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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

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Old October 27 2012, 01:27 AM   #46
diankra
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Technically, Ainley worked with six of the seven classic era Doctors, since he did have scenes with Troughton and Pertwee in The Five Doctors. He also had scenes with Hurndall as well, though I'm not sure of he counts.
Well, the pedantic answer is that Ainley's Master appeared with all of the first seven Doctors, but only had a proper scene/conversation with six of them (he only gets to hold Troughton's Doctor at gunpoint in a crowd scene) and one of those was being played by Richard Hurndall rather than William Hartnell at the time.

So five proper Doctors, plus two more sort-of.
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Old October 27 2012, 03:25 AM   #47
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

diankra wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Technically, Ainley worked with six of the seven classic era Doctors, since he did have scenes with Troughton and Pertwee in The Five Doctors. He also had scenes with Hurndall as well, though I'm not sure of he counts.
Well, the pedantic answer is that Ainley's Master appeared with all of the first seven Doctors, but only had a proper scene/conversation with six of them (he only gets to hold Troughton's Doctor at gunpoint in a crowd scene) and one of those was being played by Richard Hurndall rather than William Hartnell at the time.

So five proper Doctors, plus two more sort-of.
But some, believe that His Nemesis in The War Games was a Prototype for The Master, so, you can almost believe Troughton had dealt with him as well (Pertwee knows Delgado in the First appearance, Right?) and obviously, since Hartnell is First, He went to School with The Master, so....if you stretch Canon, you can justify those other two, IMHO
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Old October 27 2012, 04:36 AM   #48
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

Sindatur wrote: View Post
diankra wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Technically, Ainley worked with six of the seven classic era Doctors, since he did have scenes with Troughton and Pertwee in The Five Doctors. He also had scenes with Hurndall as well, though I'm not sure of he counts.
Well, the pedantic answer is that Ainley's Master appeared with all of the first seven Doctors, but only had a proper scene/conversation with six of them (he only gets to hold Troughton's Doctor at gunpoint in a crowd scene) and one of those was being played by Richard Hurndall rather than William Hartnell at the time.

So five proper Doctors, plus two more sort-of.
But some, believe that His Nemesis in The War Games was a Prototype for The Master, so, you can almost believe Troughton had dealt with him as well (Pertwee knows Delgado in the First appearance, Right?) and obviously, since Hartnell is First, He went to School with The Master, so....if you stretch Canon, you can justify those other two, IMHO
Well, if we're stretching canon (and the earlier post was asking about Master actors working with multiple Doctors so we're stretching topic anyway!)... the Troughton Doctor met the Delgado Master in a book written by a person of this forum... and must have met him for the Master to have a grudge against him when he first turned up during Pertwee's time as mentioned, as you mention, in Terror of the Autons.
But The War Chief from The War Games is not the Master - seeing as Terrance Dicks created the War Chief and co-created the Master and then resurrected the War Chief for one of his books without making him the Master, I think we can take that as definitive!
But it does open up an interesting might-have-been though - Philip Madoc, who played the even nastier War Lord in War Games, did wonder why he wasn't asked back for a rematch, and it would have made a bit of sense to have him return rather than suddenly introducing the Master as this old enemy we'd never seen before. If producer Barry Letts hadn't already had his old friend Roger Delgado in mind to play the new regular villain, then we might perhaps have had Philip Madoc back as the War Lord, "or as he now calls himself, The Master."
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Old November 5 2012, 08:26 PM   #49
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

I loved Simm as the master, he was definately my favourite. But maybe a darker version would work well. The thing is, the master has always been the anti current doctor. For example, the first master was an evil version of Jon Pertwee, the green master/s were just dead corpses, the second actual master was just a copy of the first, but an improved coppy, the third master was basicly the anti Paul McGann, and Simm was the evil David Tennant, and Tennant was a loud and vibrant doctor.

Seeing Smith is not so loud, I thin it would work for Simm to calm down, however I did enjoy the ,adness Simm brought to the role. One thing's for sure, I don't think getting rid of Simm as soon as Tennant leaves is a bad idea.
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Old November 5 2012, 09:22 PM   #50
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

What could possibly be wrong with the Master being blond?

Simm did a great job, I liked his mania, but I'd be happy to have him tone it down too.
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Old November 6 2012, 04:26 AM   #51
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

Same reason James Bond couldn't be blond: it goes against the norm.
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Old November 6 2012, 09:43 AM   #52
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

But James Bond is blond
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Old November 6 2012, 11:24 AM   #53
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

Precisely my point!
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Old November 15 2012, 03:27 AM   #54
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

Cutter John wrote: View Post
I dunno, it seems it would take something quite unusual to happen to allow the Master to return and not the other Timelords. And after what he discovered about his past, would he want to go back to his old universe ruling self?

But damn the story logic. I wouldn't mind seeing him back.
That's kinda where I am. I thought Simm did OK with the character, although I would have liked for him to tone it down a bit. (Hell, I often wanted Tennant to tone it down a bit too.) But at the same time, I feel like it would need to be a REALLY good story for it to be worthwhile to do whatever would need to be done to negate the end of "The End of Time."

DWF wrote: View Post
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The last time he came back from the abyss it was explained away by the line "the timelords resurrected me". That's it. That's all anyone needed.
Hell, even in the classic era whenever it seemed the Master died and he came back it was rarely dwelled on. Usually we just had dialogue like:

Doctor: "I thought you died when [reference to the Master's previous appearance]."
Master: "Obviously not."
Well we never did learn how he survived Planet Of Fire.
I like one theory that it was during his imminent death in "Planet of Fire" that the Time Lords took the Master out of time and recruited him to rescue the Doctor in "The Five Doctors." So, from the Master's perspective, "Planet of Fire" comes before "The Five Doctors," even though it came after it from the Doctor's perspective.

Although, I really loved the handwave from "The Mark of the Rani," when the Master just says, "I'm indestructible. The whole universe knows that." There was this casual charm to Ainley's portrayal (along with a much more devil-may-care attitude towards continuity) that made the Master's unexplained resurrections palatable in those days.

Nowadays, the Time Lock & "The End of Time" are such important parts of continuity that it's a lot harder to undo that sort of thing without a good reason. And the character was also left in such a different place emotionally.

If they were to pull it off at all, I think we would probably need the disconnect of a new actor. (Perhaps test the waters with a female Master. "So, wouldn't that make you 'the Mistress'?" "Too S&M." "Since when were you opposed to sadism?")
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Old November 15 2012, 05:19 AM   #55
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

The Borgified Corpse wrote: View Post
If they were to pull it off at all, I think we would probably need the disconnect of a new actor. (Perhaps test the waters with a female Master. "So, wouldn't that make you 'the Mistress'?" "Too S&M." "Since when were you opposed to sadism?")
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Old November 15 2012, 10:15 AM   #56
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

See trouble is I couldn't help hearing that in my head as River talking!
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Old November 15 2012, 03:46 PM   #57
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

The Borgified Corpse wrote: View Post
If they were to pull it off at all, I think we would probably need the disconnect of a new actor. (Perhaps test the waters with a female Master. "So, wouldn't that make you 'the Mistress'?" "Too S&M." "Since when were you opposed to sadism?")
I don't think there's many women that look good in a Black Mustache and Gautee
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Old November 21 2012, 01:22 PM   #58
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Re: John Simm wants to be the Master again

For the record, I liked it when he was blonde and some blue electric skeliton thingy.
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