as Mass Effect or Fallout, which have a built in morality system that effects the game depending on how you interact with the world. I play once as a good character and once as an evil character. This way, I experience a variety of game options, typically in games that have some sort of alternate endings or missions depending on the actions you take and choices you make.
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Old November 21 2012, 10:05 AM   #18
Cutter John
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

I don't feel bad. but the logic of walking into strangers houses and rifling through their drawers and breaking their urns and wooden boxes looking for stuff does tend to escape me.


Anyway, I'll just leave this here.

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Old November 21 2012, 02:46 PM   #19
Robert Maxwell
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Jimi_James wrote: View Post
No, I don't feel bad about it, because as a well adjusted adult, I can separate reality from things that don't actually exist.

That being said, I usually do two run throughs of most RPG's, such as Mass Effect or Fallout, which have a built in morality system that effects the game depending on how you interact with the world. I play once as a good character and once as an evil character. This way, I experience a variety of game options, typically in games that have some sort of alternate endings or missions depending on the actions you take and choices you make.
I had fun doing that in the original Deus Ex. After playing through it "normally," that is, trying to do a good job and not kill people needlessly, I did another playthrough where I pretty much slaughtered everyone at the slightest provocation, and stood by and did nothing when innocent people were in danger. It was great having Paul, Alex, and Manderley all chew my ass out for it.
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Old November 21 2012, 03:42 PM   #20
Kelthaz
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

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Old November 25 2012, 02:06 AM   #21
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Thats Funny
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Old November 25 2012, 04:03 AM   #22
TrekNut87
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Nah, not if it would help me throughout my quest. The only time I've been annoyed by it is in Assassin's Creed when you pickpocket someone and they get mad and chase you down. Other than that, it doesn't bother me.
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Old November 26 2012, 12:53 AM   #23
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

I don't feel bad when I steal nor do i feel bad when I sell the shit to the store for gold.
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Old November 26 2012, 01:07 AM   #24
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Nope, in Pokemon I search everyones house for stuff.

What? the game developers put it there for me.

"Hey, I'm in your house stealing your monies."
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Old November 26 2012, 01:16 AM   #25
The Lensman
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Since I'm currently playing a thief in Oblivion, the answer is no. Although I do tend to steal mainly from the wealthy since they have more money and better shit to hock.

When I played Fallout, I played as a good guy, and didn't steal unless in dire straights.
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Old November 26 2012, 04:57 AM   #26
J. Allen
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Oh, mercy no. Apart from rare occasions, I almost always choose the most evil characters to play. It's fun to be the villain!
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Old November 26 2012, 01:09 PM   #27
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Smellincoffee wrote: View Post
KOTOR was different, though, and I felt a bit squeamish the first time I looted a corpse. And then once I burgled every single apartment in an entire complex, but I didn't feel guilty until I entered a room with someone in it, and she told me to leave or die. I think I threw a grenade at her.
I'm currently playing KOTOR for the first time and when I broke into an apartment on Taris and found a family with a little girl cowering behind the furniture, begging me to take their things and go without hurting them, I was a little taken aback. I wanted to play as a mostly good guy and robbing them just didn't seem right. But I robbed them anyway because this is an RPG and looting is expected of me.

That's one of my problems with RPGs, looting is such an intrinsic part of the experience that they shove it into pretty much every RPG regardless of whether it makes sense or not. In Fallout it makes some sense, it's a post-apocalyptic world so it's not unreasonable to expect to find valuable items lost in the rubble. But in games like KOTOR where there's a functioning society and a vibrant economy, things shouldn't be so dependent on looting. You should perform tasks to earn money to buy weapons, that makes the most sense in that sort of setting. But when the Mass Effect games started moving in that direction, some people started complaining that those games weren't true RPGs any more. Because apparently to some people role-playing isn't about playing a role and shaping the story, it's about looting and equipping fractionally better items.
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Old November 26 2012, 03:41 PM   #28
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

TheGodBen wrote: View Post
But when the Mass Effect games started moving in that direction, some people started complaining that those games weren't true RPGs any more. Because apparently to some people role-playing isn't about playing a role and shaping the story, it's about looting and equipping fractionally better items.
I love it in ME2 when you're berating those two looters in the Omega quarantine district on the way to Mordin, and yet you've been looting every other apartment you come across yourself.
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Old November 26 2012, 04:36 PM   #29
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

TheGodBen wrote: View Post
Smellincoffee wrote: View Post
KOTOR was different, though, and I felt a bit squeamish the first time I looted a corpse. And then once I burgled every single apartment in an entire complex, but I didn't feel guilty until I entered a room with someone in it, and she told me to leave or die. I think I threw a grenade at her.
I'm currently playing KOTOR for the first time and when I broke into an apartment on Taris and found a family with a little girl cowering behind the furniture, begging me to take their things and go without hurting them, I was a little taken aback. I wanted to play as a mostly good guy and robbing them just didn't seem right. But I robbed them anyway because this is an RPG and looting is expected of me.

That's one of my problems with RPGs, looting is such an intrinsic part of the experience that they shove it into pretty much every RPG regardless of whether it makes sense or not. In Fallout it makes some sense, it's a post-apocalyptic world so it's not unreasonable to expect to find valuable items lost in the rubble. But in games like KOTOR where there's a functioning society and a vibrant economy, things shouldn't be so dependent on looting. You should perform tasks to earn money to buy weapons, that makes the most sense in that sort of setting. But when the Mass Effect games started moving in that direction, some people started complaining that those games weren't true RPGs any more. Because apparently to some people role-playing isn't about playing a role and shaping the story, it's about looting and equipping fractionally better items.
Although the Diablo series didn't invent this, I would say it perfected that particular paradigm, and a lot of Western RPGs (perhaps even most) have mimicked its equipment model to some degree. Kill creatures, get loot, kill creatures, get loot, get a rare drop, equip it, kill more powerful creatures, get loot, etc. etc. It can be a lot of fun if done well, perhaps due to its highly Skinnerian design, but it is a bit too prevalent for my tastes.

Games where you loot houses instead of monsters are basically doing the same thing but with a slightly different mechanism. Instead of killing creatures to get loot, you raid people's houses, forcing you to go from town to town in search of better gear laying around people's homes, or at least junk that's of no use but that you can sell for cash (and use to buy better gear.)
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Old November 28 2012, 03:04 PM   #30
TheGodBen
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Re: Do you feel bad when you steal their things?

Evil Twin wrote: View Post
I love it in ME2 when you're berating those two looters in the Omega quarantine district on the way to Mordin, and yet you've been looting every other apartment you come across yourself.
Even better is the man and woman that are hiding in their apartment from the looters, and after assuring them that I was a good guy on a mission to cure the plague, I stole several thousand credits from their safe.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Although the Diablo series didn't invent this, I would say it perfected that particular paradigm, and a lot of Western RPGs (perhaps even most) have mimicked its equipment model to some degree. Kill creatures, get loot, kill creatures, get loot, get a rare drop, equip it, kill more powerful creatures, get loot, etc. etc. It can be a lot of fun if done well, perhaps due to its highly Skinnerian design, but it is a bit too prevalent for my tastes.

Games where you loot houses instead of monsters are basically doing the same thing but with a slightly different mechanism. Instead of killing creatures to get loot, you raid people's houses, forcing you to go from town to town in search of better gear laying around people's homes, or at least junk that's of no use but that you can sell for cash (and use to buy better gear.)
That sort of loot mechanic makes sense in the Diablo games because it's a dungeon-crawler, most of your weapons and items are going to have to come from looting. And in a game like Skyrim where you're pretty much able to do what you want, it makes sense to have the option to rob houses and stuff like that. But in Mass Effect, where I'm playing as a military officer/special agent on a vital mission to save galactic civilisation, why am I reduced to looting weapons and armour from bandits operating out of a prefab on a deserted world? It just doesn't make sense for that story.

ME2 and ME3 reduced the reliance on looting items and forced you to pay for weapon upgrades, but as Evil Twin pointed out, you're still forced to loot credits during missions to afford most of the stuff. The fact that Commander Shepard steals millions of credits from safes and it doesn't have any impact on the game's morality system is weird. Now I'm finding the same problem with KOTOR. Bastila will moan at me about the lure of the dark side if I'm rude to someone during a conversation, but if I steal 200 credits from someone's footlocker she doesn't say a thing.
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