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Old November 23 2012, 03:27 PM   #601
blssdwlf
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
Where I beg to differ is your criticism of "new" Trek lingo for TOS lingo. I think it's safe to assume that in TOS, too, it's some kind of "plasma" that runs through the tubes to the warp nacelles, though it has not been explicitly mentioned in TOS.
Or it could be something other than plasma powers their circuits. We'll have to agree to disagree here.

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
With your kind of reasoning, "nuclear fusion" would be a no-no, too, as it had never been mentioned in TOS (but since cracked lithium is a vital component of a nuclear fusion reactor, we can safely assume that Delta Vega mining station produces materials essential for nuclear fusion).
Technically, the Constellation's impulse engines would create a "fusion explosion" when overloaded in "The Doomsday Machine". "Thermonuclear" missiles were used against the Enterprise in "Patterns of Force". I think it is pretty safe to say nuclear fusion technology exists in TOS.

What Delta Vega produced we have no idea other than it was a Lithium cracking station. You can safely assume it cracked lithium for ore ships to pick up. You can safely assume that some of its power packs can be modified for use on the Enterprise's warp engines. But I don't agree you can safely assume that it produces materials essential for nuclear fusion... lithium for the warp engines, yes, but nuclear power, not enough evidence.

I am curious though, how did you arrange the 22 decks (minimum) of the ENT Defiant?

Last edited by blssdwlf; November 23 2012 at 03:58 PM.
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Old November 23 2012, 06:04 PM   #602
Albertese
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post

...

I would like to publish these in a separate thread (as recommended by Peter Chung) but I'm not yet allowed to post attachements. I can probably PM them, but of course won't do so uninvited.

...

Bob
Hey, feel free to PM me! I love seeing people's takes on the Enterprise's interior layout!

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Old November 24 2012, 01:27 AM   #603
Robert Comsol
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

blssdwlf wrote: View Post
"But I don't agree you can safely assume that it produces materials essential for nuclear fusion... lithium for the warp engines, yes, but nuclear power, not enough evidence."
In our real life approach towards nuclear fusion reactors that work nuclear scientists consider "cracked lithium" would be an essential ingredient. This is not science fiction, but science fact. I'm simply amazed that back in 1965 the producers of Star Trek became aware of it and put it into the show. Admittedly it somehow transformed from a real nuclear fusion reactor ingredient to lithium in "Mudd's Women" and finally dilithium, so the original science fact intention got confused and eventually lost.

blssdwlf wrote: View Post
"I am curious though, how did you arrange the 22 decks (minimum) of the ENT Defiant?"
Obviously the scriptwriters didn't show up for their FJ detox as this would be a deck below the Hangar Deck according to the FJ plans. But since this statement comes from a blue alien slave of the Gorn, these scavengers have apparently interpreted the deck arrangement of the ship differently than an original crew member of the Defiant would have.

Bob
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Old November 24 2012, 01:38 AM   #604
Robert Comsol
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Albertese wrote: View Post
"Hey, feel free to PM me! I love seeing people's takes on the Enterprise's interior layout!"
Wilco! My friend still has to make PDF conversions of engineering decks 14, 13 and I'm currently adding text and comments to deck 12. Decks 11, 10, 9 and 8 will follow next week.
But can someone please tell me (C. Höhne Sparborth hasn't replied yet) what rank I need to achieve to be allowed to post attachements?

Bob

P.S. Will I be allowed to post a PDF attachement in a PM?
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Old November 24 2012, 04:18 AM   #605
blssdwlf
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
blssdwlf wrote: View Post
"But I don't agree you can safely assume that it produces materials essential for nuclear fusion... lithium for the warp engines, yes, but nuclear power, not enough evidence."
In our real life approach towards nuclear fusion reactors that work nuclear scientists consider "cracked lithium" would be an essential ingredient. This is not science fiction, but science fact. I'm simply amazed that back in 1965 the producers of Star Trek became aware of it and put it into the show. Admittedly it somehow transformed from a real nuclear fusion reactor ingredient to lithium in "Mudd's Women" and finally dilithium, so the original science fact intention got confused and eventually lost.
Yes, it is amazing some of the things TOS incorporated in... however, lithium used in fusion reactions is of the natural metal variety which in TOS lithium is referenced in it's fictional crystal form which is why don't believe it an easy assumption that the Delta Vega station was meant for nuclear fusion material. TOS for all of it's foresight also developed it's own split from our "real world" physics. Antimatter, for instance, is orders more powerful in TOS than in real life. So, when it comes to applying real world science to TOS in this project, because of WWTTD? setting, I'll let TOS science take precedence over our real world science.

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
blssdwlf wrote: View Post
"I am curious though, how did you arrange the 22 decks (minimum) of the ENT Defiant?"
Obviously the scriptwriters didn't show up for their FJ detox as this would be a deck below the Hangar Deck according to the FJ plans. But since this statement comes from a blue alien slave of the Gorn, these scavengers have apparently interpreted the deck arrangement of the ship differently than an original crew member of the Defiant would have.
Deck 22 according to FJ is 2 decks below the hangar deck, IIRC since FJ layed out a 24 deck ship. In anycase, it sounds like you're just borrowing the visuals from the episode but not the deck layout according to dialogue - which is your prerogative

As to posting images, I'd recommend either getting your own hosting site and link to the images rather than uploading directly to TrekBBS. The reason I recommend this is that if something should happen to this site, your stuff won't go poof with it. You can use free accounts like Flickr, or Imageshack. Also, don't forget about other services like Dropbox, Skydrive, Google's cloud, etc for storing and distributing files.
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Old November 24 2012, 09:16 AM   #606
Mytran
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Also there's photobucket (which I use), but it's all much the same thing - as long as you can link to a jpg file directly (without all the hosting guf).
Robert_Comsol, I had no idea you were trying to post images directly onto the TrekBBS - is that even possible? It certainly explains my confusion at your situation! At 137 posts to your name, you achieved the entitlement to include images in your posts some time ago. And I also would love to see your efforts. The more, the merrier!
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Old November 24 2012, 10:18 PM   #607
Robert Comsol
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Gentlemen,

thanks for your advice and support. Naturally, I'll be looking for feedback for these upcoming deck plan drafts (did I miss something, improvement potential etc.?). Once my friend made PDF-conversions, I'll forward these via PM to those who asked.
My bottom line still says "You may not post attachements".

Bob
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Old November 24 2012, 10:39 PM   #608
Robert Comsol
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

blssdwlf wrote: View Post
"Deck 22 according to FJ is 2 decks below the hangar deck, IIRC since FJ layed out a 24 deck ship. In anycase, it sounds like you're just borrowing the visuals from the episode but not the deck layout according to dialogue - which is your prerogative "
Again, I find this statement of the blue alien slave of Slar, the Gorn (on speed), to be inconclusive at best. I don't know what's going on in a head of this Gorn species, but maybe having different main deck numbers and engineering deck ones was simply too much for his reptile brain, so he told his slaves to number the deck levels in an FJ scheme for their scavenging purposes.

In the audio commentary the producers admitted they had taken several artistic liberties and the aft photon torpedo launcher of the Defiant definitely falls under this category but served the story which is basically "Pirates of the Tholian seas" and instead of cannonballs they used photon torpedos (the infamous "Hornblower Effect", again).

Where I can't seriously disagree is the aft phaser. In "Arena" there is a clear intercom report to the captain that the "aft phaser" of the Enterprise is ready (I assume the ENT production people rewatched the episode because of the Gorn's participation, noticed the "aft phaser" report and then decided to visualize it). Frankly, I always had problems with the window under the stern dome to be the flight deck control room. Once the shuttle reaches the critical landing phase - it disappears from the sight of the flight deck controller.

Now, with this ENT episode it rather looks this is the aft phaser control room which makes more sense, IMHO.

And regarding these energizer / reactor walls on the Defiant in ENT there might be a better explanation. Since the Defiant appears to be a younger ship than Enterprise these walls may simply be the next generation of these energizer / reactors that usually stand around in one of Scotty's engine rooms.

Bob
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Last edited by Robert Comsol; November 25 2012 at 12:29 PM.
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Old November 25 2012, 10:31 AM   #609
Mytran
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Hmm, I don't think I've EVER used the attachment function, come to think of it! I just use URLs to the files I need to refer to in a message. I've searched around and I can't even see an "add attachment" button in the Compose Message box. Anyone else find this?
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Old November 25 2012, 03:09 PM   #610
blssdwlf
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

@Mytran - I just looked and do not see any upload attachment function either. Just the insert URL buttons.

In the User CP there is a Pictures and Albums section where you theoretically could upload images and share them. I haven't tried it yet.

@Robert Comsol - I still recommend using your own image hosting service. Looking forward to seeing your interpretation of the Enterprise in your thread

I have aft phasers in this TOS Enterprise thread but no aft torpedo launchers
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Old November 26 2012, 07:04 AM   #611
B.J.
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Even mine says "You may not post attachments". It's just the way this board is set up. An attachment in this sense is a picture or file uploaded and embedded within the post itself, not the same thing as showing a picture inline from another source. As others have said, it's easy to link to other places like Photobucket.
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Old November 26 2012, 07:34 AM   #612
Albertese
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Robert Comsol, I'll tell ya the way I post images... it's quite simple.

Go to http://imageshack.us/ and upload an image file. Once that's uploaded, the next screen that shows up has several links which you can choose from. Choose the "Forum" link and highlight it, copy it, and paste it into the Reply box you type into to make a reply post here on TrekBBS. That's it. When you post it you get the image you uploaded as an inline image in your TrekBBS post. Nothing to it.

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Old November 27 2012, 11:09 PM   #613
Robert Comsol
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Location: USS Berlin
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Many thanks for the good advices. Something is coming up soon, in the meantime may I suggest you check out this gentlemen's 10 minute CGI tour of the TOS Enterprise:

http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.ph...09#post7313209

Bob
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Old November 28 2012, 03:29 AM   #614
blssdwlf
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Fascinating. Thanks for the link!
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Old November 28 2012, 03:03 PM   #615
Mytran
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Location: North Wales
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Interesting vid - shame they had to burn up some of the running time with a repro of the opening credits though!

Also, that final corridor shot (which opens into Kirk's "tall ship" speech) seems not to have been from TOS, but the ENT episode In a Mirror Darkly. The misplacement of the crew quarters set (not to mention a red door) really stood out to a set-obsessive like me!

But overall, very nice.
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