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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old November 23 2012, 12:11 AM   #751
davejames
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

FrontierTrek wrote: View Post

I closed comments for that particular article because it turned into the SAME 3 or 4 posters repeating the same reactionary things over and over again. I have never had to moderate or close comments before, but this is just ridiculous.

.
Agreed. There's nothing wrong with criticism, but it's getting ridiculous seeing the same exact comments repeated over and over.


We get it already. You don't like the S2 effects work.


Your point has been made.
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Old November 23 2012, 01:23 AM   #752
Maxwell Everett
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

NewHorizon wrote: View Post
I tweeted to him about the ruckus on Trekcore and that there were some very unhappy fans. Coincidentally, the comments were shut down around the same time he tweeted his response. Personally, I wish he had said nothing at all as he is basically spinning it and saying we're day dreaming. Yup, if I wasn't buying S2 before I'm definitely not buying it now. If that is what he calls excellent, then I have no hope for the rest of the HTV produced seasons. What a complete cuss up.

New Horizon, if you can't tell these are two completely different shots, with noticeably different camera alignment to the model and lighting... and shot on two completely different film formats (8-perf VistaVision vs. 4-perf Standard 35mm) by two completely different VFX teams... then I seriously question your ability to objectively weigh-in on ANYTHING that comes out of this restoration effort.

You are seriously out of your depth.
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Old November 23 2012, 01:24 AM   #753
NewHorizon
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Jaro Stun wrote: View Post
true, those two look good, especially the shuttlecraft one. nice detail and vivid colors, Thx.
The shuttlecraft scene is mostly live action, which looks fine...however my issues with S2 are clearly evident in that pic too. The stars are low res and the ship in the background looks pasted in, poorly.

Again...same ILM shot, but look at the difference.



To me, it looks like they're trying to preserve the colors from the VHS transfer, because that's how it 'looked' rather than restore the true colors like CBS-D did. HTV went with the neon purples and red. The colors used by CBS-D were far more pleasing to the eye.
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Old November 23 2012, 01:28 AM   #754
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

davejames wrote: View Post
FrontierTrek wrote: View Post

I closed comments for that particular article because it turned into the SAME 3 or 4 posters repeating the same reactionary things over and over again. I have never had to moderate or close comments before, but this is just ridiculous.

.
Agreed. There's nothing wrong with criticism, but it's getting ridiculous seeing the same exact comments repeated over and over.


We get it already. You don't like the S2 effects work.


Your point has been made.
Still comes across as trying to silence those whose opinion doesn't toe the company line.

I showed my wife the comparative shots above, "it looks like shit", was her opinion of the HTV shot. And it's starting to look like season two is going to be a massive step down when comparing it against the quality of season one.
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Old November 23 2012, 01:42 AM   #755
Maxwell Everett
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

BillJ wrote: View Post

Still comes across as trying to silence those whose opinion doesn't toe the company line.
They haven't been silenced. Their opinions are still there for all the world to see, right alongside those who had a favorable opinion of HTV's work. No one's posts have been selectively deleted. By your own logic, you would have to say that those whose opinion DOES "toe the company line" as you put it have been "silenced" exactly as much.
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Old November 23 2012, 01:48 AM   #756
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

M wrote: View Post
It's just you.
Nope. Your both comparison stills even prove more, that I am right and the HD version of the starbase is pretty much the SD image, just with sharpened edges (there are many filters to unblur and sharpen a zoomed image) and a little touch up. But it is definatly not a rescan from original footage. Because it has no additional details compared to the SD image.
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Old November 23 2012, 01:53 AM   #757
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Maxwell Everett wrote: View Post
New Horizon, if you can't tell these are two completely different shots, with noticeably different camera alignment to the model and lighting... and shot on two completely different film formats (8-perf VistaVision vs. 4-perf Standard 35mm) by two completely different VFX teams... then I seriously question your ability to objectively weigh-in on ANYTHING that comes out of this restoration effort.

You are seriously out of your depth.
I am aware they are two different shots, although yesterday at first glance I wasn't.

My point still stands, even that footage could have looked a lot nicer.

Thanks for the info on the equipment used. I certainly defer to your expertise.

I don't think anyone needs to be versed in camera equipment to know they don't care for what they see though...and I don't care for what I see.

The later shot I posted does use the same ILM filmed shot, and the difference is night and day.
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Old November 23 2012, 03:28 AM   #758
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

I look at it this way - my favorite series was ST DS9. This series, in my opinion, was the peak of the ST series. The first two series, TOS and TNG, set the stage for DS9. The last two series, Voyager and Enterprise, were forgettable failures.

I want to see DS9 in HD. How will this come about? With the success of TNG. So, I will buy the seasons sets, and, by doing so, I am investing in an effort to bring DS9 to HD.
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Old November 23 2012, 11:25 AM   #759
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Reeborg wrote: View Post
bullethead wrote: View Post
Seems like the TNG-R team aren't aware of the ruckus caused by the released screencaps:
[URL wrote:
https://twitter.com/MikeOkuda/statuses/271643560586145793[/URL]]
Visual FX in TNG yr 2 by HTV are excellent, very faithful to original, with a hint of extra polish thx to topnotch team. Watch Blus and see!
I wouldn't expect him to say "it's bad work", even if it was true. Would you?
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Old November 23 2012, 03:39 PM   #760
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

The screenshots and trailer look pretty fantastic to me. I can see the difference in contrast and sharpness now that it's pointed out, but otherwise, I probably wouldn't have noticed. Nor would I have noticed that they use the same placement of stars in three separate shots (honestly, who would?). The detail in the Borg cube looks great.
The live action looks as good as expected.

I don't think there's anything to worry about.
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Old November 23 2012, 03:52 PM   #761
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Jaro Stun wrote: View Post
I would be interested how this looks:


It has a nice and vivid colors on DVD cap, I hope it was maintained in HD, and not purposefully washed out like some of the other caps were.
The DVD screencaps on TrekCore are actually contrast and color enhanced (because the source material looked so bad), so that's not a true representation of how it looks on the DVD.

Here is the Blu-Ray still of the same shot:

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Old November 23 2012, 06:13 PM   #762
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

oops. that looks washed out and blurry..... hmm just re-confirms my fears again. anyways, thx for the cap
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Old November 23 2012, 06:17 PM   #763
LOKAI of CHERON
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Jaro Stun wrote: View Post
oops. that looks washed out and blurry..... hmm just re-confirms my fears again. anyways, thx for the cap
Yes, I'm becoming more disappointed by the day.
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Old November 23 2012, 06:25 PM   #764
MickJo1701
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Jaro Stun wrote: View Post
oops. that looks washed out and blurry..... hmm just re-confirms my fears again. anyways, thx for the cap
We've seen CBS D do the very same shot, they are quite similar in quality. The only elements that differ are the bussard collectors, the glow from the illuminated windows and the hull is colourless in the HTV shot. Its not a bad composite at all, just not as good as CBS D's take on it.

It does raise that question again, why spend time and money recreating a shot that has already been re-composited by CBS D?


Last edited by MickJo1701; November 23 2012 at 06:36 PM.
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Old November 23 2012, 07:13 PM   #765
NewHorizon
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

The footage can be ruled out as the culprit. Looks fine in the CBS-D shot.



It does raise that question again, why spend time and money recreating a shot that has already been re-composited by CBS D?
Probably so they wouldn't have to go to the bother of matching the quality and style of Season 1. Everything is blurred and overblown in the HTV shots. HTV has been faithful to the original tapes to a fault, while CBS-D managed to update and modernize the old footage with a surprisingly light hand. I think the original guys on the team wanted to show these 'new kids' up and show them how it's done, but for my money CBS-D showed THEM how it's done. They've taken old footage that could be dodgy (and in HTV's hands continues to be), and made it look like it was made on a much higher budget.

Why HTV chose not to put the original footage in the best light possible is beyond me. I'm not talking about Lucasfilm revisions here, but simply making things clean and crisp rather than simply looking like clearer versions of the old SD broadcast.

I mean, really, tone down the glow so we can see some bloody detail...and stop blurring things to hell HTV.

Last edited by NewHorizon; November 23 2012 at 07:28 PM.
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