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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old November 26 2012, 07:52 PM   #421
cbspock
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Elaan battle music cue is awesome, I always loved that particular score. Poor Enterprise getting hammered. My other favorite score is Paradise Syndrome, the opening cue is among my favorites.


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Old November 26 2012, 07:52 PM   #422
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Indysolo wrote: View Post
I love The Enemy Within! Before I had the audio, I was sent scans of all of the documentation and I choked up when I saw the boxes for this score.
Neil, I just listened to the podcast at On the Score (http://www.filmmusicmag.com/?p=10295). I loved hearing you guys all talk about what an emotional thing this was (is) for you. Nice to know it's not just me.
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Old November 26 2012, 08:01 PM   #423
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Star Trek sound effects, interesting little interviews..using music just like the original series..

http://www.synthtopia.com/content/20...-sound-design/
http://designingsound.org/2009/09/be...tar-trek-2009/
http://vimeo.com/7427750


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Old November 26 2012, 08:21 PM   #424
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

It would also be great to get the "trek style" music from the animated series next

-Chris
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Old November 26 2012, 08:54 PM   #425
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

cbspock wrote: View Post
It would also be great to get the "trek style" music from the animated series next

-Chris
I'd love to be proven wrong, but my understanding is that those tapes no longer exist.

This isn't a bad runner-up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p03jG546GQc

There's also this http://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Anim.../dp/B008JEQP7Q
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Old November 26 2012, 10:15 PM   #426
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Season 2, Disc 4 listing is out:

SEASON 2, DISC 4

Metamorphosis
Music Composed and Conducted by George Duning
Episode #31, Recorded 6/28/67
Aired #38, 11/10/67

1. Shuttlecraft/Shuttle Helpless M11/M12 2:09
2. The Planetoid/Most Unusual M13/M14 1:15
3. Cochrane* M15 1:35
4. Looks Familiar M21 0:50
5. Companion*/Still Alive M22+M22X/M23 0:42
6. Zefram/Nancy Flips* M24/M25 1:14
7. You’ve Got It/Angry Companion* M26/M27–30+M27–30X 1:12
8. Cochrane Calls M31+M31X 2:14
9. Spock OK/Judas Goat M32/M33/M33A 2:06
10. Mad Companion* M34+M34X 1:36
11. Starship*/Scott Anxious M41 tk 3/M42 0:37
12. Transition*/Companion Talks/Kirk Frustrated M43/M44/M44A 4:22
13. Cochrane Angry/Spock Puzzled/Nancy Sobs* M45/M46–50/M51 1:11
14. Kirk Pleads/New Nancy M52+M52X/M53 3:06
15. It’s Her/Loveliness M54/M55–60 2:57
16. You Loved Me M61 1:45
17. Cochrane’s Decision* M62 1:11

Total Time: 30:36

*Contains “Theme From Star Trek (TV Series)” by Alexander Courage and Gene Roddenberry

Return to Tomorrow
Music Composed and Conducted by George Duning
Episode #51, Recorded 12/29/67
Aired #49, 2/9/68

18. The Voice* M12 1:07
19. Who Are You/The Globes* M15/M21 1:20
20. Sargon Transfers/Sargon Requests M22/M23 2:23
21. Thalassa/Kirk Returns M24/M31 1:14
22. Kirk’s Philosophy* M32 0:57
23. Ready Sargon M33 0:52
24. Thalassa Recalls M34–40 1:53
25. Henoch†/I Remember M41/M44 1:13
26. Thalassa Worried†/Nurse Puzzled†/Thalassa Concerned/Thalassa Pleads M45/M45A/M46/M51 2:33
27. Sargon Inert† M52 0:56
28. Nurse Chapel*/Spock Alive M55–60/M63 1:34
29. Last Moments* M64 1:41

Total Time: 18:09

*Contains “Theme From Star Trek (TV Series)” by Alexander Courage and Gene Roddenberry
†Contains “Blackship Theme” Composed by Fred Steiner

Patterns of Force
Music Composed and Conducted by George Duning
Episode #52, Recorded 12/29/67 (With “Return to Tomorrow”)
Aired #50, 2/16/68

30. Military Mite (Nazi March) M10 tk 1 1:41
31. Military Mite (Nazi March) (soft version) M10 tk 2 1:17
32. Military Mite (Nazi March) (10 bars, soft opening) M10 tk 3 0:24
33. Military Mite (Nazi March) (10 bars, hard opening) M10 tk 4 0:26
34. Military Mite (Nazi March) (6 bars, long ending) M10 tk 5 0:14
35. Military Mite (Nazi March) (6 bars, short ending) M10 tk 6 0:14
36. Military Mite (Nazi March) (horn motive) M10 tk 7 0:08
37. Military Mite (Nazi March) (horn theme) M10 tk 9 0:14
38. Military Mite (Nazi March) (percussion only) M10 tk 10 1:42

Total Time: 6:35


The Apple
Unused Percussion Tracks
Composed and Conducted by Gerald Fried
Episode #38, Recorded 7/10/67 (With “Friday’s Child”)
Aired #34, 10/13/67

39. M1 tk 1 1:35
40. M2 tk 1 0:59
41. M3 tk 2 0:20
42. M4 tk 1 1:33
43. M5 tk 1 1:02
44. M6 tk 1 0:20

Total Time: 5:59


Wolf in the Fold
Unused Belly Dancer Music
Composed and Conducted by Gerald Fried
Episode #36, Recorded 7/19/67 (With “Amok Time”)
Aired #43, 12/22/67

45. Navel Maneuvers M1/M1A 3:05

Total Disc Time: 64:51
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Old November 26 2012, 10:30 PM   #427
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Now this is interesting. Unused belly dancer music for Wolf in the Fold (Navel Maneuvers.. love the title).

And some unused percussion from The Apple? Interesting.

And George Dunning quoting Fred Steiner.
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Old November 26 2012, 11:05 PM   #428
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

All of Disc 4 is unreleased material, unless you count the preview release of "It's Her" on the TrekCore site. And this answers my question about "Patterns of Force." The Nazi march was a new Duning composition after all.

I'm really looking forward to having "Metamorphosis" and "Return to Tomorrow" at last. Duning did great work, but only his third-season scores have ever had any kind of release. And Duning was an alumnus of the Cincinnati Conservatory of Music (now the University of Cincinnati's College Conservatory of Music), which my father also attended, though not at the same time.

Intriguing that we now have two unused cues that were replaced with "Vina's Dance" -- the Wilbur Hatch pre-recorded piece that was used on set, and now this Fried cue for Kara's belly dance. I wonder why they didn't use this one. Should be interesting to hear.

So Disc 5 should be "Tribbles" (our first taste of the underused Jerry Fielding), "I, Mudd" (my least favorite score), the Courage library cues, and whatever other unused or library bits are outstanding.
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Old November 27 2012, 12:06 AM   #429
Kamdan
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Tallguy wrote: View Post
cbspock wrote: View Post
It would also be great to get the "trek style" music from the animated series next

-Chris
I'd love to be proven wrong, but my understanding is that those tapes no longer exist.

This isn't a bad runner-up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p03jG546GQc

There's also this http://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Anim.../dp/B008JEQP7Q
They'd have to have the tapes to make a 5.1 audio track, which is where the YouTube video ripped the tracks from.
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Old November 27 2012, 12:13 AM   #430
doubleohfive
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Kamdan wrote: View Post
Tallguy wrote: View Post
cbspock wrote: View Post
It would also be great to get the "trek style" music from the animated series next

-Chris
I'd love to be proven wrong, but my understanding is that those tapes no longer exist.

This isn't a bad runner-up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p03jG546GQc

There's also this http://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Anim.../dp/B008JEQP7Q
They'd have to have the tapes to make a 5.1 audio track, which is where the YouTube video ripped the tracks from.
Isn't this YouTube video the same one that was part of someone's pet project in the TOS forum a few years ago to try and isolate some of the TAS soundtracks? *runs off to research...*
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Old November 27 2012, 12:22 AM   #431
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

ACE wrote: View Post
Season 2, Disc 4 listing is out:

SEASON 2, DISC 4

Metamorphosis
Music Composed and Conducted by George Duning
Episode #31, Recorded 6/28/67
Aired #38, 11/10/67

1. Shuttlecraft/Shuttle Helpless M11/M12 2:09
2. The Planetoid/Most Unusual M13/M14 1:15
3. Cochrane* M15 1:35
4. Looks Familiar M21 0:50
5. Companion*/Still Alive M22+M22X/M23 0:42
6. Zefram/Nancy Flips* M24/M25 1:14
7. You’ve Got It/Angry Companion* M26/M27–30+M27–30X 1:12
8. Cochrane Calls M31+M31X 2:14
9. Spock OK/Judas Goat M32/M33/M33A 2:06
10. Mad Companion* M34+M34X 1:36
11. Starship*/Scott Anxious M41 tk 3/M42 0:37
12. Transition*/Companion Talks/Kirk Frustrated M43/M44/M44A 4:22
13. Cochrane Angry/Spock Puzzled/Nancy Sobs* M45/M46–50/M51 1:11
14. Kirk Pleads/New Nancy M52+M52X/M53 3:06
15. It’s Her/Loveliness M54/M55–60 2:57
16. You Loved Me M61 1:45
17. Cochrane’s Decision* M62 1:11

Total Time: 30:36

*Contains “Theme From Star Trek (TV Series)” by Alexander Courage and Gene Roddenberry

Return to Tomorrow
Music Composed and Conducted by George Duning
Episode #51, Recorded 12/29/67
Aired #49, 2/9/68

18. The Voice* M12 1:07
19. Who Are You/The Globes* M15/M21 1:20
20. Sargon Transfers/Sargon Requests M22/M23 2:23
21. Thalassa/Kirk Returns M24/M31 1:14
22. Kirk’s Philosophy* M32 0:57
23. Ready Sargon M33 0:52
24. Thalassa Recalls M34–40 1:53
25. Henoch†/I Remember M41/M44 1:13
26. Thalassa Worried†/Nurse Puzzled†/Thalassa Concerned/Thalassa Pleads M45/M45A/M46/M51 2:33
27. Sargon Inert† M52 0:56
28. Nurse Chapel*/Spock Alive M55–60/M63 1:34
29. Last Moments* M64 1:41

Total Time: 18:09

*Contains “Theme From Star Trek (TV Series)” by Alexander Courage and Gene Roddenberry
†Contains “Blackship Theme” Composed by Fred Steiner

Patterns of Force
Music Composed and Conducted by George Duning
Episode #52, Recorded 12/29/67 (With “Return to Tomorrow”)
Aired #50, 2/16/68

30. Military Mite (Nazi March) M10 tk 1 1:41
31. Military Mite (Nazi March) (soft version) M10 tk 2 1:17
32. Military Mite (Nazi March) (10 bars, soft opening) M10 tk 3 0:24
33. Military Mite (Nazi March) (10 bars, hard opening) M10 tk 4 0:26
34. Military Mite (Nazi March) (6 bars, long ending) M10 tk 5 0:14
35. Military Mite (Nazi March) (6 bars, short ending) M10 tk 6 0:14
36. Military Mite (Nazi March) (horn motive) M10 tk 7 0:08
37. Military Mite (Nazi March) (horn theme) M10 tk 9 0:14
38. Military Mite (Nazi March) (percussion only) M10 tk 10 1:42

Total Time: 6:35


The Apple
Unused Percussion Tracks
Composed and Conducted by Gerald Fried
Episode #38, Recorded 7/10/67 (With “Friday’s Child”)
Aired #34, 10/13/67

39. M1 tk 1 1:35
40. M2 tk 1 0:59
41. M3 tk 2 0:20
42. M4 tk 1 1:33
43. M5 tk 1 1:02
44. M6 tk 1 0:20

Total Time: 5:59


Wolf in the Fold
Unused Belly Dancer Music
Composed and Conducted by Gerald Fried
Episode #36, Recorded 7/19/67 (With “Amok Time”)
Aired #43, 12/22/67

45. Navel Maneuvers M1/M1A 3:05

Total Disc Time: 64:51
Grinning from ear to ear over this list!!!
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Old November 27 2012, 12:38 AM   #432
JimZipCode
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Indysolo wrote: View Post
SEASON 2, DISC 2

Amok Time
Music Composed and Conducted by Gerald Fried

The Doomsday Machine
Music Composed and Conducted by Sol Kaplan

Total Disc Time: 64:45
Welcome to most fans' favorite disc. Heck, will probably wind up being mine again, after the intoxication of the new music has worn off. Say six months down the road or so.

I'm surprised this one would be put together, since it so directly competes with the existing GNP Crescendo disc. The first disc with the two pilots I understand, it's inevitable for that one to be made. But this one was not inevitable.

How does the total run time compare with the old one? (Don't have my copy with me here)
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Old November 27 2012, 01:04 AM   #433
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

I meant to remark before that this strikes me as odd:
ACE wrote: View Post
Return to Tomorrow
Music Composed and Conducted by George Duning
...
†Contains “Blackship Theme” Composed by Fred Steiner
What's called "Blackship Theme" here and in "Mirror, Mirror" is the same melody that was called "Romulan Theme" in "Balance of Terror." So shouldn't this say "Contains 'Romulan Theme' Composed by Fred Steiner" instead, since that's the original source of the melody?


JimZipCode wrote: View Post
I'm surprised this one would be put together, since it so directly competes with the existing GNP Crescendo disc. The first disc with the two pilots I understand, it's inevitable for that one to be made. But this one was not inevitable.

How does the total run time compare with the old one? (Don't have my copy with me here)
See my post right after the one you quoted -- I list the cues that were not included on the GNP release, as well as covering the numerous typos on that album's track list. This version is both substantially more complete and more accurate than the previous one.

And somewhere in this thread, there's a link to a podcast interview with the box set's producers, and they explain how they came to an understanding with GNP about the set, convincing them how important it was that it be complete. Apparently this is a joint release between La-La Land and GNP, which I assume means that GNP gets a cut of the profits.
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Old November 27 2012, 03:07 AM   #434
JimZipCode
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

Christopher wrote: View Post
See my post right after the one you quoted -- I list the cues that were not included on the GNP release, as well as covering the numerous typos on that album's track list. This version is both substantially more complete and more accurate than the previous one.
Yeah, I had read that. I was just looking for a bottom-line on how many more minutes of run-time it all added up to. I'll take a look at my GNP disc when I get home.


Christopher wrote: View Post
I meant to remark before that this strikes me as odd:
...
What's called "Blackship Theme" here and in "Mirror, Mirror" is the same melody that was called "Romulan Theme" in "Balance of Terror." So shouldn't this say "Contains 'Romulan Theme' Composed by Fred Steiner" instead, since that's the original source of the melody?
Steiner himself quoted his "Romulan Theme" when he wrote "Black Ship Theme", but he doesn't need to attribute it since it's his own work. What work Duning cites, I guess depends on which work Duning is quoting. He seems to think he's quoting "Black Ship Theme", so I don't see why that doesn't answer the question. My assumption here is that the note shown ("contains theme by Steiner") was not something added by the producers of the collection, but instead was actually taken from the original manuscripts of the music. We know the guys who worked on the collection referenced the actual manuscripts
(how fucking cool is that, by the way!?!?!)
and used the info to correct cue titles etc. It makes sense that they would take this other info from the 'script. Note that the track listing for Mirror Mirror does not say "contains Romulan Theme from" etc. The "Mace Fight" track on the Catspaw listing (#15) does not say that it contains a theme from the Amok Time score, though to our ears it clearly does (from the TrekCore track previews). But the flybys that use Courage's Enterprise theme do contain that note.

The composers re-purpose their own material freely, but scrupulously note where they interpolate a colleague's work. Makes total sense.

It makes sense to me that Duning would quote from the same season's music, given a choice; that also may have avoided possible issues around using music written for a prior season. It also seems probable that, if producers showed him scores as reference, the scores from that same season would be closest to hand. Could it be that Duning never heard the season 1 music, so did not know that the melody had a longer "pedigree"? If he did know, he may have chosen to reference Steiner's most recent, presumably most fully-worked-out version of the music, rather than an earlier version.

There are differences btw "Romulan Theme" and "Black Ship Theme", at least in terms of the development. So maybe Duning really is quoting one over the other.

Y'know what is interesting is, Duning quotes the Amok Time score a couple times in s3. In the Truth No Beauty score, he uses a Vulcan theme in the bookend transporter room scenes, as a motif for Spock. In the Empath, he uses a descending theme from that same score when McCoy hypo's Spock. So first, when we see the track listings, I would expect to see those noted. And second – does that mean Duning knew Fried's score from Amok Time, was a fan of the episode even, and made it a point to reference that music?? Or does it just mean that some producer told him there was a Vulcan theme available to re-use?

Christopher wrote: View Post
there's a link to a podcast interview with the box set's producers, and they explain how they came to an understanding with GNP about the set, convincing them how important it was that it be complete. Apparently this is a joint release between La-La Land and GNP, which I assume means that GNP gets a cut of the profits.
Yeah, I listened to that quite greedily this afternoon. Wonderful, informative. I loved the notes about the people who contacted Bond, independently, to provide previously-unknown info, like the interviews from the Library of Congress project.

The La-la land people have been very specific from the get-go, about the level of cooperation from all the relevant companies, including GNP. I guess what I am specifically wondering, is if those two scores were paired on one CD with the idea that, sometime in the future, it might be issued as a stand-alone release. Either by La-la or by GNP. It seemed weird otherwise, to pair re-create GNP's disc. They didn't do that with Shore Leave & Naked Time, so why with these two?
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Old November 27 2012, 04:25 AM   #435
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Re: La-La Land to release 15-disc original series score set

JimZipCode wrote: View Post
The "Mace Fight" track on the Catspaw listing (#15) does not say that it contains a theme from the Amok Time score, though to our ears it clearly does (from the TrekCore track previews).
Other way around. "Catspaw" was scored a month before "Amok Time" -- and I'm fairly certain the motif you're talking about was also in the "Friday's Child" score in between them, so "Amok" was actually the third place it was used. I've always thought of it as just a generic motif that Fried kept coming back to in season 2. Steiner had one or two nonspecific motifs he used in multiple episodes too.

Otherwise, I take your point; I can see why Duning, who did no first-season scores, might've been unaware of the original name of the motif. But in the context of this encyclopedic, meticulous, historically important collection, it just feels it would be more appropriate to attribute the original title of the theme.


There are differences btw "Romulan Theme" and "Black Ship Theme", at least in terms of the development. So maybe Duning really is quoting one over the other.
I'm not as familiar with the "Return to Tomorrow" score as some others, but I don't think Duning used more than a few bars of the theme at a time, not enough for the differences in development to come into play.


Y'know what is interesting is, Duning quotes the Amok Time score a couple times in s3.
Yes, I've been aware of that for a long time. I loved what he did with it in "The Empath." Before, he'd only quoted the first two bars of the melody, but in "Empath" he continued it further (the descending theme you note came right after the motif Duning had previously quoted -- and I believe it was immediately followed in that "Amok Time" cue by the multi-episode Fried motif we were discussing earlier).


And second – does that mean Duning knew Fried's score from Amok Time, was a fan of the episode even, and made it a point to reference that music?? Or does it just mean that some producer told him there was a Vulcan theme available to re-use?
Between that and the "Blackship Theme" for Henoch, I'd say that Duning just saw it as part of his job to review what the other composers were doing and pick out relevant motifs. Perhaps he chose "Blackship" for Henoch because it was associated with an evil/altered Spock, and then picked out a bit of the "Amok Time" theme as a general Spock motif.


The La-la land people have been very specific from the get-go, about the level of cooperation from all the relevant companies, including GNP. I guess what I am specifically wondering, is if those two scores were paired on one CD with the idea that, sometime in the future, it might be issued as a stand-alone release. Either by La-la or by GNP. It seemed weird otherwise, to pair re-create GNP's disc. They didn't do that with Shore Leave & Naked Time, so why with these two?
In comparing the new releases to the older ones, I find that some of the old ones have at least some of the episodes arranged in the order the scores were recorded. For instance, The Best of Star Trek Volume 2 has "The Corbomite Maneuver," "Balance of Terror," and "What Are Little Girls Made Of?" in that order, and it turns out those three were recorded together in a single session in that order. "Amok" and "Doomsday" were recorded consecutively, which might be why they were paired on both discs. Or maybe it's just coincidence.
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